If its good, God did it... if its bad Satan did it....

by Elsewhere 162 Replies latest jw friends

  • heathen

    JOBs kids apparently didn't take the worship as seriously as JOB did , so GOD felt justified in all this , that's the good part about being GOD, you get to make calls like that and the worse anybody can do to you is call you names ..... God lets the sun come up on the wicked as well as the righteous ......

  • micheal
    that's the good part about being GOD, you get to make calls like that and the worse anybody can do to you is call you names

    Okay, I'll start

    God is a murderous knob.

  • Tim Horton
    Tim Horton

    Mulan said: "I can't believe the space on this thread used to debate a piece of fiction. Good grief!"

  • Navigator

    This thread indicates erroneous thinking on several levels:

    Error #`1-That God created this world.

    Error #2-That the bible is a reliable document.

    Error #3-That a power other than God even exists.

    Error #4-That our experience in this world is anything other than a bad dream.

    Actually #3 is the key. Everything else stems from the belief in duality.

  • LittleToe

    How did I miss this thread?
    I just read the firwst page before responding, so I'll read the rest soon and see how far down my throat I pushed my foot. I just want to take up the following premise upon which the discussion is based and where Elsewhere writes:

    When all was said and done, Adam and Eve did not die for hundreds of years...

    That very day their relationship with "God" was wrecked. I personally have little doubt that man was going to physically die anyhow, and simple biology would attest to this (as you also commented on in the DNA thread).

    ...and they did, in fact, gain the knowledge of good and evil.

    It would seem that they had plenty of knowledge of good, to begin with. The new knowledge seemed to surround "evil" and the differences between that and good, it would seem.

    It sounds like God lied and Satan freed them from slavery to ignorance.

    Personally I'd love to be ignorant of evil. The knowledge of it doesn't do much positive for me.
    Yayy, Satan - three pips!!! Hip, hip, hooray

    God acted to punish them for this.

    You're reading something into the text that isn't there. He wasn't punishing them for their ignorance, or freedom thereof, in that account. They were given a list of instructions (not just "don't eat that fruit") and in the case of the tree a consequence, which occured.

  • Terry

    Jesus, as I recall, instructed his followers to forgive.

    He even emphasized his admonition by employing math!

    70x7 times one is to forgive.

    Adam and Eve were not forgiven for failing to follow instructions.

    The WT always uses the peculiar argument that they were "perfect" and don't deserve forgiveness.

    Perfect IS as perfect DOES.

    The only test of perfection I read about in Genesis was FAILED by Adam and Eve. So, how they can be perfect and yet not be perfect is beyond my powers of comprehension.

    More to the point:

    Why forgive a sinful, imperfect human 70x7 times and not forgive a "fresh start" human for being mislead, lied to, deceived; considering that by NOT FORGIVING them millions of people would consequently die?

    Something is rotten in all this.

    If you owned two rabbits and they contracted a disease; would it make any sense at all to let them breed? You'd end up with hundreds of rabbits with disease; wouldn't you? Would it not be better to take the first two rabbits to the vet and get them injected and cured?

    If the first two rabbits cannot be cured for whatever reason; why let them breed?

    So too with humans.

  • LittleToe

    Doesn't "perfect" mean "fit for purpose"?
    Why do we have to get all fuzzy when we use that word, as if it's a role only held by supermen and women? DId Adam suddenly not have laserbeam eyes, or something?

    Also, how do we know that Adam and Eve weren't forgiven?
    We know that they had actions and consequences (from the story) but why does that preclude them taking advantage of "grace"?

  • Princess

    LT, do you read the account as a true story?

  • LittleToe

    I see it as a story used to explain man's disconnection from the divine (whether that being mental or literal, being neither here nor there).
    I don't think God suddenly recreated man to physically die. The biological evidence contradicts.

  • Princess

    hmmmm...well, seems like he could have come up with a better story.

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