BTS: "Dan Savage has close ties to Obama."
Maybe BTS was talking about this...
Dan Savage talks about the bible and Christian students flee
by Terry 319 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Low-Key Lysmith
Here's an observation:
I think BTS just likes to argue. I doubt very seriously that he has any regard for anything that he argues for, just that he argues for arguments' sake. In this and many past threads, I have seen BTS take the side which he thinks will attract the most arguments, embellishes his talking points, (like calling "bullshit" profanity and inappropriate for high school-aged children). He then sits and waits for someone to call him out on how ridiculous his "stances" are. It was the same with the Treyvon Martin thread. When his own straw grasping is called against him, he uses his "straw man" and "red herring" labels. It's all a big sad cycle.
Not saying it's right or wrong. Some people just like to argue. Just don't act like your sense of morals or standards have been attacked. Make it what it really is. An Argument for arguments' sake.
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NewChapter
If these young adults are going to be journalists...they are going to have a difficult time if this is how they react. All he did was mention the bible and people were walking....before any sort of profanity was used at all
EXACTLY. They didn't wait around for any bullshit or pansy ass---they got up as a group as soon as the bible was mentioned. Like many fundies, they are professional vicitms. Squeezing out a few tears was child's play. They wanted to be disruptive, they wanted to make a point, they wanted to become powerful through being the victim, and so they did. Or maybe they just objected to the bible's teachings on slavery and violence against homosexuals being called bullshit. Either way---not convincing.
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james_woods
Good GAWD - eleven pages of this crap because some gay rights guy went off on an anti-bible rant, and some bible believer high school kids walked out.
Here is a point that may have been missed: Freedom of Speech.
Savage was free to say what he did. (appropriate or not, it was not obscene or inciting violence).
The kids were also free to excersize their free speech by walking out. (at least they did not try to shout him down).
Big toot over nothing here.
But in my personal opinion, the Savage remarks were made to call sensational attention to himself rather than to really improve gay rights. So, I guess, he got what he wanted. I just doubt that it did anything at all to improve gay rights.
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xchange
If those kids were really bible believers and they knew who Dan Savage was and what he stands for, why were they attending his talk in the first place? They could have opted out of his talk easily enough. And again, if you don't read Savage on a regular basis then what he said in the video was extremely tame compared to how he usually is.
He is simply one guy who is constantly chipping away at archaic notions of sexual orientation. What is everybody else doing about that?
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james_woods
If those kids were really bible believers and they knew who Dan Savage was and what he stands for, why were they attending his talk in the first place? They could have opted out of his talk easily enough. And again, if you don't read Savage on a regular basis then what he said in the video was extremely tame compared to how he usually is.
Like I said, it was an expression of free speech on their part. Yes, it probably WAS planned - so what? Savage had his remarks planned too.
It is illogical to say that Savage should have free speech to say this stuff, but they should not have the free speech to publicly walk out on it.
The U.S. (and other nations) have several times attended the first of the Iranian presidents rants in the U.N. and then walked out when he started going off on destroying Israel and how the holocaust never happened.
Like I also said, I am personally an advocate of gay rights (even gay marriage if they want this) but I disagree with speech deliberately intended to offend people. Kind of a milder equivalent of those naked gay parades in San Francisco - it just alienates people from a legitimate cause.
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botchtowersociety
What James said.
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xchange
It is illogical to say that Savage should have free speech to say this stuff, but they should not have the free speech to publicly walk out on it.
Never said they couldn't exercise their free speech by walking out. Good for them. Free speech is a given anyways in this context. Not an issue. Is not the issue.
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james_woods
Very good, xchange.
That was my only point.
The kids probably convinced nobody from the other side, Savage probably convinced nobody from his other side, but everybody got to be on camera and get in the news.
And in the meanwhile, life goes on as before.
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NewChapter
There is no problem with them walking out. I would walk out if Nugent got up to speak or worse, sing. However, they are playing the vicitim, as though something Savage said made them 'flee'. That simply is not true. They planned it. Most left before anything remotely offensive was said, (unless you find holding violence against homosexuals and slavery in contempt offensive). They made their point. But like many fundies, they have to go a step further. They were persecuted! Which is Savage's point. As soon as the bullied push back, the bullies cry. He didn't call them names, he described their move as pany ass. Okay, not a good phrase, but the sentiment is there. Push back and they cry. So who is counting all the tears of the gay teenagers that are bullied and told they are going to hell to burn FOREVER. Oh that's right---protected speech. That's much more personal that disagreeing with some book. In fact, there was nothing overly personal in anything that Savage said, he simply attacked ideas. And he apologized for the pansy ass comment---relating it to the Christian hate the sin love the sinner BS. So he pointed out that he was attacking the action not the actors, but realizes this is weak in light of the love the sinner crap.
FOX is gonna love them!