by hamsterbait 101 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Here is a far-out conjecture: If they ever should choose to do this (to end the obvious logical conflicts that this doctrine causes) -
Wouldn't it be just too typical to have them come up with some little-known secondary or tertiary prophecy that this great new light fulfills?
I mean, if you can stretch the 7 trumpet blasts to be some forgotten speech at some distant meaningless convention, why not?
Marvin -
Regarging Bethel rumor, 'all partaking'
I was at Bethel during the 70's and did hear that. Although it was later explained away as Apostate spread gossip, from Franz and Dunlap.
Who knows who spread it?
But for a fact, it was being talked about by Bethel Elders at the time as a possibility.
I have not heard anything from my Lord as to what they will or will not do with either teaching,
Please explain this AG.
thanks snowbird...but im not
i want to live on the earth with all my buddies....playing footie yay and horse riding etc.....
dont want to be in the clouds looking soooooooooooo many feet below.......i'd be the only angel who never moved from that cloud....lol
JWs don't believe in angels in clouds. That's Christendom-talk. Don't you know that?
May you have peace!
glad im not annointed...too scared of heights!!
I admire your humility, dear one, and your sincerity. However, I wish to appeal to your love of truth… and God, and Christ, if you will permit me:
FIRST, REGARDING NOT WISHING TO BE "ANOINTED":
1. This is one of the FOREMOST reasons for the existense of the WTBTS: to get you to DENY... the VERY thing that will save you - being CHOSEN to enter into the ARK [of the Covenant]. Thus, the holy spirit that is in me lets me know that I HAVE to let you know that you do NOT know what you're saying… or what you are "glad" for… when you say you are "glad… [you] are NOT 'anointed'." You are SAYING, dear one… that you are GLAD… you are NOT… a "CHRISTIAN." Because it is true that you are not YET a christian, you are saying that you never wish to BE one, either, and thus I am compelled to explain to you what a "christian" truly is:
The term "Christian" originated in this way: "christ" à English translation of the Greek word, "khristi" à which means, "anointed/chosen." "ian" à English translation of the Greek suffix "anous" à which means "person." Hence, khristi-anous (Greek) àchrist-ian (English) à anointed/chosen person.
Thus, you cannot BE a "christian," dear one… if you have NOT been anointed/chosen. Period. Since you have not… you are not. But it doesn't have to be that way, because:
2. ALL of those called… and CHOSEN… to be members of the Body of Christ… are ANOINTED… whether they are of:
a. The "little flock" (consisting of the Jews, the 2-tribe kingdom of Judah and Benjamin); or
b. The "other sheep" (consisting of the Samaritans, the 10-tribe kingdom of Israel… AND the non-Israelite "nations")
Because that is HOW they are "chosen": the same Spirit CALLS them… CHOOSES them… LEADS them… TEACHES them… and ultimately RESURRECT… and SAVES them.
3. The "little flock" is Jews ONLY. The "other sheep" include the other 10 tribes of Israel… AND people of the nations. You see, Israel was SUPPOSED to be the "chosen" nation, due to a promise God made to Abraham. BUT… not only did they continually rebel against the Most Holy One of Israel… and repeatedly demonstrate a LACK of faith in Him… the ultimately rejected the very King HE appointed over them. As a result, God… turned His attention TO THE NATIONS… to take out of THEM… "a people for His name." Thus,
4. Those who rule with Christ as kings and priests INCLUDE:
a. The 144,000… made up of 12,000 from each of the tribes OF THE SONS OF ABRAHAM… ONLY… which INCLUDES the Jews… AND the Samaritans (which is why my Lord said to the twelve, "YOU will be witnesses of me… in all Judea [the land of Judah, with the capital city of Jerusalem]… AND Samaria" [the land of the 10-tribe kingdom of Israel, with its capital city of Bethel]); AND
b. The "great crowd"taken from EVERY nation, tribe, tongue, and people… to whom Paul - who was NOT one of the 12 but was "an apostle to the NATIONS" - was sent. (Acts 9:15; Romans 11:13; Galatians 1:16; Ephesians 3:8;Revelation 5:9, 10)
The 12 were sent ONLY to Israel (the Jews AND the Samaritans). Paul was sent to those OTHER than Israel, which is why most of his letters… with the exception of that to the Romans and to Timothy … were TO people of the nations. Note, the WTBTS erroneously assumes, by their insertion of the word [nations] at Romans 1:6, that the letter to the Romans was written to the nations. It was written to "the holy ones" (i.e., Abraham's seed, Israel, who were living AMONG the "nations" and thus outside of the land given to Abraham)… AND to the nations. Romans 10:13
REGARDING YOUR FEAR OF HEIGHTS:
Because of the VERY false teaching of the WTBTS, there is this assumption that being in… or ruling from… "heaven" has something to do with physical height. It does not. The heavens are not "above" us in a PHYSICAL sense; they are above us… in a SPIRITUAL and MORAL sense. They are, in a PHYSICAL sense… ALL AROUND US: above, below, inside, outside, everywhere…
Do you remember when Christ said, "The kingdom is IN YOUR MIDST" or "INSIDE YOU"? The spirit realm is not above us, physically. It is here, right where WE are. When God "looks down," dear one, He is not lowering His eyes, literally. He is CONDESCENDING… i.e., looking "lower" than His station and being. Coming down to OUR level, as it were. When New Jerusalem comes "down" out of heaven, it is not coming from a PLACE that is higher than the earth physically… but from a consciousness… and existence… that is "higher"… one that TRANSCENDS this realm, the physical "world."
