News from Mother ship

by jefferywhat 283 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • tula
    tula
    The material was "classified" and filed away Those guys got some kind of consent from GB members (some of whom have already died now) to further study and research the material as long as they would stay faithful to the org.

    Could this "classified material" be....the NEW SCROLLS?

    needs an external "trigger event" for them to break loose.

    What qualifies as an "external event"??

    Are we talking about a political scenerio? Maybe DISCRIMINATION case? MENTAL ANGUISH case? ABUSE OF CHILDREN AND ELDERLY case? A PLETHORIA of sudden lawsuits?

    If the trigger event wasn't the handling of pedofiles in the orginization what would be classified as a "trigger event"? There's loads of stuff that should be considered trigger event that doesn't actually trigger anything. The generation change, the blood doctrine change, the aforementioned silent lambs scandal, I'm just curious if those aren't big enough, what will be?

    Some of the Protestants are teaching that Jesus is coming in for a landing on the Mount of Olives soon. That is supposed to be their "triggrt event".

    Are you suggesting the trigger event could be a natural global disaster whereby the wts does not take care of its r&f and chaos ensues?

    Make them servants rather than overseers. (Only slaves have overseers.)

    They used to be called Servants (congregation servant, Watchtower Servant, Literature Servant, etc.) I think sometime in the 70's they became known as overseers. And you're right about the slaves....I've often thought this same thing.

    There is a kind of "civil war" going on at the top but not open yet.

    Joshua Fit de Battle is one of the best known examples of "Negro Spiritual" music.
    These were songs created by an enslaved people-- African Americans who lived in this land for over 300 years
    --just about the same length of time that the Hebrew people were enslaved in Egypt.

    American slaves were forbidden to read or write or to gather in groups. Their oppressors used Christianity to justify their enslavement and "keep them in their place" with "pie in the sky" religion.

    Wait for this trigger event and then fire at them to make those walls collapse.

    http://gbgm-umc.org/UMW/Joshua/joshua8.stm

  • truthseeker
    truthseeker

    Might it have something to do with this?

    http://www.jwreform.org/

    What is the JWRM?
    An Introduction

    The Jehovah's Witnesses Reformation Movement is a growing group of Christians consisting of both current Jehovah's Witnesses in good standing and former members who have either disassociated themselves over issues of conscience or who have been disfellowshipped (excommunicated) from the group because they vocalized their concerns about mistakes made or injustices committed by the Witness leadership. This movement recognizes the value of the religion of Jehovah's Witnesses but sees an urgent need for fundamental reform in the manner in which the Governing Body exercises control and authority over the general membership. The reform movement feels the present system is not properly patterned after the first century Christian congregation's own administrative order, nor does it reflect the original spirit of our religious denomination or of true Christianity itself and has led to spiritual, emotional, and sometimes physical harm to servants of God worldwide.

    The reformation movement operates outside of the functioning government of Jehovah's Witnesses only because it has to. The hierarchical pyramid of authority in the religion is purposely designed to make true reformation an impossibility. Only those in power are permitted to effect change, but, as we are all well aware, those who hold power, no matter how sincere or well-intentioned, have the tendency to want to hold onto it for as long as possible. The sort of reform called for here is not likely to happen from the top down, because it would require the leaders to relinquish some of their control and authority over the worldwide membership. In fact, history has shown that those with the most power in the organization have consistently been resistant to change (a natural human tendency). Therefore, like faithful servants of God in times past, our people feel it is their duty before Jehovah to speak up and speak out when the need arises. As did the Lord Jesus himself, we do not look the other way when we see any injustice done to God's people.

    Though we appreciate the good that the organization has done, we realize that it is not above reproof, and that reproof does not come only from God himself directly to the Governing Body without a human mouthpiece. No, as Paul (who was not a member of the body of elders in Jerusalem) spoke out publicly about the misdeeds of Peter (a member of the Twelve) and published it in an epistle (Gal. 2:14), so we, even those of the lesser ones of the members of the worldwide brotherhood, are compelled to say something when the need arises. We mean no disrespect to the brothers in charge, but only cry out in defense of the "lesser ones" and hope that those who can do something will hear us and act. As the old widow in Jesus' parable kept pestering the judge until he finally heeded her, so we call and call again until we are heard (Luke 18:7).

    The reason reform has not been possible in the past is because the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses does not permit members of the religion to speak to one another about any problems they see in the leadership of the organization. Although individual members are allowed to contact the Governing Body directly about concerns they may have, they never know if their feelings are shared by others. They are told to speak once and then forever hold their peace, trusting that the leadership will do the right thing. In this way, the Governing Body, knowing there is power in numbers, prevents dissension from growing and allows itself to disregard such voices if it so desires and leaves no one the wiser. This system of silencing those who dissent, in fact, is one of the items of concern to the reform movement and something that needs to change. Under the current regulations, anyone who disagrees publicly with the leadership of Jehovah's Witnesses in any way subjects himself or herself to serious discipline, and those who refuse to recant are disfellowshipped from the organization and shunned by all. Such a practice is neither called for nor condoned in the Bible, the book that the organization claims to follow.

