If you were on the Zimmerman jury, how would you vote? 2nd degree murder, manslaughter or innocent?

by UnConfused 314 Replies latest social current

• 

  FlyingHighNow

  I'm reading about these claims of Trayvon being a thug. If you look at conservative American news sources, they paint Trayvon to be a thug. If you look at unbiased, non American sources, he was no worse a thug than any other high schooler who skips school and smokes a little weed.

  I have a blonde hair, blue eyed son who had to learn to fight young. He got switched to a very rural, bad school in the 5th grade and found out quickly what it means to be beat on and bullied by other white kids. I can't imagine what it must be like to be a black, male, teenager in America, considering how bad it was for my son who could pass for Leonardo DiCaprio. If someone had seen my son walking through the condo complex, "looking in windows", I would have preferred the someone to stay in his car, distance himself from my son and to have called 911 and let the police handle it. I'd be very angry if a neighborhood watch person provoked a situation which ended in my son's death. George provoked that situation by following Trayvon and getting out of his car. Trayvon could not have touched Zimmerman if the man had stayed in his car, stayed on the phone with 911 while driving away from the situation.
• 

  FlyingHighNow

  Well, considering there is and never has been any 'they' who killed her son - that is not any sort of common sense statement to make.

  That is a quote someone made of Trayvon's mother. And seriously? You're going to argue grammar when her son was killed and then people started dragging up any jab they could to try to make George Zimmerman look justified in his over reaction? His over reaction that ended up in the death of a high schooler?

  Edited to add: her concern was not for her son's reputation so much as it was that misinformation was spread in the media about Trayvon's reputation to try to turn public sentiment into George Zimmerman's direction. To cause people to say things like, "Well, Zimmerman was justified in being stupid and dangerous in how he handled the situation because Trayvon was a troubled kid."

  It's like with Travis Alexander. Jodi Arias murdered him. The defense completely trashed his reputation, painting him as abusive to try to influence the jury into acquitting Jodi or at least coming back with a lesser conviction.
• 

  FlyingHighNow

  that she stood outside immediately afterward and let her lawyer say 'well, heck, this ain't about race and it never has been'.

  It's about stupidity. Deadly stupidity.
• 

  sammielee24

  No designs he didn't run home to his parents, put that drink on the table and hug his parents.

  He was suspended from school for the second time. He was sent to stay with his father. His father gave him a hundred bucks more or less to go out and have some fun. The father went out with his girlfriend and got home late in the evening. Called the police the next day.

  Now - if this was a minor, then shouldn't parents be responsible for minors? Treating them like adults and then claiming when they act in destructive ways that they are a minor is confusing.

  The reason we know he was outside his fathers house was because his friend on the phone with him, was told that by Martin. She insisted Martin would never lie to her and she believed him when he said he was near the outside back of his fathers house.

  Had he been there at the time he was talking to her - there would never have been any sort of fight because all the evidence pointing to Zimmerman never going further than the top of the main road which was lit - the rest of the middle complex was dark.

  So if he was at his fathers and scared - he only had to open the door and walk in. Put that can on the counter, open those skilttles and watch television. He could even have called his mother and told her about that creepy assed cracker he was scared of. She would have told him what to do. He could have called his father on the phone and reported that creep. He didn't. He could have called his half brother. He didn't. He could have gone in and locked the door and waited for his dad to come home.

  He didn't.

  The only way for him to fight with Zimmerman was for him to go back up the path to where Zimmerman was and confront him. He did that. We know the outcome. sw
• 

  Glander

  Maybe it is of no meaning but the jury is asking questions about lesser charges and maybe heading towards aquittal. We'll know soon.
• 

  JW_Researcher

  not guilty.

  the transparent race hustlers haven't been able to make the case, in spite of the biased media like the NYT reporting that GZ is a "white Hispanic."
• 

  Simon

  Yes, "they" killed my son instead of "he" speaks volumes. It cries out an underlying belief that isn't spoken openly but is clearly held and believed.

  I believe there is enough evidence to fairly label Trayvon a thug whether the jurors got to hear that evidence or not. Just lots of things that should *not* be normal for a 17 year old. If it is normal then there is something wrong with his environment / culture / society that he was brought up in.

