New Pope about to come out (page 17)

cantleave

Interesting Interview with CH on Mother Teresa

http://www.secularhumanism.org/library/fi/hitchens_16_4.html

soontobe

How staged does THAT photo look?

It serves a didactic purpose--to teach. He imitated Jesus, who washed his disciple's feet to teach them that they should humbly serve others.

He came to Simon Peter, who said to him, “Lord, are you going to wash my feet?” Jesus replied, “You do not realize now what I am doing, but later you will understand.” “No,” said Peter, “you shall never wash my feet.”....

....I have set you an example that you should do as I have done for you.

St. Francis once said: Preach the Gospel always, if necessary use words. What Bergoglio did on that occasion was teach the Christian message without words.

FlyingHighNow

Thank you, Soon, it's good to see two sides to get a better rounded view of what might be the truth about this man. Anytime famous people do bad things, the press will report it. And anytime famous people who are trying to good, like our president Obama, the press will do their best to trash the person. I have issues with the RC church over their handling of the child molestation scandals, views of women and especially the birth control issues, but I also try to have a balanced view of the good accomplished by individual churches and people. I want both sides of the story on things before I can begin to be fair. .

Las Malvinas son Argentinas

It's a typically Argentine political manuever and tiresome folly to connect every possible dot to the Dirty War of the 1970s-early 1980s in order to sully opponents. Verbitsky is a yellow journalist and one such person who indulges in this silly game of slander and libel. The fact that he is an admitted 'leftist guerilla' should cast doubts on his objectivity towards anything church-related. Argentines despise the terror plots of the Marxists just as much as the junta's response to it. The Church itself wasn't innocent either during this period, as is often the case in other dictatorships with high Catholic populations. But to directly connect Bergoglio to the crimes of the regime is really stretching the truth and a blatant attempt to smear the man. Menem himself pardoned the ringleaders of the junta in the early 90's, so why should we all of a sudden shift the blame onto a Jesuit priest who wasn't even connected with the government or military at the time, when it becomes convenient to do so now that he's in the spotlight? If there's blame to be proportionately distributed out for that sad period, we're in luck because we already have several culprits by name. Bergoglio is not on that list.

designs

As a true devotee to austerity Francis I will be opening a chain of .99cent only Holy Trinket Stores.

still thinking

As a true devotee to austerity Francis I will be opening a chain of .99cent only Holy Trinket Stores.

Oooooh....can I have a virgin mary key chain?

still thinking

I repeat...look at the history of this church (some of it very recent history as in last year)....no one gets to position of pope in this church without getting his hands dirty.

Just look at the Governing Body...how many of them are unaware and not involved with the cover up of child abuse? And they've got NOTHING on the catholic church. It is rampant.

If the organisation is corupt...those at the top have enabled it with their cover ups and protection of abusers.

I have issues with the RC church over their handling of the child molestation scandals, views of women and especially the birth control issues, but I also try to have a balanced view of the good accomplished by individual churches and people...FHN

I hope you keep a balance view of the Governing body of the Jehovahs Witnesses too in that case. Keep a balance view of all the good they do. And support them being a good organisation...defend them as you do the catholic church.

I recognise that many individual catholics and Jehovahs Witnesses are good PEOPLE...but BOTH organisations are corrupt...and if their organisations are corrupt...so are their leaders.

still thinking

It serves a didactic purpose--to teach. He imitated Jesus

Still looks fake. If the purpose is to fool people into thinking he is christ like and humble...it obviously worked (for some).

Some people like to create and image for themselves...as tal pointed out. It's a branding excercise just as taking on the name Francis is a branding excercise. Everyone now equates him with St Francis...he MUST be a kind, humble man who probably loves animals. (Image, branding)

Never underestimate marketing campaigns...they sell.

*my opinion*...from the day the pope stood down. This came across as rebranding excercise for the church. Benedict had a terrible image. They needed a new one. And now they have it. Mr humble.

designs

Wait for Tuesday, Holy Tuesday's are 2-fer Tuesdays.

still thinking

Cantleave...that is a good article...I hope you don't mind but I'm going to copy and paste some of it here because it actually makes some of the same points about MT that I am making about the pope.

Free Inquiry: According to polls, Mother Teresa is the most respected woman in the world. Her name is a by-word for selfless dedication in the service of humanity. So why are you picking on this sainted old woman?

Christopher Hitchens: Partly because that impression is so widespread. But also because the sheer fact that this is considered unquestionable is a sign of what we are up against, namely the problem of credulity. One of the most salient examples of people's willingness to believe anything if it is garbed in the appearance of holiness is the uncritical acceptance of the idea of Mother Teresa as a saint by people who would normally be thinking - however lazily - in a secular or rational manner. In other words, in every sense it is an unexamined claim.

It's unexamined journalistically - no one really takes a look at what she does. And it is unexamined as to why it should be she who is spotlighted as opposed to many very selfless people who devote their lives to the relief of suffering in what we used to call the "Third World." Why is it never mentioned that her stated motive for the work is that of proselytization for religious fundamentalism, for the most extreme interpretation of Catholic doctrine? If you ask most people if they agree with the pope's views on population, for example, they say they think they are rather extreme. Well here's someone whose life's work is the propagation of the most extreme version of that.

That's the first motive. The second was a sort of journalistic curiosity as to why it was that no one had asked any serious questions about Mother Teresa's theory or practice. Regarding her practice, I couldn't help but notice that she had rallied to the side of the Duvalier family in Haiti, for instance, that she had taken money - over a million dollars - from Charles Keating, the Lincoln Savings and Loans swindler, even though it had been shown to her that the money was stolen; that she has been an ally of the most reactionary forces in India and in many other countries; that she has campaigned recently to prevent Ireland from ceasing to be the only country in Europe with a constitutional ban on divorce, that her interventions are always timed to assist the most conservative and obscurantist forces.

FI: Do you think this is because she is a shrewd political operator or that she is just naïve and used as a tool by others?

HITCHENS: I've often been asked that. And I couldn't say from real acquaintance with her which view is correct, because I've only met her once. But from observing her I don't think that she's naïve. I don't think she is particularly intelligent or that she has a complex mind, but I think she has a certain cunning.

Her instincts are very good: she seems to know when and where she might be needed and to turn up, still looking very simple. But it's a long way from Calcutta to Port au Prince airport in Haiti, and it's a long way from the airport to the presidential palace. And one can't just, in your humble way and dressed in a simple sari, turn up there. Quite a lot of things have to be arranged and thought about and allowed for in advance. You don't end up suddenly out of sheer simple naïveté giving a speech saying that the Duvalier family love the poor. All of that involves quite a high level of planning and calculation. But I think the genius of it is to make it look simple.

One of Mother Teresa's biographers - almost all the books written about her are by completely uncritical devotees - says, with a sense of absolute wonderment, that when Mother Teresa first met the pope in the Vatican, she arrived by bus dressed only in a sari that cost one rupee. Now that would be my definition of behaving ostentatiously. A normal person would put on at least her best scarf and take a taxi. To do it in the way that she did is the reverse of the simple path. It's obviously theatrical and calculated. And yet it is immediately written down as a sign of her utter holiness and devotion. Well, one doesn't have to be too cynical to see through that.

http://www.secularhumanism.org/library/fi/hitchens_16_4.html

New Pope about to come out

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