    At the left, you will see listed the three major areas in which we see the urgent need for reform in the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses. If you find that you agree with what is being said (either in whole or in part) and wish to stand up for Jehovah, for the Bible, and for what is right, and to help the organization overcome its weaknesses to the benefit of all, you can help. It is felt by the reform movement that the best course of action at present is twofold: 1) to spread the message to all current members about what beneficial changes can be made in the organization, and 2) to engage actively in a letter campaign, expressing our concerns to as many individuals at the higher levels of the organization as possible. We plan to send letters periodically and to have them signed by as many people as possible. We believe that the more signers we have, the more the leaders of Jehovah's Witnesses will take notice and be motivated to act. We ask that you join us in the cause and sign. We also ask that you tell others about what we are trying to do here. By acting together, and praying together, our words may have an effect. Our movement brings together those whom the Governing Body would isolate so that no challenge to their authority will ever arise with sufficient force to move them in a direction they do not wish to go. Those days are over. We strongly believe that the religious leaders of Jehovah's Witnesses will receive a heavy judgment from Jehovah if they continue on their present course with regard to these matters. It is time for change. It is our hope and our faith that through the voice of his people, Jehovah will see to it that matters are set straight.

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    What Belbab said made sense, the organization may be expanding the attorney/client privilege to men at the
    local level and abandoning any clergy privilege.

    I like a good conspiracy as much as the next guy, but Attorn lost me when he suggested a "trigger."
    That lends itself to foreseeing the trigger, or else knowing that it was pulled already, or knowing what will
    cause it AND sensing that this event will happen. JW's are not smart enough for all that.

    I like the information on the JWRM. That would explain the conspiracy and all, but it couldn't be like
    the JWRM is a major player in the WTS arena. It wouldn't be like a Democrat to the GB Republicans
    (like the two-party politics of USA). It would be more like a third-party to their established two-parties.
    Third parties are still small and squashable. Third parties are almost insignificant. I am all for them, but
    they have a long way to go.

    I say this because I am certain that nobody has been recruiting at local levels to join the JWRM. If it's a
    bunch in Bethel, then they are near the top, but have no support. The GB pulls at the strings. We would
    certainly know if a JWRM was recruiting at local levels. There are scores of people at JWD who would have
    been recruited.

    I always post my wild speculations, so this thread has given me much to think about.
    Legal and physical protection of the money- that's the bottom line. This other stuff- wait and see.

    Oh- any splintering of the WTS would be a good thing in my opinion. It is always best to divide and conquer.
    The rank and file would be severely weakened by a power struggle. A power struggle can happen. Even
    without the conspiracy theory, WTS has had it's power struggles. It can happen at Ted's passing.

  • leftbelow
    leftbelow

    Truthseeker that is a very interesting site it would be great if they were successfull but I will believe it when I see it.

  • skeeter1
    skeeter1

    The lawyer/client privilege usually only applies if the document is prepared due to pending litigation. So routine stuff is still discoverable. Also, the lawyer/client privilege usually only goes to the lawyer's impression & write up of the case & the client's discussions. It does not go to the underlying "crime" or evidence. Thus, you can not use the lawyer/client privilege to dispose of a body. Also, the lawyer can not use the privilege to commit an illegal act. Lawyer could get disbarred for that. But, this will make each case have another layer in which the Watchtower can launch appeal after appeal. The Watchtower is as crafty as the Devil for which they are. Skeeter

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut
    lawyer/client privilege usually only goes to the lawyer's impression & write up of the case & the client's discussions. It does not go to the underlying "crime" or evidence.

    Evidence has to be ruled on. There is no "crime" in reporting to WTS lawyers. There may be
    problems with the rules, but that's what the big meeting could be about- covering their asses in
    the events, or throwing the publisher to the wolves followed by the elder, but saving the precious
    organization from the lawsuit.

  • dawg
    dawg

    Truthseeker's post is interesting, but what will become of a religion who's adherants can question authority... just look at the Catholics now, the JWs will be one and the same, but their numbers will grow.

  • Lo-ru-hamah
    Lo-ru-hamah

    I don't believe that Barr is the apostate. At the last DC that we attended he was the bethel speaker (two and a half years ago Ft. Worth, TX). I went up to speak to him and give him the green handshake. His eyes looked completely empty and he is just really really old. I was hoping to feel something that made me change my mind about the org. Obviously didn't work. He didn't seem to have the ability to be fighting with anyone but I could be wrong. Not like that hasn't happened before.

    Sheri

  • sf
    sf
    It is possible that this fragile construct recently collapsed....

    altaltalt

  • 5go
    5go

    All I know is we seem to be getting a lot of newbies now.

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