Killing Ananias and Sapphira

by irondork 313 Replies latest watchtower bible

tec

You have ditched the bible, Tammy, but not everyone has.
I have not ditched it... but my faith is not dependent upon it, that is certain. It was not dependent upon it to begin with though.
So when you claim to speak about the god of that bible that you have ditched, others that hear you will turn to that bible, because they realize that without it, you would not have your information at all.
People had information about God long before there was ever a bible. If some had it then, some would have it now. Not saying it would or would not be me. But some.
Those are the people that will see this horribly brutal god and get caught up in the disfunction of defending the brutality. Way to groom spouses and children to take abuse in the name of love.
I have never promoted this 'biblegod' that some like to promote in order to denounce. Who is that? I do not know such a being. I mean, the bible is not even one book... but many different ones, with different authors and witness accounts of things those authors saw or heard or investigated.
I do not promote the bible... or biblegod... but rather Christ, and His Father as God.
Christ first and foremost. Christ as truth.
So there is no brutality that I have ever pointed people toward.
You do a far better job of that than i do.
So you have surpassed---risen above---the need to read, and you get your info directly from the source. But you still direct them to the god of the bible, and he is pretty much a monster.
I direct those who are seeking and asking... to the Father of Christ. Alive. Spirit. Of love. Seen through His Son, who is His image... not the bible.
Not everyone can be as advanced as you are---so I question the god of the bible.
I am not advanced. I am simply exercising faith in the Spirit. I am still learning, but my faith is in Him.
Glad you question the god of the bible though. I submit that you would get your answers by looking at Christ.
I have no idea who your god is---I suppose whoever you are told he is through some line of communication---or who you believe him to be---whatever.
The Father of Christ. Seen through Christ. I only look at Christ to see Him. Not that difficult.
But just because you have reached Nirvana doesn't mean that the majority have.
No nirvana, whatever that would mean.
I cannot actually discuss anything with you, because I can't argue what your lord tells you. But I can state my case for other people who are looking at the bible god.
Go ahead... but I'm not looking at or promoting bible god.
Peace,
tammy
NewChapter

Well let's look at the characters. God the father, and his son Jesus. How shocking that someone may think you are talking about the very same people that are written about in the bible. But as I've said, I have no idea who your god is. Certainly not the bible god. And wherever your info comes on Jesus, it's not the bible, so again---can't discuss him with you.
So it would appear that you have to be the word of Christ for others---since the bible is not to be trusted. So for those that don't have the faith to hear the voice, you can just direct them. Maybe you should write a book.
tec

It's a shame god doesn't just bypass the bible all together...and people who tell us about him, and just talk to everyone directly before they get sucked into religions.
Who says He doesn't? Well... actually, true enough that He doesn't... He speaks to people through His Son. Through the Spirit. Christ speaks to us and He does not need the bible to do so. However... WE... tend to need to SEE and TOUCH something, in order to believe it.
Maybe when we are children he could have a wee chat. It would save a lot of confusion. Especially for people who never even get to read this bible in the first place and never even discover from it that Jesus existed, or who he was, or how he bahaved, or that he is supposed to be the image of god.
Well, if He had a wee chat with us as children, some adult or expert would just chalk that up to nonsense, or imagination, or childhood friends... and children tend to set such things aside as they are taught to by the adults who are supposed to KNOW, in their lives.
And before the bible became public reading, when it was only for the priests and religious...they had NO chance of ever reading about him in the first place.
Exactly. Same as when it was only allowed to be read in latin (unless that is an unsubstantiated rumor). So it makes no sense at all that God would limit his ability to communicate with us... to a book that others control, manipulate, and lord over them. No. He is not so limited. He is spirit, and His Son is spirit, and speaks through the spirit.
How do you suppose Peter and the other apostles even knew He was the Christ, with no bible to tell them so? They didn't search the scriptures to see if it was Him. They knew. They were called. This was a communication that did not require any bible. This was in spirit.
Or how did the prophets receive any revelation without a book to tell them? They received it in spirit.
Just because someone is written about in a book, does not mean that particular writing is the only place and only way (or even the best way) to know them. It is just one way to know of them. But if you really want to know if what is written is true or not (or which parts are true and which parts are misunderstood, because with many different authors, there is nothing stating it is an all or nothing account)... then you'd kind of need to go to the person, themselves.
Peace,
tammy
NewChapter

He is not so limited.
Well, it seems he is limited. As brought out here:
Well, if He had a wee chat with us as children, some adult or expert would just chalk that up to nonsense, or imagination, or childhood friends... and children tend to set such things aside as they are taught to by the adults who are supposed to KNOW, in their lives.
But even so, one could argue that if Jesus spoke to everyone as children, then they would not actually be chalking everything up to nonsense, but would be sharing stories about the night Jesus came to them as children.
How do you suppose Peter and the other apostles even knew He was the Christ, with no bible to tell them so?
Their scriptures had taught them that a messiah was coming. This one came and claimed he was the messiah, and then Jesus used scriptures to support his claim.
However... WE... tend to need to SEE and TOUCH something, in order to believe it.
One could argue that our creator would know that about us, and in so knowing, may think to provide something other than books of lies to help out with that. But he is limited, so maybe not. Afterall, experts and adults would be able to wipe his messages away when he appeared to children.
tec

