wts made a video about masturbation IN SIGN LANGUAGE, WITH GESTURES

by rebel8 293 Replies latest members adult

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  Lady Lee

  jeanpicard

  I was a sign language interpreter for a deaf group for 13 years. I learned to sign from one of the elder's wife. They are both born deaf. When we communication between just ourselves or when I went to a party of just deaf people they used ASL amongst themselves. They altered that when talking to me. I am not fluent in ASL and I can't read ASL very well. But I can get by with a lot of patience from them. My second daughter's first expressive language was sign. She could communicate with signs before she could talk.

  I am not just some person sitting on the sidelines. I went with them to doctors, lawyers appointments. I was with them when a couple of them died. I babysat their kids (some deaf but not all). My husband and both my daughters learned to sign and were very comfortable using sign with them. We went to picnics after meetings, excursions with them in the summer to keep the children occupied and anything else the cong did. I made sure they were always included. My youngest daughter was in a reverse integration program at McKay School for Disabled children. While she was assigned to a class for the physically disabled children sign was used and she was very comfortable using sign with her deaf friends in the school .

  We had a group of up to 25 deaf attending our regular cong. I don't recall that there was anybody in the group who was not born deaf or went deaf very early in life. None used the oral method and all rejected the idea that it was the correct way to educate the deaf. They didn't start having their own meetings until after I left the JWs in 1985. There weren't any special materials for the deaf made by the WTS back then. They used the same books and magazines as every body else.

  I try whenever possible to inform the hearing community of the differences in the deaf community. I have done so here as well. I know very well the differences between ASL and English. Most of the people who are deaf that I knew realized the importance of knowing both ASL and English. You grow up and have to live in a hearing world. it is to your benefit to know both.

  This is my take on it. If you live in a country where there are 2 official languages then it is to your benefit to know both. I lived in Montreal Quebec. Tow official languages - English and French. I made very sure my children were fluent in both by sending them to French immersion classes. In the end it results in a better education and better opportunities for jobs later on.

  I see the issue of education for the deaf exactly the same way. They need to know both. ASL needs to be accepted and valued but they also need the English (or French or Spanish or...)
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  MC RubberMallet

  They chose to not only make it but to publish it on the www on a religious website, frequented by virgins, children, grannies with heart conditions, and anyone in the entire world.

  Why would a virgin, granny, or child, or any hearing person click on a sign language masturbation topic unless they were either:

  1) Actually deaf and wanted to get the societys views on the subject, which a person can read in any language they are familiar with, so why leave deaf people out, or....

  2) Can hear well, but looking for trouble?
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  frankiespeakin

  Maybe some of the GB might actually believe masturbation causes deafness, and so felt it important for deaf people to know how the sky daddy disapproves of such licentious behavior, and for the deaf to stop masturbating to avoid further hearing loss and not to mention harry palms, and mental insanity that masturbation is know to cause in the religious fanatics.
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  lisaBObeesa

  Maybe this whole thing just makes it abundantly clear that this topic is an absurdly innapropriate one for religious institutions to be addressing.
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  MC RubberMallet

  This is my take on it. If you live in a country where there are 2 official languages then it is to your benefit to know both. I lived in Montreal Quebec. Tow official languages - English and French. I made very sure my children were fluent in both by sending them to French immersion classes. In the end it results in a better education and better opportunities for jobs later on.

  I see the issue of education for the deaf exactly the same way. They need to know both. ASL needs to be accepted and valued but they also need the English (or French or Spanish or...)

  Can't argue with that. But when they are surrounded by English, they will pick up portions of the language. There were many people who came to America as immigrants not knowing a WORD of English, then 10 years later they own a small business in a big city. That happens with language submersion.

  But mastering the English well enough to read 'theocratic' English, that 'getting by' English won't work. The proof? The ASL field is growing a a freakish rate now with ASL materials as opposed to that tty stuff they tried before. That was the best they had at the time. But there's no comparison.

  I am not responding to teach you anything. I am just writing the way I understand it to be.
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  Vanderhoven7

  Deaf children are characteristically at a great disadvantage when learning English. Deaf children of hearing parents normally have significant language deficits (compared to hearing children) when they hit school, especially if their parents have not developed any proficiency in sign language. Deaf children of deaf parents learn ASL (so at least they have a language with its own grammar, syntax and idioms etc) and when they attend school learn English as a second language. But still they they must learn English often without the same level of phonetic input...and without the same gramatical experience. That is why many deaf adults still write "broken English" for lack of a better word....and even highly educated deaf adults often ask hearing peers to review and edit their written work.

  This I write from my limited experience and without checking with my wife....so don't quote me ;o)
• 

  Lady Lee

  I agree that people will pick up a language if they are not schooled in it.

