by Lobsto 154 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Scholar
Certainly 586/587 BCE for the destruction of Jerusalem is well accepted by scholars worldwide. Why do you think this is the case? Are there people in academia out there trying to hide the truth? Do you know of any scholars without Watchtower affiliation that support 607 BCE? What non-biblical evidence do such scholars cite to support 607?
Lee T
Congratulations on doing the course but Why did you not get your Certificate? It is a pity that you did not buy the test book because it provides a massive amount of detail of the history for that Period and so valuable to have to hand if one wished to dive into this debate. I still have my essays so I may forward them to you if I feel inclined but send me your email address anyway and I will have to sort through my files.
COJ discusses the case of the Egibi business documents in his GTR, 2004,pp.122-5 which provide no evidence of the 'twenty-year' gap between Bible Chronology and Neo-Babylonian Chronology thus far. So one must make a choice between the Biblical history of the Period and the contemporary documents of the Babylonians. What must be explained is the silence of the Babylonian records pertaining to the missing seven-year reign of Nebuchadnezzer and the omission of any mention of the seventy years hegemony over Judah and the other serving nations roundabout? Such silence or indifference hardly puts a stake through WT Bible Chronology.
I would argue that the length of the Neo-Babylonian Period is problematic and far from settled as it has not accounted for the twenty-year Gap proved by the 70 years of Babylonian domination
scholar
Vanderhoven7
That is the problem. Scholars cannot agree as to the precise calendar year for the Fall of Jerusalem whether it 586 or 587 BCE. It must be either one of these otherwise you have an imprecise methodology. Celebrated WT scholars have nailed by clearly establishing 607 BCE as the only correct and possible date. The reason for their confusion is their failure to account for the biblical 70 Years so it comes down to sloppy methodology.
scholar
Sloppy methodology for a 1 year difference does not mean the date must or even could be 20 years out. There should be a few non-WT affiliated scholars here and there that support 607 BCE. Can you name just 1 or 2 such scholars?
The reason for their confusion is their failure to account for the biblical 70 Years so it comes down to sloppy methodology.
Why should secular scholars take, not a biblical event, but a biblical prophecy into account...a prophecy by the way that is controversial in and of itself as this thread demonstrates? That would be sloppy methodology.
One non-WT affiliated scholar...is what I am looking for.
johnamos
Yes, you must improve your comprehension skills and pay close attention to the Society's reply to your letter and to my posts mon this subject.
Chronology is a complex subject and not for the faint-hearted, further, it requires the skills of an exegete as many of the relevant texts are difficult to interpret so one must consult scholarly journals and Bible commentaries.
Jer. 25:11 describes the period of Babylonian domination over Judah and the nations for seventy years concurrent with Judah being desolate for that same period of seventy years. The following verse, vs12 begins a new pericope with the judgment of Babylon the city, its King and the land which commence after the 70 years was completed which would be 537 BCE and not before such as 539 BCE.
Babylon being called to account began after the 70 years was fulfilled and not before and such accounting is descriptive of that land becoming desolate as with the other nations including Judah.
You ask 2 questions and my answers are as follows:
A.1. Babylon was a World Power for 68 years 607 BCE-539 BCE
A.2. Unknown as there is no historical information for those nations with the exception of Judah whereupon we have the 70 years of Jeremiah-servitude, exile, and desolation which ran from 607 BCE until 537 BCE and a further 10 years of vassalage to Babylon which increased the totality of servitude of Babylonian domination to 80 years to be historically accurate.
scholar
Vanderhoven7
Chronology is about accuracy, about assigning specific dates for specific events in history so there is no room for fuzziness especially when WT critics lambast 607 for being wrong when such critics cannot say what is the correct date, Such hypocrisy!
I do not know of any non-WT scholars that support 607 and it does not matter one iota if we are the only champions of that date for I am perfectly relaxed about the matter.
Prophecy becomes history when fulfilled so what we are studying is both History and prophecy and that is why both must be examined in their respective contexts.
When you find that nonaffiliated WT scholar let me know so I can introduce him or her into the community of celebrated WT scholars
scholar
quote - Yes, you must improve your comprehension skills and pay close attention to the Society's reply to your letter and to my posts mon this subject. - end quote
LOL!!! My letter? Labsto is the one that wrote the letter and started this thread. Maybe you should pay a little closer attention. :)
Anyway, you say Babylon was a world power for 68 years.
Okay, if Assyria was the 2nd world power and Babylon was the 3rd world power and you say that Babylon became a world power in 607, then PLEASE tell me what year did Assyria cease being the 2nd world power?
Scholar: I do not know of any non-WT scholars that support 607
... and there it is.
johnamos
My apologies. I have wrapped myself over the knuckles for my stupidity for I got caught up in the heat of the moment with all these responses to the posts on this subject.
The date for Assyria's ending as a World Power is problematic but the accepted Date is 609 BCE and that is fine with me because it has absolutely nothing to do with the beginning of the 70 years.
scholar
Sanchy
What a pity for it sort of reminds one of the words at 1John 5;20.
scholar
