UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

by MacHislopp 501 Replies latest watchtower scandals

• 

  MadApostate

  I posted this in another thread, but since the discussed issue seems to be lost on some people, I'm posting this also in this main WTS-UN thread:

  _______________________

  The UN clearly distinguishes which entities may become MEMBERS (GOVERNMENTS), and which entities may become ASSOCIATES (NON-GOVERNMENT ORGANIZATIONS).

  If people run around mixing up the terminology saying that "the WTS is a UN Member", they will look like either fools or liars to any JW who researches the matter.

  Using the proper terminology DOES NOT LESSEN THE WTS's CULPABILITY. They have voluntarily requested to formally associate/attach themselves to the UN the ONLY way that a non-governmental organization can do so, which is exactly the same thing that other religious organizations have done. That places the WTS on the exact same footing as those who they condemn as "riders of the image of the beast".

  The difference between a MEMBER of the UN and an ASSOCIATED NGO is exactly the same as the difference between the IMAGE OF THE WILD BEAST and the GREAT HARLOT who sits on/rides the IMAGE.

  A MEMBER (government) is part of the Beast.

  An ASSOCIATE (religious or other type NGO) is part of the Harlot.

  Is that an argument over semantics?
• 

  cyberguy

  TO: MacHislopp

  Regarding your statement:

  ____________________________________________________________________
  Messenger: "The guidlines offered by the Society have for years set standards for Christian conduct. Certain guidlines have serious implications for a Christian's decision could bring dire consequences, for example:

  1. Join the military automatic-DA.
  2. Willful blood transfusion automatic-DA.
  3. Join YMCA automatic-DA.
  4. Vote automatic-DA.
  ___________________________________________________________________

  Is voting still an automatic DA? True, I know of no retraction of the DA steps to be taken as outlined in the elder's book for one who votes (at least in the US), but isn't voting permitted in some countries due to the recent change as noted in the Question from Readers a few years back? Also, might not the Society's support for the UN since '91 and their subsequent changes on voting and progressive changes on blood, be related?
• 

  Trevor Scott

  msil:

  I have no doubt you are right. But in the meantime, I hope to reach one or two souls.

  My opinion, the WTS will "win" no matter what. If they are not kicked out of the UN-DPI, they will still "win", only it will be in the form of "new light" to the effect that the UN is not the beast/disgusting thing after all! Either way, we only have a short window of time. Let's move on this one while the gun is still smoking!

  MA:

  You're correct, and I agree it's a point worth repeating. The WTS is not a "member" of the UN. Rather they have an official association with the UN (an association which they applied for!). It probably is semantics, but as you say, it's something a dub could harp on if we get it mixed up.

  TS,
• 

  dungbeetle

  <"Also, might not the Society's support for the UN since '91 and their subsequent changes on voting and progressive changes on blood, be related">

  Absolutely. And may I add to that alternative military service. It will soon be apparent to any JW 'on the fence'that spiritual direction is out the window, and this is directly related to money and property just as much as the 'mess in Mexico' was. Just my 1/2 cent worth.

  Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...

  dungbeetle...roll, roll, roll that dung!
• 

  hawkaw

  Msil,

  I really don't like being called an idiot but I guess if you have to so be it.

  You said

  For instance. I sent my father an email about this. He is a loyal dub. His response was "how do we prove it is true"? 2 others I spoke with today have said the same. The right way is to designate someone like yourself to come here, formulate ideas and then have the designated person go back to the UN. Obtaining complete information is needed. Guaranteeing that people can link to the URL and see for themselves is far more powerful. If the DPI removes the WT entry from the roster it will then be MUCH less effective and harder to prove.

  So your hole thing is getting all the informaton?

  The complete information has already been obtained. Its at the UN's own web site. If it so important to your Dad, then tell him to VERIFY it by - TELEPHONING THEM PERSONALLY OR CAN"T YOU AFFORD THE CALL? - I have given you a person contact AND THE TELEPHONE NUMBER for crying out loud. I even got you the documents that they had to fill out.

  Anything more I get is just icing on the cake that cult members would say are fake documents etc. I have requested those documents in writing yesterday but it is unlikely I will get the aplications, references financials etc. for confidentiality reasons.

  Quite frankly if the DPI removes them (which is very unlikely) don't you think there would be a few press releases and letters from the UN's DPI proving the WTS was removed.

