Goldminer
JoinedTopics Started by Goldminer
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49
My father will lose his privileges if he attends my sister's wedding
by Goldminer inmy sister is planning on getting married within the next few months.her jw husband committed adultery and left her when their son was 7 weeks old.after getting a scriptural divorce she began a friendship with a "worldly" man and now this friendship has grown to a soon-to-be marriage.
this man studied with the jw's for a while but could see right through them found too many of their teachings didn't make sense so he stopped studying.he's made his stand with my sister and told her she can still attend meetings if she wants to.he's also a good worker and seems to really love the kids.he's not perfect but no worse than many jw husbands.
anyways,the elders pulled my dad aside on tuesday night and told him he could(could????!@#*?
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What is your experience as to buying Crisis of Conscience?
by Goldminer in.
i've read a few very interesting stories about people's experiences when they decided to purchase coc.i'd like to share mine and read yours also.. in 1999,not long after we purchased our first computer i started reading material about jw's.before long,i got really interested in the ray franz story because even up here in northern ontario,i had heard about the apostasy of 1980.in the fall of '99 my wife decide to take a college course(bucking the jw trend),and she would stay at her sister's place during the week.one day i called a christian book store to see if they could get me this book.i was very nervous,changed my name and i wouldn't give them my phone number.i told them i'd call back in a few weeks to make sure they had it before i went in to pick it up.. when the day came,i picked up my courage by two hands and took off for my 40 mile drive to get my book.the book store is located in a small shopping mall,which had me really nervous that another jw might see me going in or out of the store.i walked in the mall looking around,making sure there was nobody in sight that i knew.when i walked in the store,i had cash ready in my hands,walked up to the counter,gave my fake name and the book i was purchasing.now i just had to walk and make it to the car and i was home free.. i know buying a book isn't that hard,i do it all the time,but at that time the implicationsof having this book in my possesion was tremendous.. anyways,it's been 5 1/2 years and still nobody here knows.the book has really opened my eyes and mind to the realities of the wts.i would definitely recommend this book to everyone here who has yet to read it.it's worth the effort to acquire it and will take away your fear of the watchdollar.
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Update to my meeting with an elder
by Goldminer in.
first of all,sorry for being so late with my update.my wife got up at 8 am this morning so i didn't have the opportunity to be alone for a while.. as for the meeting last night,the elder was very civil,actually commended me for writing my questions down.he never made threaths,asked me if i read apostate material or if i still considered myself a jw.. we started with the 607 question.he will not believe any research beyond the wt's but said he'd do more research on it(all wt) so i guess that will go no where.he believes that ctr got it right by using the bible so i told him if it was figured out 130 years ago,it should be very simple to explain today.the only time he looked stunned was when i showed him from the wt that they once believed that jesus' presence began in 1874.he said he had never read that and tried to walk around it even when i asked him if jehovah wanted his people to believe something that wasn't true.. we beat around a few other questions with nothing concrete coming out of it.he did take my list home with him and said he'd look at them more carefully to get some scriptural answers.i also got the feeling that my wife got a spiritual boost from his visit which was very disheartening to me.anyways,i'm going to work on this 607 thing and see how things go.my wife asked me if i felt like we got somewhere and i said no.beibg told that something is the truth just because the wt says so just doesn't convince me anymore.. i'm attaching my questions,hopefully they show up here.thanks everybody,i feel really down,like i'm wasting my time.i've been wanting to run from this religion for years and here i am still fighting to prove my points.. goldminer.
p.s.-question files won't load-sorry.
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28
Elders coming over next week to discuss my questions
by Goldminer inthree months ago an elder came to our house to try to answer some of my questions.none were answered to my satisfaction and it was obvious some seemed difficult to him so he said he would do some more research and get back to me.well,last night at the meeting he told my wife that he and another elder would like to come over next week to continue our original conversation.. my wife told them that i didn't really want to be a jw anymore and they said they weren't giving up on me just yet.they also said they like me as a person and i really don't think they want to df me anytime soon as this would be too traumatic to my wife and might push her out of the religion for good.. my plan is to start with the first question and stick to it until it is answered to my satisfaction which i doubt it can be.it is the following:.
where does the bible say that god has an "organization" on earth and uses a governing body to direct it?.
i have some research ready to use but i'd like to ask you if you have any comments or information you'd like to share that i can use in some way.i appreciate all your help on this one and i'll keep you posted on how it goes next week.thank you very much.. goldminer
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28
My wife is thinking of quitting the "truth"!
by Goldminer in.
