The Trinity Is A False Doctrine!

by non_trias_theos 129 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Will Power
    Will Power

    Quote from the Trinity Brochure:
    The New Testament writers . . . give us no formal or formulated doctrine of the Trinity, no explicit teaching that in one God there are three co-equal divine persons. . . . Nowhere do we find any trinitarian doctrine of three distinct subjects of divine life and activity in the same Godhead." (The Triune God, Edmund Fortman, quoted in, Should you believe the Trinity?, Watchtower publication)

    What they left out to deliberately misrepresent the source and deceive you:

    The doctrine of the Triune God has had an amazing history. Convinced that this doctrine is a Christian doctrine that did and could originate only from divine revelation. I start the study from the authentic record of divine revelation that is found in the sacred writings of the Old and New Testaments. What does the Old Testament tell us of God? It tells us there is one God, a wonderful God of life and love and righteousness and power and glory and mystery, who is the creator and lord of the whole universe, who is intensely concerned with the tiny people of Israel. It tells us of His Word, Wisdom. Spirit, of the Messiah He will send, of a Son of Man and a Suffering Servant to come. But it tells us nothing explicitly or by necessary implication of a Triune God who is Father, Son and Holy Spirit. If we take the New Testament writers together they tell us there is only one God, the creator and lord of the universe, who is the Father of Jesus. They call Jesus the Son of God, Messiah, Lord, Savior, Word, Wisdom. They assign Him the divine functions of creation, salvation, judgment. Sometimes they call Him God explicitly. They do not speak as fully and clearly of the Holy Spirit as they do of the Son, but at times they coordinate Him with the Father and the Son and put Him on a level with them as far as divinity and personality are concerned. They give us in their writings a triadic ground plan and triadic formulas. They do not speak in abstract terms of nature, substance, person, relation, circumincession, mission, but they present in their own ways the ideas that are behind these terms. They give us no formal or formulated doctrine of the Trinity, no explicit teaching that in one God there are three co-equal divine persons. But they do give us an elemental trinitarianism, the data from which such a formal doctrine of the Triune God may be formulated. To study the gradual transition from an unformulated Biblical witness to the Father, Son and Holy Spirit to a dogmatic formulation of a doctrine of the Triune God, we look first to the Eastern Church where most of this development took place. The Apostolic Fathers were witnesses to the Biblical data and the traditional faith rather than theologians, but they furnished useful insights into the lines along which the Church's unconscious theology was developing. Most of them indicated quite clearly a belief in the divinity of Christ, less clearly a belief in the distinct personality and divinity of the Holy Spirit. They gave solid evidence of a belief in three pre-existent 'beings,' but they furnished no trinitarian doctrine, no awareness of a trinitarian problem.

    Is this a deceptive quote? Or is it only deceptive "in a sense"

    edited for formatting.

  • Will Power
    Will Power

    Whether you believe in the trinity or not has absolutely no bearing when it comes to the WT.
    They go out of their way to deceive, they cannot let their doctrines stand on their own merit.
    It is deliberate manipulation and fraud. If this is theocratic warfare, lying for their cause, what "in heaven's name" could be their cause?

  • DakotaRed
    DakotaRed

    Sorry, Penn, but those are Jesus' own words, not mine. Read John 17:3 in any version you wish and find where Jesus does not call God "the Only True God."

    As to false God and whatever, as far as I am concerned, it is just a hollow argument. Satan is called a god too. The Bible mentions many gods, but also states their is only one True Almighty God. From what I read, and not in the dubs trinity brochure, we place more restrictions on the word god today than either the Hebrews or Greeks did a couple thousand years ago.

    But, like I also said, will belief or nonbelief in the trinity gain us anything? I don't think so. To me, the importance of the entire message of Jesus is wrapped up in John 13:34; 35.

    All the rest is just arguments that keep us divided.

    As for the trinity brochure, I don't care for the way they were deceptive in their quotes nor do I care that they didn't go into much detail about it. The book, "The Doctrine of the Trinity, Christianity's Self Inflicted Wound," by Anthony Buzzard and Charles Hunting gives a great deal more detail and research than anything the dubs ever printed..

    But, that is just my opinion.

  • thinker
    thinker

    non_trias_theos,
    For nearly 100 years the Watchtower has been teaching that Jesus and Jehovah are the same person!
    "What the witnesses teach is true."

    thinker

  • FRUSR8TD
    FRUSR8TD
    Nice trick for God there FRUSR, perhaps. So why does He have so much trouble inspiring humans to write a book that acutally makes any sense? You all can argue the Trinity for the rest of time just like some Star Trek geeks trying to make reality out of science fiction, but you will never, never, (did I mention never) PROVE your point.

    hmmmmm possibly that WAS his (god's) point.....