  But here is my problem. My first husband is Italian. He came to Canada when he was 10 and within a couple of months had picked up enough English (and he was living in a French part of Montreal) but he picked up enough English on the street to be put into a regular English class with kids his age. His parents on the other hand never learned English and only picked up a bit of French. They lived in the Italian part of the city. Went to stores in the Italian community, worked in what amounted to sweatshops where everyone including the bosses spoke Italian. By never learning English or French (which is very similar to Italian) they limited the possibilities that were open to them.

  I did an internship at McKay on the Deaf side of the school for a year when I was in college. The kids got a very rich education in ASL. And that was great. They started kids off when they were 2 or 3 years old and tried to get the parents (hearing) involved in learning to sign. But the teachers believed that ASL was all they needed so the kids never really got to learn English very well. It was the teachers - the deaf teachers! - who had this attitude that you really could not expect the average deaf child to learn English. They weren't capable. Interestingly it was a deaf teacher who was telling me this despite the fact that she had gone to Gallaudet for her education. She thought she was an exception to the rule.

  That is such a cop out for the poor education the kids were getting in English. Just because you can't hear how a word sounds doesn't mean you can't recognize what it means if you see it written down. I live in a building run by a Russian Orthodox Church. It is primarily for Russian people. Signs by management and letters to the people in the building are always in Russian and in English. If I saw a word spelled and asked someone what it means they would tell me and then I would know what those Russian letters stand for. There are many people here who only speak Russian or Polish or Ukrainian even after decades of living in Canada. They fully realize how not learning English had limited their lives.

  The vast majority of children who are deaf are bright, intelligent, creative kids who need the best education possible. And I don't know that they are getting it. I hope that since I left the Deaf community (the larger one - not JW) things have progressed to the point where teachers like the one I knew see the benefits in making sure deaf kids get what they deserve.
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  Lady Lee

  Vanderhoven

  Deaf children are characteristically at a great disadvantage when learning English. Deaf children of hearing parents normally have significant language deficits (compared to hearing children) when they hit school, especially if their parents have not developed any proficiency in sign language.

  I totally agree. In Montreal as soon as a child is diagnosed with a hearing problem they are referred to McKay Centre and the child is enrolled in school. They want to get these children communicating as early as possible. I taught the parents of these kids for a couple of years. Not all parents participated but those who did saw a vast improvement in connecting to their toddler. They are also encouraged to use hearing aids if there is sufficient hearing to make use of them.

  Deaf children of deaf parents learn ASL (so at least they have a language with its own grammar, syntax and idioms etc) and when they attend school learn English as a second language.

  These kids are way ahead of not only their deaf counterparts with hearing parents but are also ahead of hearing kids period. They communicate way ahead of when most kids can talk. People used to believe that because kids didn't talk by a certain age it meant they didn't understand. I have sat in on linguistic classes where the prof was spouting this kind of crap. I couldn't let that go by and told her about the research on deaf children of deaf parents and how early they could communicate. My own daughter was "talking" to me in sign well before she could talk. By 6 months old she had a vocabulary of about 100 words. It wasn't ASL. There were no sentences but she had the words to tell me if she wanted milk or juice, a cookie or toast. She could recognize a dog, cat, cat, truck or train. She had names for people. The prof was surprised and said she would do some research on the matter.

  But still they they must learn English often without the same level of phonetic input...and without the same grammatical experience. That is why many deaf adults still write "broken English" for lack of a better word....and even highly educated deaf adults often ask hearing peers to review and edit their written work.

  This is where the deaf child falls behind dramatically. "Broken English"? Have you read the posts on this thread by people who are deaf? They all seem to be writing in proper English. They read books. The see the sentences and the grammar. English grammar and French grammar are very different. But people can learn them. Clearly the people here who are deaf learned English. As long as hearing is the only problem and is not compounded by a cognitive issue then every deaf child has the potential to learn English or French or whatever language they are exposed to.

  It really angers me when people say they can't learn. Harder? Yes but not impossible.
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  Lady Lee

  I have taken this way off topic but I think we need to address how deaf culture and communicate is very different from what the hearing community realizes.

  I just know that as an interpreter I would have signed the word. And while the adults understood then they could explain it later to their children in a manner appropriate to their age.
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  hamsterbait

  In my believing days I had a Babble Study with a deaf guy.

  The scripture in Revelation where Abaddon took the Devil , hurled it into the Abyss and SEALED it over him drew a blank.

  It made no sense until a more experienced DSL came, and realised when he read that verse, he was thinking of a sea lion. I wonder how he understood warnings on bottles not to use if seal is broken.