"Witnesses Now For Jesus" convention ...

by borgfree 101 Replies latest jw friends

  • flower

    ugh, I went to one of those .... it was everything I knew it would be a WHINEFEST for xjws. People sitting around and crying "woe is me" "look at what teh Society did to me, boo hoo hoo."

    And then you walked into the lobby and everyone and their mothers are selling books on the Witnesses.

    With all due respect RR, there are many people in the organization that need this information. You call it whining but it was these kind of stories and knowing that I wasnt the only one going through this stuff that led me out of that organization. This board and ones like it are just a stepping stone but I never would have trusted this to be true if not for the people who put together things like the BRCI or this convention.

    It sounds like whining to you now because you have heard it all so many times and you have moved past all the pain and damage caused by the org but imagine that you are alone in that organization trying to figure out why you are so fucked up and why Jehovah hates you so much. Its those stories and those books that change or even save peoples lives.

    There is nothing wrong with you getting on with your life but please dont disrespect or degrade people that dont or cant get on with their lives or who chose to make it their lifes work to help other people who do not know that they arent the only ones going through what they are going through.

    Everyone is different, everyone was abused to different degrees and some not at all, everyone has the right to chose how they heal or how they want to live the rest of their lives. Respect that even if you disagree.


  • sunstarr


    Would you please explain to us how you can possibly use the Bible in defense of your beliefs? You claim that the Bible is only for the "chosen ones." You further state that those who are chosen will only be known at "the end." You then quote scripture after scripture to back up your beliefs. Is this not a contradiction? You might as well throw your Bible away because it will do you no good until the end when it is determined whether or not you are "chosen." Then, provided you are among the chosen, you can come back and cite verses in your defense. But.....by then, won't it be a little late?

    Circles, my friend. Circles.

  • pomegranate


    Your handle fits you. Nyuk nyuk nyuk. Anyways...

    People in the Corinthian congregation were pulling the same stunt, claiming already "saved" before it happened. Paul
    rebuked them:

    1 Cor 4:7-14
    7 For who makes you different from anyone else? What do you have that you did not receive? And IF you did receive it [Paul was DOUBTING some of them receiving the Holy Spirit], why do you boast as though you did not?

    Now there's an interesting point. Those that boast about what they MAY have been given, mean that DID NOT RECEIVE it because they were boasting about it. Hmmm.

    8 Already you have all you want! [Being saved already with eternal life?] Already you have become rich! [Being saved already with eternal life?] You have become kings-and that without us! [By being saved already with eternal life BEFORE THE APOSTLES??] How I wish that you really had become kings so that we might be kings with you! [Paul wasn't even saved yet, how is they were claiming such a wrongful boast?]
    It sounds to me like some in the Corintian congregation were claiming being saved before it actually happened. Don't you? Paul was saying, "Corinthian brothers, How is that true, that you claim to have it all before us? We the Apostles, are all still dirt bags countering bad with good, but you have it ALL already? You are kings already? Saved already? NOT!!!"

    9 For it seems to me that God has put us apostles on display at the end of the procession [Still dirtbags, not saved yet], like men condemned to die in the arena. [Dirtbags, not saved yet] We have been made a spectacle to the whole universe [Dirtbags, not saved yet], to angels as well as to men. [Dirtbags to everyone, men and angels, not saved yet] 10 We are fools for Christ, [Dirtbags, not saved yet] but you are so wise in Christ! [WE ARE SAVED BECAUSE WE SAY SO] We are weak, [Dirtbags, not saved yet] but you are strong! [WE ARE SAVED BECAUSE WE SAY SO] You are honored [WE ARE SAVED BECAUSE WE SAY SO], we are dishonored! [Dirtbags, not saved yet] 11 To this very hour we go hungry and thirsty [dirtbag], we are in rags [dirtbag], we are brutally treated [dirtbag], we are homeless [dirtbag]. 12 We work hard with our own hands. [dirtbag dirtbag] When we are cursed, we bless; when we are persecuted, we endure it; 13 when we are slandered, we answer kindly. Up to this moment we have become the scum of the earth, [dirtbag] the refuse of the world [dirtbag].
    14 I am not writing this to shame you, but to warn you [YOU ARE NOT SAVED YET] , as my dear children.

    You've been kindly warned NM.