  As for him making it home ... that was the testimony of the prosecution witness that he was right outside his fathers house and it would tally with the timelines of where he was / what he was doing for those 4 minutes. He was at a place of safety and CHOSE not to go in but instead to go back and confront a stranger and assault him.

  re: your daughters recital sosoconfused - that is a tough one. It certainly could be profiling, it could also be that they had incidents of some crime in the area against children that made them suspicious. Honestly, if something looks 'out of place' or just unusual and it involves a child then I think they should check it out - imagine the consequence if something happened and when asked why they witnessed it and didn't intervene had to say "because he was black and we didn't want to hurt his feelings".

  I have been pulled over by the police but it is because I was doing something that looked suspicious - waiting outside a friends house to pick them up, they lived in a secluded location, had experienced burglaries in the area, it was dark, they scaled the high fence instead of going round and through the gate etc.

  If I had been black would it have been victimisation? No, I don't think so ... but could I interpret it as such? Maybe sometimes that happens if that is what people are looking for.

  If I was black and I'd been stopped multiple times every year as you describe and there was nothing I was doing that could possibly be interpreted as suspicious then yes, I believe that would be victimisation and downright wrong. It is bad policing if it isolates and distances a community.

  Stop-and-search was a contentious issue in the UK - the real danger apart from the annoyance and distancing of the police is that it reverses the cause and effect: if you have evidence that most crimes in an area are by one group then y'know what ... stop more of them than others. I don't see much difference with paying more attention to certain people getting on planes and terrorism which most people don't object to. It's grossly unfair but isn't it also common sense?

  However the insidious part of profiling is if more black people are stopped (for no reason other than color) and then because of those stop-and-searches more are found to have committed crime and convicted. Now the statistics are skewed because of the behaviour and that is a very bad thing. That's why controls are needed so if people are being profiled it is for a genuine reason and not the other way round (to provide a reason).

  but I figured hey I would be just another whiney BLACK

  I object to people taking an everyday event and attributing it to their color but do not think it is whiney AT ALL to point to experiences of plain racial profiling as I don't think this should happen or be allowed. What I find annoying is that the former wekens the case and distracts from the latter.
• 

  sammielee24

  Sorry - a thug is a thug.

  I provided the definition as it applies in this case because in Martins own words - in HIS own texts - HE said he was a gangsta. Those are HIS words. Not mine. Not anyone elses. HIS. He was proud of it.

  I've been around enough thugs that I know it isn't the color of the skin but the trash talk and actions.

  George Zimmerman didn't assault and try to murder Trayvon Martin.

  He called 911 on someone who he thought looked like he was on drugs and acting suspicious. He was right - Martin was on drugs and acting suspicious.

  Now, if you were the woman who lived there who was the victim of a home invasion in broad daylight with a small baby in the house with her, and if someone happened to see a suspicioius guy with or without a hoodie on peering in your windows or out in the dark by your back door, you might welcome that involvement -heck if that guy went a step further and actually had a gut feeling about something and went to check out the back of your house, only to find the guy with a knife to your throat because he broke in your house - you might be sobbing with relief.

  There are always different ways to look at things.

  In this case, short of the evidence, all else is speculation. sw
• 

  Simon

  her concern was not for her son's reputation so much as it was that misinformation was spread in the media about Trayvon's reputation to try to turn public sentiment into George Zimmerman's direction. To cause people to say things like, "Well, Zimmerman was justified in being stupid and dangerous in how he handled the situation because Trayvon was a troubled kid."

  What did they expect? They can't have it both ways. If they throw mud then they must expect things back in return. They tried to ruin George Zimmerman's reputation and paint him as a racist. I think people have every right to shine a spotlight back and check to see what the reality was.

  I think more fault likes with the people who callously used their sons tragic death for their own race agenda than with the family themselves.
• 

  designs

  s- And you think that covers it, that Martin was able to spot Zimmerman in this poorly lit neighborhood. So Zimmerman does not keep going to the safety of his car, couldn't be because he had a firearm and wanted to 'stand his ground'. Hey I've been in enough fights to know about the guy with the pipe in his hand.

  Did you ever hang out after dark with your buddies or on your own, I did, I use to roll my own away from my parents view. Bad parents or good parents is not the issue here, a guy with deadly force made the mistake of his life.