Well let's look at the characters. God the father, and his son Jesus. How shocking that someone may think you are talking about the very same people that are written about in the bible.
They are written about in the bible. That does not mean that everything ever written about them is accurate, or understood. If you want to know God, you have to look at His Son. Even if you are only looking at the bible... you would still look at God through what is written about His Son, first and foremost.
"Listen to my Son."
"Know me (Christ), know my Father."
I heard these... I listened to God, and listened to His Son... for truth, to know and to see God. I still have baggage leftover from religion, men, etc. But the more I look to Christ and listen to Him, the more of that baggage I can shed. Because it comes from places that are not the truth, word, or image of God.
But as I've said, I have no idea who your god is.
I know. If you would look at and see Christ, though, you could.
Certainly not the bible god. And wherever your info comes on Jesus, it's not the bible, so again---can't discuss him with you.
I learned some from the bible. Heard truth in His teachings; loved the man behind the words and teachings. Learned to love God from loving Christ. But I take everything written with a grain of salt, unless He teaches or confirms it in spirit. And I test everything written, taught, heard, whatever... against Christ and his teachings, and love.
So it would appear that you have to be the word of Christ for others---since the bible is not to be trusted.
Christ is to be trusted. He is the Word of God.
I am no one's word. I just shared what i understood with someone who asked a question. That should absolutely be tested as well, against Christ... and what He says/teaches/does. Because HE is the teacher. Not me.
So for those that don't have the faith to hear the voice, you can just direct them. Maybe you should write a book.
The only thing that i can direct anyone to... is Christ. Don't think any more books are the things we need. We have plenty of those. The Spirit though... that is all that is needed.
Peace,
tammy
tec

...can't discuss him with you.
Yet you seem to be discussing him with me quite a bit ;)
Peace,
tammy
tec

Their scriptures had taught them that a messiah was coming. This one came and claimed he was the messiah, and then Jesus used scriptures to support his claim.
They followed Him when He called them. He didn't state, follow me, I am the Christ. They knew His voice, and they followed Him, on faith. Faith in Spirit. There are other men and women of faith, who did as they heard in spirit. Without having had to read it somewhere first.

One could argue that our creator would know that about us, and in so knowing, may think to provide something other than books of lies to help out with that. But he is limited, so maybe not. Afterall, experts and adults would be able to wipe his messages away when he appeared to children.
You keep talking like it is an all or nothing... all lies or all truth; nothing in between. This is not so. It is not inerrant... but there are no books that are. Doesn't mean you have to throw them all out as useless.
Again, we are the ones who are limited. But in order to hear him - a spirit - we need to listen in spirit. It is not some arbitrary demand. We need to learn to do it if we want to hear Him, if we want to understand that we are also spirit. Like teaching someone to fish so that person can eat. He makes allowances for us; I mean that is why we have things written... for those who must see and touch. But those can be subject to error, because they are tools of men, and man is subject to error.
Plus, children, even other cultures, can hear in spirit, and perhaps not be able to describe that in a way that others would understand what they are speaking about.
Peace,
tammy
NewChapter

To be honest, I never know what I'm discussing with you. It sort of gets molded as we go along. But you're not the only one reading, so. . .
Some may be drawn to what you are saying, and some may look at it and get so confused or realize that this is a god of one person who has formed him according to inner feelings, and they may look at that critically and think it doesn't make sense. So we play on.
But one thing we absolutely agree on---I have NO IDEA who your god is. I'm not privvy to the info you used to build him. And apparently nobody else is either, because even those that hear voices, hear different things. So everyone has a slightly different view of their god. He is either a person with a personality or he is a concept that can be individualized. But I think it is good for the ideas to be laid out here---pro and con---for those looking for answers.
NewChapter

You keep talking like it is an all or nothing... all lies or all truth; nothing in between. This is not so. It is not inerrant... but there are no books that are. Doesn't mean you have to throw them all out as useless.
Usually, yes that is exactly what it means. For instance, if I am writing a research paper, I don't use Wikipedia as a source. In fact, I don't use ANY encyclopedia as a source, because Wiki is no worse than any other encyclopedia. They have a lot of wrong information. I'm not even allowed to use wikipedia as a source, because it is so flawed. But that isn't the only unacceptable source. I have to deeply scrutinize each one and decide if it is accurate and honest. If not, I have to ditch it. No matter how good some of the stuff may sound.
Now if I find a source that is full of lies, I can't just look at it and decide what I think is right and dismiss the rest. The entire source is then suspect. So you ask must it be all or nothing? YES! If it is admittedly written by liars, then none of it can be trusted. Can you ever trust a liar? I don't. Especially over important stuff.
still thinking

He speaks to people through His Son. Through the Spirit. Christ speaks to us and He does not need the bible to do so
Well...it would appear that he does....ask a muslim if he hears Jesus. Ask a hindu, or a buddist. You'll get a very similar answer. Because they weren't brought up with the bible.
Now, if later in life they are introduced to the bible and its teachings they may start to claim to hear Jesus.
What an odd god that he works that way. Why doesn't he speak to all of different faiths and understandings? Why doesn't he 'speak' to you until you understand him better?
Seems a bit biased to me on Gods part.
GET IT RIGHT PEOPLE....OR I WON'T TALK TO YOU!!!....all my love....God. xoxox

Killing Ananias and Sapphira

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