Thank you LDH.
Mario - please let us know what we can do. We are sitting here with our hearts aching for you and Talia and Marina.
You are in our thoughts and our prayers. We all wish we could be by your side.
Deborah
Ex-JW Mother attempts suicide with children and fails! My Family Tragedy
by Utopian Reformist 1242 Replies latest members private
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Utopian Reformist
Dear Friends (new & old):
I sincerely apologize for the delay in responding to everyone's wonderful support and love. I am genuinely sorry and did try aa few times to get a post going, but kept falling apart. Each time I thought of the messages, the cards, letters, gifts, and phone calls, I kept breaking down and losing my composure.
During the last 36 hours, I have done nothing other than lay on the floor in a fetal position crying and sobbing and screaming and whimpering like a wounded animal. I can't seem to do anything else right now. I finalized the memorial services for Talia. They are as follows:
Sunday, December 05, 2004 from 1PM EST to 7PM EST at:
Pio A. Romano & Sons Funeral Home
627 Union Avenue
Providence, RI 02909
1-401-944-5151
So, Tammy F's travel plans were more important than my daughter's continued suffering, more important than Marina's only free parent, and more important than everyone's reputation. Now, I am getting threatening phone calls from Tammy F claiming to use her "friendships at Providence Police & RI State Police" to get back at me in some manner.
How pleasant for an active publisher, elder's daughter and former pioneer to make use of supposed worldly flirtations from nightclubbing to threaten a man who just lost an entire life in one night. I can't tell all of you how proud I am of you, this board, my true friends and Talia, my little hero.
Also, tonight Marina and I had our worst argument ever, complete with expletives and some accusations (definitely spoon fed by the ex-in-laws). After speaking with Marina and forcing a real intense and brutally honest discussion, it is obvious that she is definitely holding onto quite a bit of information regarding the night of the fire.
AND, she has informed me that she will not reveal any information because she is protecting me from suicide. Marina claims that if I knew the truth, whether I choose to believe her or not, I would definitely wind up feeling/committing suicide. Can you imagine a statement like that from a 13 year old child? Who is feeding her or preparing her for our conversations?
I tell all of you that I smell a fish. I got an ugly feeling that there are a lot of hidden secrets about the night of the fire thanone can imagine. If my worst fears are true, then I have actually lost two daughters. One has been murdered and the other is the mother's accomplice.
I don't know how to handle that information, but, Marina keeps saying if she tells me that she will have to die and I will feel suicidal. She also keeps saying she wishes I did not rescue her from the window and that she died along with Talia. I am starting to get suspicious.
Although I am feeling VERY suicidal, at least I know too wait until after the memorial services, and after I find out the truth and decide which way to proceed with Marina. This is really getting scary and more sinister, minute by minute.
I also plan to post some pictures of Talia as soon as I can scan them and do some simple editing for size and contrast. I will try to do a better job of staying touch and want to thank all of you again for everything you have done over and over to make me feel supported and strong enough to resist my fears.
CUM PLENA GRATIA, PRO SEMPER -
gdt
Mario, thank you for sharing your valuable time with us, just deep-breathe, stay calm as best you can, knowing that so many care for you, and want what is truly the best for you and Marina, don't let anything/anybody succeed in breaking you down to despair. talk with us about the suicide thoughts, please, but don't ever feel so worthless or life is so bad for you. Marina is still a kid, no matter what her loyalty to her mum was/is. You will succeed, just be calm and believe that all who know about your situation are hurting and feeling for you. Marina needs you, no matter what anger right now she has, maybe even blaming you for her mum's condition, please do your best to be calm with her too, angry words can unforunately hurt and be remembered....thinking of you, as all are here,
geoff. don't forget, if you feel you need to get away after the funeral more than ever, talk to me.
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formerout
Mario,
I can only partly imagine how you are feeling. Your situation is a parallel to mine but unfortunately for you it is a scenario that is a lot worse. I hope that I can still relate to you though as you go through this.
I know the accusations thrown at you are tough to take. Like I said I am trying to relate because there is a parallel between your situation and mine. As evil as it is, as far as what they are accusing you of regarding child endangerment, you may be able to use it to "rescue" Marina. Deep down you know that this is not really your daughter speaking. It is the screwed up mentality of the organization and the influence of the family. You need to get her out of there. I think you have dealt with things EXTREMELY well so far. I am saying this in hopes of convincing you to stay the course, my friend.