True, Christ returns "on a cloud." But dear one, a cloud of WHAT? Water vapor? No, a cloud of God's holy spirit… the same "cloud" that took him back into the spirit realm, the same "cloud" that lead the Israelites through the wilderness by day, the same "cloud" that filled the temple.
At any rate, those you currently believe to be "anointed" do not STAY in heaven, per se. At least, they do not stay in some place far above the earth. New Jerusalem "comes down OUT of heaven…" Thus, those who rule with Christ as kings and priest rule NOT "over" the earth, as the WTBTS falsely teaches… but rule UPON the earth. The WTBTS have chosen the wrong translation/definition of the Greek word "epi" in order to support their FALSE teaching of some being in heaven while others are on the earth.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G1909&t=KJV
THIS IS A LIE.
And we know it is a lie because God PURPOSES… "to bring TOGETHER… AGAIN… the things in the heavens AND the things on earth"… just as it was when he created Adham. Then, the garden in Eden was such that Adham could go OUT of it… and be in the physical realm, indeed, the "cursed" earth as it later became. He did not have to go down from the garden to the earth. Thus, New Jerusalem… the "Bride" of Christ and the "City" that Christ built out of people FOR God to occupy BY spirit… comes [down] out of heaven.
Now, in a PHYSICAL sense, the spirit realm is "above" the earth in that it is vastly larger than the earth… the earth being merely a drop in the bucket, if that. So, if you take size into consideration then, yes, the spirit realm… or parts of it… are literally higher than we are. Even still, there is not risk of falling, as unlike the physical realm, which includes earth, the other planets, galaxies, etc., the SPIRIT realm… is FREE… and so things like GRAVITY have no binding "law."
BOTTOM LINE - since you can't fall (spirits don't fall, dear one, as they are free and not subject to the "laws" of the physical realm. And since EVERYONE who exists in the kingdom, whether as ruler or subject has a SPIRIT body - a "white robe" - all are spirits; however, all will be "like" the angels - able to put ON… and OFF… flesh)… and since although you may be higher, per se… looking down won't bother you… as your sight and PERSPECTIVE won't be affected at all.
I bid you peace… and eyes to see/ears to hear.
YOUR servant, and a slave of Christ,
SA
May you have peace!
I have not heard from my Lord as to whether they will in fact begin to teach that all should partake (although I have heard that if they do, it will be hugely detrimental to her and the beginning of her demise, so maybe that means...?)... or whether they will try to explain away the 1914 false teaching yet again. And I won't ask about such things - indeed, I rarely ask about anything, as I have come to learn that this is a lack of faith. It is tantamount to the Adversary's insinuation that God withholds things that we need [to know] from us.
I have learned, however, that He withholds nothing: whatever we need, including knowledge, He gives, through Christ... at the proper time (i.e., when I...or perhaps whoever it's for... can handle it). So, I have learned to be satisfied with the "manna" I have currently received... and let that sustain me while waiting for more.
And more always, always comes (though not necessarily on a topic others would like to know about). Be assured, if I do hear anything I will most certainly share it!
I bid you peace...
A slave of Christ,
SA
Narkissos is The Man, for putting us on the right track here. I did think it was an aberration on their part to apply John chapt 6 to the "great crowd" . I see now that they had done so previously. ...It still does not make any more sense though, does it? I would bet that there were a fair few dubs scratching their heads at this. I wonder if they researched it as well as we did?
I never, ever thought that they were moving to do away with the two classes though.
I'm for it . This has always been a point of contetion between my mother and my unbeleiving husband. He did not want to go to the memorial because he felt guilty not partaking. He felt it showed indifference for Jesus ransom. My mother was always worried that he would have a nip.
After my husband raised that point with me I starting investigating it and it was probably the start of my descent as a R&F. I believe they would change it if they thought it would keep more people interested. It doesn't have to be logical it just has to be printable.
I believe they would change it if they thought it would keep more people interested.
I have to disagree - the true power elite of the GB do not care if the rank & file are interested, disinterested, agree, disagree, or anything else.
This whole doctrine is all about GB(FDS) power - and the GB will never voluntarily give up any of their power.