  • Unclepenn1
    Unclepenn1

    Dakota Red, I think that you misunderstand me. I am well aware of Jesus' words about the Father being the ONLY TRUE God. My point is, that if all other gods are false, i.e. Satan, Dagon, Baal, etc. Then by definition, Jesus either has to be a false god, or God Almighty. No other choices. If I said that I had the ONLY TRUE Mona Lisa, then by definition, all other Mona Lisa's are false, or not genuine.

    Penn

  • borgfree
    borgfree

    DakotaRed, When you say:

    Sorry, Penn, but those are Jesus' own words, not mine. Read John 17:3 in any version you wish and find where Jesus does not call God "the Only True God."
    I think you are leaving out the fact that Jesus, took on human form, a little lower than the angels. At times He spoke from the human point of view, such as when He said, "the Father is greater than I" of course in the human form "a little lower than the angels" the Father would be greater than He. That would be true also when He called God, the Only True God. When He would again take the form of God, those words would no longer have the same meaning.

    edited to change the wording of the last sentence.

    Borgfree

    "Creative minds have always been known to survive any kind of bad training." -Anna Freud

  • Will Power
    Will Power

    Jer 10:10 But the Lord is the true God; He is the living God and the everlasting King...[but not king of kings?
    11Thus you shall say to them, The gods that did not make the heavens and the earth will perish from the earth and from under the heavens....[compare Is45:22...For I am God, and there is no other}
    14Every man is stupid, devoid of knowledge;....[couldn't resist]
    16...The Lord of hosts is His name. [What? not by the NWT!]
    Isaiah 45:22For I am God, and there is no other 23I have sworn by Myself, The word has gone forth from My mouth [ergo-created]
    in righteousness And will not turn back, That to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance...[compare Phil 2:10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, [how can the dead bow? they are conscious of nothing!!] and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord* to the glory of God the Father. [Those crazy christians - Now that's darn illogical!]

    *Phil 2:10 is one of those places where the learned anonymous WT bible translators chose NOT to replace Lord with Jehovah, even though this verse HAS OT reference, which is their argument for changing Lord in 223 other places in the New Testament. Hmmmmmm

    JUST MORE OF THEIR SATANIC VERSES!
    If you count fraud & deception as from satan. But if you count it as theocratic warfare then by all means enjoy & learn from the masters! Then I'd like to discuss some attractive swampland I own....after 5 please.

  • DakotaRed
    DakotaRed
    Dakota Red, I think that you misunderstand me. I am well aware of Jesus' words about the Father being the ONLY TRUE God. My point is, that if all other gods are false, i.e. Satan, Dagon, Baal, etc. Then by definition, Jesus either has to be a false god, or God Almighty. No other choices. If I said that I had the ONLY TRUE Mona Lisa, then by definition, all other Mona Lisa's are false, or not genuine.

    Like I said, Penn, as far aas I am concerned, the false god argument is hollow and meaningless. Why? Bcause everything I read says that today we place more restrictions on the meanings of words than the men who wrote the Bible did.

    Today, when we say god, we are referring to either the Almighty or one of the false gods mentioned. Way back when, it could also apply to Satan (2 Cor. 4:4), leaders of Israel (John 10:34), or even the false gods of earlier Israel.

    Additionally, I would like to know by who and by what authority was the second instance of theos god, capitalized at John 1:1. When I look to an interlinear, I see a distinct difference in theos and ho theos. To me, given that difference and the looser meanings of words two thousand years ago, Jesus was clearly stating that only the Father, (Jehovah, Yahweh, Yehowah, YHWH or whatever other name scholars think he might have been called) is the true Almighty.

    Again, just my opinion.

  • bluesapphire
    bluesapphire

    Will Power, Yeah, I know what you mean. When I saw the deception right away I KNEW FOR SURE I was dealing with liars of the worst kind. After that I had the feeling that even if the Trinity wasn't true, that just the fact that they had to lie about the evidence would make me lean in the direction that it WAS true.

    I mean just imagine that if there was really all this evidence against the Trinity, why didn't they find it? Why did they have to make up the evidence. Pulled it out of their behinds is what they did.

    Whoever wrote that brochure knew what they were doing. It is sick sick sick.

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