Has anyone ever ask a householder to keep their Bible study secret from their spouse? (page 10)

isaacaustin

Wait is bane a jackass, a dog or a maggot?

Tec, Yes Jesus wept over Jeruselem. Not the apostate Pharisees. It will be sad if my family doesn´t make it. Oh well. Jehovah will give us much better things in the New System. It says the old stuff won´t even be called to mind.

I think you're missing some points in your thoughts:

As he approached Jerusalem and saw the city, he wept over it and said, "If you, even you had only known on this day what would bring you peace--but now it is hidden from your eyes...

Where in that does it say that Jesus didn't mean the apostate Pharisees? I mean, I assume he wasn't referring to those who would hear him, because why weep over them? Also, I don't think the Pharisees could be considered apostates. Hypocrites, yes.

Also Jesus says, "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do," as he was dying on the cross. Who did he want forgiven? Who helped to get him to the cross (or stake, whatever you prefer)?

Jesus says to love and bless your enemies. It sounds as if the people here are your enemies in your eyes, Bane. Are you blessing them?

Jesus says to turn the other cheek. Are you?

Jesus says not to judge? Is it not judging when you say that you will spit in the direction of people who are being killed at Armageddon? Or even if you think that they should be killed?

Just a few questions we all ought to ask ourselves, especially if we claim to follow Jesus. (And yes, I ask myself these questions as well)

Tammy

edited to add: You don't have to give a snap answer, if you're going to answer. You can take the time to consider and think about it first. That usually works best.

BANE

Outlaw, you just proved my point for me. THOUGH NOT TECHNICALLY MARRIED.

Mrsjones, Nice to see you have lost total faith in Jah. I wonder what the bible says about those with lack of faith...And it´s cuckold. Stop trying to turn threads into your dirty words.

Tec, Scripture reference please. No the Pharisees were apostates. They had corrupted the jewish faith. He wanted the Roman soldiers forgiven on the STAKE....Not the pharisees. The Romans had no idea who he was. Pharisees did.

I don´t bless apostates. No...Jesus didn´t either. Enemies can also be people like Romans who really have no idea what they are doing. They are just being jerks. Apostates are a whole nother breed of animal.

Do I think apostates should be killed in God´s holy war? Sure. Do we have biblical evidence? Jesus mentioned Gehenna for the Pharisees so yeah I do.

Turn the other cheek is regarding someone sinning against you. Apostates sin against the holy spirit. Whole nother ballgame.

mrsjones5

"Mrsjones, Nice to see you have lost total faith in Jah. I wonder what the bible says about those with lack of faith...And it´s cuckold. Stop trying to turn threads into your dirty words." says the fool on the hill

GLTirebiter

First you said

It is not in the bible.

Then you refer to an apologist tract discussing places where it is in the Bible. Unfortunately, your apologist takes snippets of verses, ignoring parts that don't fit his narrative:

At Revelation 20:1-3 we note, "And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and shut him up, and set a seal upon him...". Here we have the devil "jailed" in the bottomless pit unable to "get out".

Let's read all of verses 1-3:

Then I saw an angel come down from heaven with the key of the Abyss in his hand and an enormous chain. [2] He overpowered the dragon, that primevial serpent which is the devil and satan, and chained him up for a thousand years. [3] He hurled him into the Abyss and shut the entrance and sealed it over him, to make sure he would not lead the nations astray again until the thousand years had passed. At the end of that time he must be released, but only for a short while.

Continue reading this chapter. The devil returns, and we learn his fate in verses 9 and 10:

They [Gog and Magog] came swarming over the entire country and beseiged the camp of the saints, which is the beloved City. But fire rained down on them from heaven and consumed them. [10] Then the devil, who led them astray, was hurled into the lake of fire and sulphur, where the beast and the false prophet are, and their torture will not come to an end, day or night, for ever and ever.

The lake of fire is a place of eternal torture. The same "burning lake" is the place of "second death" for those who are not recorded in the book of life, as we see in verses 14-15:

Death and Hades were emptied of the dead that were in them; and every one was judged as his deeds deserved. Then Death and Hades were hurled into the burning lake. This burning lake is the second death; [15] and anybody whose name could not be found written in the book of life was hurled into the burning lake

Thus the second death is tied to eternal torture, in that same lake of fire. The torture is real, but beyond human reckoning. This is not the fire of our physical world, but being consumed by fire is as close as human words of the time could describe the worst of all possible torments: eternal separation from god's presence. Thus the biblical phrase "hellfire": an imperfect, frightful, human description of an unimaginable spiritual fate.

It would make Jehovah unfair, by his own standards, and not a God of mercy and love.

Does it? Look again at verse 14, "judged as his deeds deserved". Those who chose the Lord's way will be in his presence, and those who chose to live without the Lord also have their wish granted. It is our choice to make, not God's, judgement is checking the record to see what our choice was. There is nothing "unfair" or "unloving" about impartial judgement. That we sinners even have a chance to be in his presence is the ultimate expression of God's mercy, grace and love.

With that, at this late hour, let us agree that we don't agree and return to the main topic of this thread.

tec

Do you need scripture references, Bane? I know you must recognize them. But since you ask, here they are in order:

Luke 19:41-44, Luke 23:34, Matt 5:43-48, Matt 5:39-40, Matt 7:1-2.

Regarding your response, you're qualifying who is included in enemy. Go ahead and do it, if you like. But recognize that it is a personal interpretation. Either way, I don't know what else to say to you except that I think you best hope that you are right. That these people here are apostates against Christ (it doesn't mean anything for someone to be apostate against an organization of itself). Perhaps hope also that they weren't driven away because of hypocrisy or abuse from the people and/or leaders within that organization - because you wouldn't really be showing anyone mercy by condemning them in your heart, would you?

Because if you're wrong about any of it (which how could you possibly know for sure either way, you cannot read the heart or mind - hence the reason you are not qualified to judge another person ), then with the measure you use, it will be measured against you. (Matt 7:2)

Tammy

isaacaustin

Bane you have been beaten on every scritual discussion you have attempted.

I beat you on blood...Tammy has just slapped you down. You are not a very challenging deabte either...you seem to have a very shallow knowledge of the Bible.

garyneal

If I had a kid and he turned his back on Jah and I survived Armaggeddon and my son did not I wouldn´t even think twice about it. Jehovah can give me BETTER sons like he did with Job.

Ouch BANE, I'm glad I am not one of your kids. If this is an example of what the true religion does to parents then count me out.

2 Timothy 3

1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, 4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; 5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

PSacramento

Carla....Are you ready for it? I am just about to be triumphant again on these boards by using the Bible. Ready to be trounced? Deut 21: 18 “In case a man happens to have a son who is stubborn and rebellious, he not listening to the voice of his father or the voice of his mother, and they have corrected him but he will not listen to them, 19 his father and his mother must also take hold of him and bring him out to the older men of his city and to the gate of his place, 20 and they must say to the older men of his city, ‘This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious; he is not listening to our voice, being a glutton and a drunkard.’ 21 Then all the men of his city must pelt him with stones, and he must die. So you must clear away what is bad from your midst, and all Israel will hear and indeed become afraid.

One of the many reason God abolished the Old Covenant and replaced it with the NEw one through Our Lord Jesus.

"let he who is without sin, cast the first stone"...

"Our father desires mercy, NOT sacrifice".

PSacramento

Fact of the matter is that one MUST hold ANY orgnaization as dubious when they believe that learning about God makes it acceptable to LIE and MANIPULATE parents and spouses.

Has anyone ever ask a householder to keep their Bible study secret from their spouse?

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