In my experience, every time somebody makes a nasty and false accusation against somebody else they open themselves up to analysis of their own psyche. Your ex in-laws have done so. If there are court proceedings associated with this accusation, fight it and turn it against them. It was your respect for your daughter, along with the doctors' professional opinion, that caused you to make the very tough decision that you ultimately had to make. (I am crying again as I write this Mario. I mention that not because I want sympathy from you. The tears are not only tears for you and your family but also tears of joy.... realizing what I have.) But I also have learned to use peoples' false accusations against them. I implore you to do this now.
I can't completely fathom what you are going through but I do know that you are the person who is best equipped to help Marina. I feel for you, bud. I can't possibly convey the feeling in words.
You are a hero to us here. We don't want to lose a hero. Be mad, be sad, be anything you want to be......... just be!!!!! Marina needs you, we need you, the world needs you.
With the deepest of love,
Brad
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Narkissos
(((((((Mario)))))))
Grieve dear friend. Hurting and crying and sleeping and dreaming and waking and knowing and hurting again... is the only way I know.
One thing though about Marina -- when you are able to think about it: I guess you both are in a highly explosive and mentally perilous situation: with an enormous potential and need for love and an almost equally enormous potential and need for hate. Marina's responsibility (whether real or just possible) in Talia's death is something you have to work out, both separately and together, with professional help.
Tragedy was the right word. Some things are just too hard to behold, except with eyes of stone.
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Mystery
Mario -
It was good to hear from you. We are all concerned; but please don't feel sorry for not posting sooner. I don't know if I could have posted as much as you have due to all that is going on in your life.
Brad said, "But I also have learned to use peoples' false accusations against them. I implore you to do this now."
I completely agree with him on this. When my husband was trying to take my sons (before he legally disowned them - not thru JW's but thru the court system) he and many others made accusations against me. I live 700 miles from him, but found out about the accusations all the way down here. I wrote him a letter stating that i had talked with my attorney regarding the statements he was making and that i would press slander charges on him and his wife and all others making any type of accusations that were false. I sent the letter to him, all others that i knew of that were involved, his boss, his wife's boss (a church preschool teacher) his pastor, his next in line pastor and the youth group pastor. (he is not and never was a JW). I took the information I had and made comments regarding the allegations, the untruths and elaborated on issues that he had tried to brainwash my son?s with.
I know that right now is not the time to keep giving you idea's of how to deal with your situation. You have enough to deal with. But when the time comes, just maybe one of us will set your mind on a track that will most benefit you.
Our hearts are with you,
Deborah
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Mystery
Is Marina getting feeling from you that you are contemplating suicide? Or is her grandparent planting this in her mind?
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jgnat
Utopian Reformist, that you took the time for us at a time like this is amazing. My most healing thoughts are winging their way to you now.
Marina keeps saying if she tells me that she will have to die and I will feel suicidal. She also keeps saying she wishes I did not rescue her from the window and that she died along with Talia. I am starting to get suspicious.
Words like these sound like they come from intense guilt, masked by anger. Children grieve differently than adults, their coping mechanisms are not well-developed. If I were a betting woman, I would bet that Marina set the fire, or, has convinced herself that she set the fire. Or has been convinced by relatives that she set the fire. Or been convinced by mom that she set the fire. I bet that twisted JW family is rallying to "save" your mentally-ill ex from repurcussion, and is not above sacrificing your daughter to make it so. I bet that twisted JW family is stupid enough to allow contact between your ex and Marina, as damaging as such contact must be. Marina HAS to be separated from her JW family before they do any more damage.
Perhaps you could tell Marina that you figured out what her big secret is (in a safe, neutral environment, with a counsellor present, pre-warned) and you are NOT going to kill yourself, you WILL be around for many years to come and that it doesn't matter, you are STILL her father and you still love her (if you can speak those words in truth).
I also think you need a restraining order against your JW relatives. They are toxic. You have plenty of evidence now.
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Midget-Sasquatch
Mario,
Come to the board whenever you feel you're able to, but don't feel like you owe us anything., We're here to listen and to try our best to be with you through this.
I side with Jgnat. Your wife's family is working out a way to minimize the impact on their nut of a daughter. That twin sister really got me swearing!!! I'd really talk with investigators about the conversation you had with Marina. They have trained personnel who can work through any "fed" info or masked feelings/thoughts that she may have. They can get to the bottom of this, and it'll actually be better for your case. Keep in touch.
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Special K
I am truly saddened by your loss of Talia, Mario.
my condolences to you.
Special K