  You don't get it do you. The WTS NEEDS the DPI association. It is their key to looking like an official religious group that doesn't violate human rights issues. Thus, they can get religious status in Russia etc. Take the DPI away from the WTS or "sick" the DPI on the WTS you hurt the organization - financially and with the governments and press of the world. This puts the WTS in a position like it has never faced in a long time. It needs DPI to continue - DPI could force the WTS to stop its human rights abuses. DPI could help you more than you know.

  Anyway, the WTS saw this thread along time ago and is already drawing up it battle plan long ago. They would have come out with their spin and you couldn't stop it if you tried and I can't believe you missed that point.

  Any way there is no organized group going at this and there never will be. I have just tried to help, spending my own money and my own time. I have given you the date when it started, the people in the WTS involved, the forms they have to fill out and who to contact. I may get more. I have spent a lot of time and my own money helping people like you find out about this. And it all should be made public once found. And if you have to call me an idiot because I gave stuff to help you and possibly your Dad well so be it.

  hawk
• 

  msil

  Hawk - for the record.

  I am not critical of your actions at all. You have been one of the more rational people dealing with this issue.

  I appreciate what you have done. There are others though who have advocated methods which will be less than effective.
• 

  hawkaw

  Thx Msil,

  Sorry if I sounded harsh. I was having a bad night last night

  I'm trying with what I have got and will let you know more next week if I get anything else.

  Trevor Scott has got a good letter on another thread that may help get the word out as well.

  hawk
• 

  Had Enough

  I am in absolute shock.

  First of all, I can't believe I almost missed this whole topic. Not knowing what NGO meant in the subject of the thread, I stupidly didn't even open in until a chat buddy asked me what I thought of it. duh!

  (ps-thanks, my friend) I spent all of last evening reading this and the other threads on this subject.

  Most of all though, I am in shock that yet another deceitful and immoral act has been carried on right under my nose while I was still active as a JW. They are doing the very opposite of what I believed they "said" they were doing...that is taking a stand against the "kings" and rulers and governments of the world...while also keeping unspotted from any association with Babylon the Great.

  Association????...now they've jumped right into bed with her AND the wild beast.

  How can they possibly justify this? Didn't they "yell from the rooftops" how different we are from the rest of the world, so clean and pure in our worship?

  Now its OK to use whatever underhanded method possible to "further their kingdom news"? Join hands with Babylon the Great and ride on the back of the wild beast....as long as we can get recognition and therefore get favours from the governments of the world?

  Where is that written in the bible?

  I'm sure they're going to try to softpedal this travisty by saying they're not "joining" the UN...they're "not a part of the UN", but they can't escape the black and white description of their duties and obligations they agreed to uphold in order to become an NGO.

  My sincerest thanks to MacHislopp and hawkaw for all your work and enthusiasm in bring this to our attention...and to all the rest of you who have contributed to making this known to others who need to know.

  I too want to start making this known....it can't be allowed to be swept under the rug as the borg has done with so many other things.
• 

  nonjw

  Hello all, as you can see this is my 1st post here. I have not had time to read the other topics yet, but am looking forward to it. My reason for posting is to offer help if I can. I have in my possesion Watchtower magazines dating from 1988 to 1998. I am missing a few from 1988. I also have Awake! magazines from 1990 to 1997. If anyone knows of any info contained in these publications that would be helpful in this cause, I would be happy to copy or fax upon request. As for reading them all myself....I don't think the spirit in me could "stomach" it.

  Thanks to all for providing this information!!
• 

  bluesapphire

  "My opinion, the WTS will "win" no matter what. If they are not kicked out of the UN-DPI, they will still "win", only it will be in the form of "new light" to the effect that the UN is not the beast/disgusting thing after all! Either way, we only have a short window of time. Let's move on this one while the gun is still smoking!"

  THE WATCHTOWER SOCIETY WILL LOOOOOSSEEE WITH THIS ONE!

  No matter what they do, we have proof they have been members since 1991. Even if they come up with "new" light it will be 10 years old! If they come up with new light it will HELP OUR CAUSE, not harm it. No matter what happens, they will lose this battle!

  Give this example to the witness who says, yes but they are only "associates" and they are "only involved in the UN for civil liberties...." Say: "Okay, so a publisher can solicit a hooker, pay her required fees, take her up into the motel room just so he could witness to her?" The obvious answer is NO WAY! Yet the WTS has solicited the beast, paid her required fees (which was to pledge allegeance to it), got her into the motel room only to USE her for civil liberties rights in other countries. Doesn't fly. No matter how you look at it, they had an affair with the beast.

  I am tickled! I mean it. I am actually giddy over this! Let's stop bickering and celebrate!