    You claim that the Bible is only for the "chosen ones."
    It is not my claim, it is obvious to me by much of how the writers and the audience of intent was identified in the Book itself:

    2 John
    1:1 The elder (a chosen one), To the chosenlady and her children (other chosen ones),

    2 John 13
    The children of your chosen sister send their greetings.

    Eph 1:11
    In him we were also chosen, (one chosen talking to other chosen)

    Acts 1:2-3
    the Holy Spirit to the apostles he had chosen. (more chosen)

    Acts 1:24-25
    24 Then they prayed, "Lord, you know everyone's heart. Show us which of these two you have chosen 25 to take over this apostolic ministry, which Judas left to go where he belongs." (God choosing a chosen again)

    Acts 9:15-16
    15 But the Lord said to Ananias, "Go! This man is my chosen instrument to carry my name before the Gentiles and their kings and before the people of Israel. 16 I will show him how much he must suffer for my name." (The choosey God strikes again.)

    Acts 22:14
    14 "Then he said: 'The God of our fathers has chosen you to know his will and to see the Righteous One and to hear words from his mouth. (Choosey choosey)

    Rom 8:32-34
    Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? (Will you deny the choosey God?) It is God who justifies.

    Rom 11:5-6
    So too, at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace. (Choose clues, a little comic relief there.)

    Rom 16:12-13
    Greet Rufus, chosen in the Lord, (it's all for the chosen)

    Col 1:27
    27 To them God has chosen to make known among the Gentiles the glorious riches of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory. (More chosen people by God)

    Col 3:12
    Therefore, as God's chosen people, holy and dearly loved, clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience. (chosen people, chosen by God. The book is for them.)

    1 Thess 1:4
    4 For we know, brothers loved by God, that he has chosen you, (one chosen dude to a bunch o' other chosen dudes)

    James 2:5-6
    Has not God chosen those who are poor in the eyes of the world to be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom he promised those who love him? (Chosen people, chosen by God. All in the book of the chosen)

    1 Peter 1:1-2
    To God's elect, strangers in the world, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, 2 who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, for obedience to Jesus Christ and sprinkling by his blood:

    (The above has it TWICE. The elected and the chosen, already foreknown by God. Now that's WAY KEEEWWWWWLLL, huh?)

    1 Peter 1:19-20
    Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect. 20 He was chosen before the creation of the world, (Sheesh. Wouldn't ya know it, even Christ was a chosen.)

    1 Peter 2:4
    4 As you come to him, the living Stone-rejected by men but chosen by God and precious to him- (Christ again stated as chosen.)

    1 Peter 2:9
    9 But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God, t

    1 Peter 5:13
    13 She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark.

    I may be wrong, but it sure seems like a book written by the chosen for the chosen. Can you show me from the book any other possible explaination? I'm all ears...er...I mean eyes!

    Good day.

    Edited by - pomegranate on 30 August 2002 14:26:55

  • sunstarr

    Label me surprised....you didn't answer the question. Instead you redirected to a supposed mistake in my choice of words. Very reminiscent of JW's. Oh well. Thanks, anyway.

  • RR
    You should give it another try.

    Ah, no thanks. Once is enough!

  • RR
    There is nothing wrong with you getting on with your life but please dont disrespect or degrade people that dont or cant get on with their lives or who chose to make it their lifes work to help other people who do not know that they arent the only ones going through what they are going through.

    With all due respect Flower, quite often, I don't see a real difference between some of these xjws turn counsellors and the JW's themselves.

    People like Duane Magnani have built financial empires trying to expose what they believe is "cultic." As if they have to either undo whatr they did, or milk their experiences for all their worth.

    Yes, I believe there are sincere people within these movements, just as I believe there are sincere Jehovah's Witnesses. Perhaps it's me. Perhaps I was spared the brain damaged. I was in for over ten years, serves in just about every capacity within the local congregation, and I loved every minute of it.

    Perhaps my NOT giving up my life for these people is what saved me all the anguish and pain some feel. But for the life of me, I don't understand, why most want to mope around all day, and I know the ahte me for saying this but .... GET A LIFE!!!

  • borgfree


    I don't know how well you know Duane Magnani, I know him, I think he would probably find it very funny that someone thinks he has an empire of any kind.

    Joan Cetnar, who has the convention "Witnesses Now For Jesus" was an heiress of the S.S. Kresge fortune, she lost everything, all chance of inheriting anything when she left the WT. She left anyway.

    I think you have the wrong opinion of the ex-jws taking the lead in exposing the WT.


  • minimus

    RR, what draws you to Pastor Russell's theology? Do you regard him as the "faithful slave"?

  • ozziepost
    I think you have the wrong opinion of the ex-jws taking the lead in exposing the WT.

    Of course many ExDubs place their trust in Jesus and leave all things in God's hands.

    If there's any exposing to be done, it will only be because God wants it. Seems to me that our own efforts should not be the "be all and end-all". We remember that Jesus is to be our leader, not any men or women. I believe that this is what is reflected by those who have chosen the name "Witnesses Now for Jesus" - isn't it?

    Cheers, Ozzie

  • borgfree


    Yes, I agree completely with what you said. Sorry, if I gave any other impression.


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