last night my wife said she was thinking about quitting the truth.she says she finds it too hard with me having doubts and not wanting to be a jw anymore.she has also been burned by her few jw friends,and the rest are either disfellowshipped or getting divorced.it's really hard to build lasting relationships with such people in the religion.. another positive factor is that she has made 2 good "worldly" friends over the past year.i think she's starting to see that people on the outside can be nice,have morals and accept others as they are.. i hope in time she starts feeling good about this decision and that i can slowly show her the many errors of the wts.so far she agrees with many of the things i've told her but still believes it's the truth.it's a hard battle but i never tought i'd hear her say those words.. btw,she finally called a local elder to see if he can help me with my many questions.he's coming over tonight so it should be quite interesting.i think he'll be a little surprised at some of the direct questions i have;i'm also hoping that after a while he decides there's not much hope for me and just labels me an apostate and starts talking about df'ing me.that would show my wife their attitude towards answering questions that have no scriptural answers.. anyways,i'll do my best to keep you all up-dated.it can be hard to post as my wife diesn't know i come here on a regular basis.. goldminer
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25
My wife wants me to write down my questions
by Goldminer in.
my wife knows i have many douts about the wts because of things that have happened that have made me question certain teachings.i have been inactive for 6 yrs now and i have no desire to ever become active again.i love my wife very much(she is presently inactive also) and i wish she would see my point of view or at least look into the society's past but she's a die-hard jw,hanging on no matter what they do or say.. anyways,we had a chat last week and she told me to write down all the questions i have and then she'll do everything to get me the answers.i'm assuming she'll give the question list to an elder she believes she can trust and he'll come up with logical answers to all my questions, then i'll humbly return to all my meetings and progress spiritually.. i'm asking everyone's help to draw up a good list even though i am not very confident of getting any real,logical or intelligent answers to all of them.i understand if the elders are stumbled by these questions,they might take the easy route-label me an apostate and try to df me.if that's the case then i'll stand my ground and hopefully my wife will see that nobody really wants to answer my questions.. a co once tried to answer my questions about 607 vs 587.i told my wife when he runs out of real proof and answers he'll tell me to wait on jehovah.that's exactly what happened!!!!!.
thank you everyone for your help on this one.
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24
Another JW divorce!
by Goldminer in.
my wife just got word that another couple in the local congregation will be divorcing.this will be the third one within 2 years,all couples in their 20's-30's,just like us here.. anyways,he committed adultery,got a std and she threw him out;the children are devastated.he was known for flirting with any attractive woman,married or not,christian or not.. what upsets me is that these people all went to the hall acting like righteous christians and pre-meditating their family-breaking adultery.meanwhile,i'm treated like shit because i don't attend all meetings here,they must have a wager on my wife and i.like i told the wife before<i'm not going anywhere and i value my family.
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//What if Micheal Moore made a documentary on the WTS
by Goldminer in.
i recently watched the 9/11farenheit documentary and found it very interesting.how much is actually true and how much is not,i don't know,but i got the impression that micheal moore is for real and trying to open people's eyes to truths we don't see.. anyways,i was just sitting there,wondering what kind of documentary he'd come up with if he decided he wanted to look into the wts.i believe it would be very interesting,and definitely an eye-opener.of course the shallow-minded jw would say it's all propaganda no matter how clear the subject was presented.. i'd love to hear your thoughts on this ...any ideas for a title?
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2 elders came for a visit
by Goldminer inat first i wasn't going to post this but i noticed a lot of people here have been getting visits from elders lately,all with pretty much the same results.. three months ago,my wife asked an elder if he could answer some of my questions.he offered to come over,which he did,to waste my time talking in circles to basic questions he couldn't answer from the bible.(i.e.
where does the bible say god has an organization and uses a governing body to direct it?
) anyways,after 3 hours of proving his allegiance tot the wts and showing me his level of denial he said he would do more research on my questions and get back to me.one main question that night had been 607 bce.. last week he made arrangements with my wife to return with another elder.that day i decided,based on advice i got here,that i would not use any research notes,only the bible as final authority(unless we got into 607 since you need secular history to support dates).the discussion started on god's organization,and being that i'm not very good at these type of debates,it basically went in circles with one elder getting upset that i didn't believe that god has a visible organization.he kept asking me well,which religion has the truth then?
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Nothing in Reasoning book about Disfellowshipping
by Goldminer ini had a talk with my father last night about the practice of disfellowshipping.my father is an active jw with privileges in the local hall.he doesn't seem in total agreement with the shunning practice of the wts,and he brought out the example of the prodigal son.we had a good discussion and i'm going to research it some more through the chapter on the misuse of disfellowshipping in the book in search of christian freedom.. anyways,i thought i'd look it up in the reasoning book to see what the wts reasoning on disfellowshipping was.it turns out it's not in the table of contents or in the index.i thought this odd;how would one reason on this with a householder who asks about it?
why is there nothing in the reasoning book on a subject every jw says is scriptural?.
goldminer