Do you still believe? (page 9)

daniel-p

"Daniel, OK, lets figure it out. It's very simple. Clear and honest observation is all. I offer nothing. You, hold the answers already.
Sit back and bring up some of the religious, philosophical or intellectual explanations of life that you have gathered throughout the years. Look closely at them as you list a few favorite ones within the mind. Now notice what is not on the list; notice what is looking.
Can you see and feel that conscious-awareness is closer and more intimately self, as compared to all the mental stuff you can see? What is more real? the mental stuff gathered, or that which sees it all?
Now then, shift attention onto the present-moment of awareness which silently witnesses all, and give less attention on the beliefs and conceptual jabber of the mind, and see what aliveness, what reality and actuality has been missed. Look closer and closer into the profound and immediate presence of your being, and see if you can find a boundary, bottom or wall. You're going into an area closer and vaster than the mind, so don't use mental interpretation as your flashlight, but rather the raw reality of silent existence.
This is a very different way to view and investigate into life, using life itself, rather than thoughts about life, to expose reality. It may take some time. Inquire sincerely, honestly and diligently into everything you have come to believe yourself to be, and see what is real and what is not. Who/what, are you, really?
You need go no where but where you already are. You need join no church or group. You need not earn or evolve. Just be......and see what is real and actual already."

OK, I can understand this, I think. I'll try this out when I have some time. Right now I've been hopping back and forth between work and JWD for the past few hours and I'm not in a the right frame of mind.

LittleToe

Daniel:
You come across as a little pissed, but I confess that I could be completely misreading the situation, especially as you sound busy - this medium sux, sometimes

Taking that as a premise: are you more pissed with me, for calling you on what I perceive as your judgmentalism; James, for suggesting there's another way of looking at life; or with yourself, for saying something that Narkissos could correct you on in a public forum?

Of course, I could be talking a load of shyte, in which case feel free to call me on it

onesong

A couple of things from the Power of Now that that help me that points to where JamesThomas is going (I think).

-Feel your body from the inside , notice the life , all of your cells tingling and dancing. Feel it in your fingers, toes ect. the more you can do this and not think, just feel, it brings you into the present or sense of being which is Consciousness and reality.

-Notice not the objects of a room but the space. Space or nothingness is what allows the physical to "stand out and exist". When you focus on space (the world of spirit) your attention is drawn to your true and higher self.

-When someone speaks to you listen with your whole being. If you listen only with your mind your mind is constantly running ahead with thought and this is where miscommunication comes in. Sit back, don't think and allow the speaker space to be and express. It's a great compliment because this person knows your connecting deeply and all your relationships are enhanced.

From Adyashanti : Find the observer of you. For example if I say "I am Onesong" who is the "I". Step back and watch your mind and physical body. The watcher is your true self.

purplesofa

I read The Power of Now.........I thought it was a great book. As JT wrote me, he has read it several times and each time it brings different meaning to light.........I think it is time to read it again.

I find that when I am in the here and now.........present time...........your relationships are richer.......the daily things you do have more purpose. You enjoy simpler things. People respond differently, more truthful, and pure with you..........it is kinda raw........It is nearly impossible to lie when living for NOW. It cuts right through all the BS people dish out and needlessly go through.

The past is not so regretful and the future is not so scarey.

I believe that there can be a time on this planet.......or somewhere.........that we will evolve to a place where all this won't need to be hashed out any longer. I don't think it has anything to do with what religion is the right one. It will be individual people with the fortitude to keep going at any cost, enveloping whatever it takes to perservere. I think the bible is just one avenue for some people to achieve this.

blah blah blah.

purps

poppers

Hi onesong. I am glad you have discovered Tolle. What he does is give tips on how to circumvent the mind, and he calls these "portals" to now. By putting attention on something other than thoughts, feelings, and sensations one can realize that they are not one's thoughts, feelings, or sensations, but are instead the awareness in which all of these appear.
Each of these portals leads to the same thing, thoughtless awareness. This awareness is what you really are. When this is seen the belief in the "little me", as Tolle calls it, falls away. The "little me", or egoic sense, is seen to come and go, while the awareness in which the egoic sense arises is always here. The "little me" is temporary, but you as consciousness itself are always here.
Without the constraints of the egoic sense one is left in peace, contentment, and fulfilment, for those are the very nature of awareness, one's true nature.
Tolle and Adyashanti are complementary with eachother, as is Gangaji.

DigitalFokus

Too be honest I have to idea what I believe. Before I got mixed up with the dubs I was going to a Lutheran Church, and church really had no effect on me then. I just saw it as a place where my family dropped 20 bucks into the contrib box and then I would try not to fall asleep during the boring ass surmons.

So from there the dubs were my next spiritual experience. And that did not go the best to say the least. If there is a God, he hasn't done shit for me. And he hasn't answsered one pray said in earnest or protected my family in one way. I see all religion as different forms of control, power and capitolism.

Some times I do look up and wonder why I am here or whats going to happen to me when I die, and I haven't come up with an answer besides pure instinct; we are here to reproduce and then die. And do so in a, for the most part, horrible enviroment.

Maybe the dubs influenced my current beliefs. I really don't know. Once I was out of the borg, I never gave religion or spirtuality a second thought.

Saoirse

I believe in the Christian God, not the Jehovah God of the Watchtower.

After leaving the JWs I was very mixed up and confused. I searched just about every path and belief there is. Watchtower brainwashing kept me from examining Christianity for 10 years. When I did, I felt as if I had finally found my home.

Chimene

I believe in the Christian God, not the Jehovah God of the Watchtower.

Me to! Thru Jesus of course.

I've been busy all weekend, getting ready to move, YEAH! But I see I have missed a lot of discussion. I will try to catch up this week! Thank you all for you input!

Lo-ru-hamah

There are times that I find it somewhat difficult to believe that God and Jesus are still allowing all the bad to continue. It causes some doubts but my desire to want to believe in something bigger than myself is overwhelming. So, I cannot walk away from Jehovah, YHWH, or any other name you want to give Him, or Jesus. That said, my opinion of why JW's turn athiest and don't want to believe any longer in God is because the organization has monopolized God and Jesus so much that they, the organization and God and Jesus, are one. So, when witnesses become aware of the lies and hypocracy that exist in their "beloved" organization and they leave, they then have to leave Jehovah and Jesus because they are all one in the same. I feel that some continue to believe in God and Christ because they have been able to seperate the organization from them and realize that they, the organization, Jehovah and Jesus, are not the same thing. And they can begin to heal their anger at God and Jesus once they realize that the organization is just another tool of Satan to try and take glory away from its rightful source.

Just my opinion, nothing more.

Loruhamah

daniel-p

"Taking that as a premise: are you more pissed with me, for calling you on what I perceive as your judgmentalism; James, for suggesting there's another way of looking at life; or with yourself, for saying something that Narkissos could correct you on in a public forum?

Of course, I could be talking a load of shyte, in which case feel free to call me on it"

Hmm... how about all the above. But no really, I know I can be judgemental at times - I need to work on that. I don't mind getting corrected publicly, it happens all the time believe me - I deserve it too, I talk a lot of shit sometimes. If I sound confrontational its probably because I am doing some design work right now and my professor is an egotistic asshole and I'm envisioning all the things he's gonna say about the project and I start getting pissed off before I'm even done.

Do you still believe?

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