Shocking talk from 2013 District Convention urges parents to shun disfellowshipped children

by cedars 153 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • confusedandalone

    " Many of the "friends" turned up the scowling eyebrow, and we got a lot of flack for it, but in the end, I would just pull the "elder" card, and tell them to mind their own business. We took some heat, but it was worth it."

    You were one of the good ones. As the org matures however there are fewer and fewer who act this way.

  • SafeAtHome

    Contrary to what their website says, they are shunning family members who no longer associate. Never been disfellowshipped, never formally disassociated, just a slow fade almost 30 years, and now I am being shunned and left out of major family events. Has to be because of all this crap they are being fed. Listening to this clip made me ill, the hate spewed forth in such a whiney voice! I won't say it is not hurtful, but just have to shake my head and feel sorry for them. Fortunately, unlike so many others posting here, I am at a stage in my life where I really do not care anymore. When I walked away my life turned around and I have never looked back. I have a life of freedom and family and friends, am entering my retirement years, and life is too short to deal with their issues.

  • Vidiot

    The more extreme the rhetoric gets, the more rank-and-filers with half a brain will leave, fewer and fewer recruits will be made, and/or there's a tangible feeling of desperation at the top of the Tower.

    As strange as this sounds, this is a positive sign.

  • adamah


    Doubting bro said-

    It's only shocking for someone who has never been a JW. Otherwise, this is the same crap they've been spewing for years. It must have been a manuscript since it was the same talk I heard. I just shook my head through the whole thing.

    Distrubing? Yes. Hate speech? Yes. Shocking to me? uh, no.

    Yeah, it's not 'shocking' or a new policy (the result of some "new light"), but simply the same ol' policy we've all known (and even followed by shunning others) for over six decades.

    Although, I didn't fully catch the twisting of Jesus' words of Matthew 10 the WTBTS performs to justify their shunning policy until now (or if I DID, and I forgot about it).

    You'd almost think the GB are actually 'closeted atheists', and hence have no reason to fear Divine retribution for treating Jesus as if he's their little mannequin, and they can make him say whatever they WANT him it to say.

    It's almost like they haven't read the warning in 2nd Peter 3:

    14 Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, 15 and regard the patience of our Lord to be salvation; just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, 16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction. 17 You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, be on your guard lest, being carried away by the error of unprincipled men, you fall from your own steadfastness, 18 but grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory, both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

    Perhaps they actually DO know the Book of 2nd Peter is widely acknowledged by NT scholars as being a pseudoepigraphical work (nice way of saying it's written for the fraudulent purpose of supporting fledgling Christian doctrine), and hence they don't have to take THAT warning seriously, either.

    I've written about on the topic of theologically-driven "lying scribes" (which Jesus even repeatedly warned about):

    Genesis' depiction of Lot vs 2nd Peter's depiction:

    Genesis' depiction of Noah, vs 2nd Peter's depiction:


    Oh, PS, on this:

    Liz said-

    uh, lets see if I get this - so Jehovah wants you to prove your loyalty to him by blackmailing your family.

    I'm not getting the "blackmail" thing? The term 'blackmail' is a TYPE of extortion, and carries a specific meaning of threatening to reveal some unfavorable personal information about you if you don't comply with their demands.

    Perhaps people actually mean 'extortion', since the GB demands people to perform a certain action (acting repentent, demonstrating a 'true' change of heart, etc) to force compliance with their demands. Taking and holding hostages implies kidnapping (a form of extortion) of trying to force others to preform an action against their will by threatening the well-being of their loved ones. Obviously the JWs are not kidnapping individuals, so to avoid hyperbolic exaggeration, the term 'extortion' probably should be used.

    Just saying, we need to use the proper terms in order to accurately call a spade a spade (and not label it as a hammer), without relying on exaggeration and hyperbole (which is a form of intellectual dishonesty which is often ineffective, since it often only back-fires).


  • Captain Obvious
    Captain Obvious

    I was shaking from anger in my seat at the DC during this talk. I couldn't help but be visibly pissed off.

    It's disgusting the way they shrug off the responsibility onto their imaginary deity. "It's Jehovah's arrangement" they say. "We must remain loyal to Jehovah" they say. Not a word about the loyalty they expect themselves to their cult. This whole DC was very cultish. 3 days of nonsense about "truth" and not a word about how to actually distinguish truth from untruth.

    Basically if its said from the platform or in one of the pubs, its true. If it disagrees, it's untrue. Oh yah and apostates are mentally diseased, and only lie all the time. Their words are Satans, you don't want to listen to Satans words do you?! Disgusting.

  • Oubliette

    Tech49: I guess my point is that complete, unabashed shunning is NOT the way to show people that you love them

    Ya' think!

    Actually, it's so obvious that it's ridiculous that it even needs to be said.

    Who would ever come up with this on their own? No normal person.

    It's true that sometimes individuals will cut contact with others for personal reasons; maybe they're right, maybe they're wrong, but it's their own decision.

    Institutionalized shunning is crimanal behavior.

  • problemaddict

    Hey everyone. I just saw an old thread of Slimboy, and something came to me.

    In speaking about the harm that shunning can do from disfellowshipping, would it not be beneficial for the sake of the tie in the things that can land you in the state in which shunning by your family and former community is REQUIRED of those people?

    I mean a REAL list. I think for the general public, that list could be shocking.

  • Narcissistic Supply
    Narcissistic Supply

    Shunning is awesome. That guy is a total friggin rocket scientist.

  • Quendi

    I’m going to ask my partner to watch this video with me. He is struggling to understand the culture of this cult; but he already knows enough to ask me never to return there. Of course, I have no intention of doing so but I want him to see and hear a WTS officer in action so he can increase his understanding of how poisonous this cult really is.

    I want to thank Cedars for making this video and posting it on the Internet. I still believe that if and when the WTS collapses, the Internet will have played a significant role in its demise. I may not witness its downfall, but I have every hope that will eventually happen. As for the writer of this talk, the Governing Body which authorized and approved it and those who have delivered it, I can only paraphrase Mark Twain. ‘I admire them. I frankly admit it; and when their time comes I want a piece of the rope for a keepsake.’


  • clarity

    OMG the voice on that guy! Like fingernails on a blackboard.


    To be shunned in this society ... all you have to do

    is stop using that name.......jehovah, jehovah, jehovah ad nauseum!

    Uncanny how the dubs pick up on it.


    Not surprised by anything said by them anymore, although

    ordinary people's reactions to shunning is quite enlightening.


    When telling a friend how family now avoids me, no time to talk,

    no sharing meals or outings .etc......... she actually teared up & gasped ..

    "their own mother" wtf!!! (the kids don't like how I think now!)


    Anyway, terrific presentation Cedars ..thanks for all your work!

    Jack Harper & Mrs Harper ...... I think I love you!


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