by XBEHERE 104 Replies latest jw friends
SIAM, many thanks for posting points 1-8.
In one of your follow-up posts you mention that a review of an appointed man's qualification only occurs when there has been wronging, weakness, or a lapse in judgement. Am I understanding you correctly that the GB categorizes a father allowing his child to pursue higher education (or promoting it) as "a lapse in judgement"?
Something is wrong when the futures of all these people is being decided by a handful of men.
Especially men who do not realise that life exists outside of the US!
Most of the 'education' articles we receive here in the UK are confusing for this very reason. BluesBrother has outlined 6th Form education (16 - 18) which leads to A-levels. This is really intended as a stepping stone to University (Higher Education). There is not really any point in doing A levels unless you intend going to University.
What BluesBrother didn't mention is Further Education College we have in the UK. These courses are more vocational in nature and can be Full Time or Part Time. This is the route many youngsters take on leaving school at 16 with limited sucess at GCSE 'O' level. They then go to FE college and train to be a plumber, electrician, chippy, painter & decorator etc. As they rarely involve leaving home I do not feel they are as frowned upon as University, plus the fact they end in skills that are useful on quickbuilds.
George
I wonder if this will resonate with my elder son. He and his wife both have degrees, but I don't think they would encourage anyone to pursue college. I do have a pioneer friend who has a degree and has a big issue with this. She is upset at the current counsel regarding education. You have to make a living.
SIAM - I agree with what's your saying. I remember the last KM school (I was still an elder at that time) when they the new rules on porn viewing there was some very inconsistant ways the new rules were applied. And, a letter was sent out clarifying how the rules were to work. So, I think you're right about them coming up with new instructions.
But, it sounds pretty clear cut in a lot of ways.
I know it sounds somewhat harsh of me to want this to result in the elder I'm talking about being removed and its honestly pretty bad of me to think this way, but my wife is adamant that the WTS is merely pointing out the pitfalls of going off to school and is not anti-education. She also didn't believe me when I told her an elder/ms could lose their position if their kid went to college.
If I could point to a real life, local example of an uber-JW being forced to choose between his kids education and his position, I think it would help her see just how controlling the religion is. I hope he makes the right choice but you never know. Again, I realize that there are other peoples future at stake here but I'm not the one coming up with these crazy rules. Just trying to use them to my advantage to make a point.
Sounds like the reversal of the pre-92 (or whatever year it was) education stance is complete.
I am very angry about these animals in Crooklyn and the way they think they can get away with this bulling of their own converts.
The active JW'S on this site are very welcome to post us these inside secrects, if only we could do more to expose these terrorist's in crooklyn because that's what they are !!
This information if sent to the news rooms of the media could do real damage to the lazy fat puffed up greasy pedo's in Crooklyn. All you active JW'S I urge you to copy this information fully and while your at it the new elders book aswell. You owe it to all of us on here to help us rid the world of this cult by exposing them to the media. Please think about it ! You don't wan't to go to kingdum hell anymore anyway, you only go to not loose family etc.
With your help on the inside we can destroy this cult and then just like us ex jw's you can be free aswell.. Make it happen now I have seen the light...
HHG
Higher education such as a college or university education has no value, it's expensive, and a sign of a lack of faith in Jehovah if you encourage your children to pursue.
Wow. Just wow. Only an uneducated person or group would make this statement. Or a person or group that has something to hide by making sure their members are as dumb as rocks. What do you have to hide WTS? The truth™ about the lies that you are covering up or spewing blatantly from the platform.
What a disgusting mind-controlling cult! I'm enraged!
RO -
" Pursue Divine Education"was the talk. Some key points are:
Ask yourself the question, "am I secretly hoping to prove wrong the warnings that have been given regarding Higher education?"
Am I trusting in Jesus words at Matt. 6:33? Manna was a not just a gift of food to the Israelites it was a lesson that God will take care of any need that we have. Higher education such as a college or university education has no value, it's expensive, and a sign of a lack of faith in Jehovah if you encourage your children to pursue. Look at Baruch's example and how he was seeking great things for himself. Printed Experience from a "brother" who went to college. He said, "I am incredibly sad that I wasted those years in college" College is a snake pit.
If an appointed man's children attend college, or if he encourages higher education his qualifications would automatically be reviewed by the entire BOE using the following questions. It is likely that he would no longer qualify for the privilege of service.
1. Does he show by his example that he is putting the Kingdom 1st?
2. Does he teach his family to put the Kingdom 1st?
3. Does he respect and obey what has been published by the FDS?
4. Do his speech and conduct reveal that he is a spiritual person?
5. How is this decision or attitude viewed by the congregation?
6. Why is his child pursuing higher learning?
7. Does his Family have theocratic goals?
8. Does this pursuit of learning push out meetings and service?
I am missing the last two questions.... does anyone else have them?
One point that was made was that once a child goes to college that many of them if not most, stop being active witnesses. This has got the branch on the defensive. I couldn't believe how negatively higher education was portrayed.
SIAM
You know I was having a pretty good day until reading this. Now I'm irritated, and hungry at that. Lunch isn't for another 2 hours at least. This is actually beautiful though. They remind of Jerry Glanville, the former coach of the Atlanta Falcons, and his famous comment to the referees when they made poor calls. "This is the NFL. You know what that means? Not For Long if you keep making lousy calls like that one." They keep pushing people between rocks and hard places, something's gotta give eventually. For the life of me, I'll never understand how these people keep watching their young people leave, 2/3 of their young people leave this religion, and they still want to blame it on romantic vampires, higher education, shopping, going out to eat, extreme sports, and video games. They just can't understand that people are doing all thats natural. They're looking to provide for themselves, they're looking to provide for a future family, they're looking for a wife or husband, they're looking for recreation. They're doing all that's natural for people to do, and those numbnuts in Bethel just can't seem to figure out that not everybody wants to pioneer, or become ministerial servants and elders. Nor should even want to in some cases.(James 3:1,2)
They're so out of touch that its actually laughable. My circuit assembly wasn't that long ago, and the DO mentioned in his prayer, and I kid you not! He mentioned in his prayer that it was a tragedy how many young people they've lost. It's a classic case of not seeing the forest through the trees. It's not the video games, or romantic vampires, the same way it wasn't the gangsta rap and heavy metal music 10 years ago, nor whatever boogie man they'll come up with next year. Its them! Its them! They just can't accept that. As far as the manna from the sky, yes Jehovah looked out for the Israelites in the wilderness. However to compare what Jehovah did for the Israelites, to the literature created by a religious publishing company too big for its britches is disrespectful to God. At the assembly, I noticed that the speakers made it a point to substitute Jehovah for themselves whenever possible. I don't even think it was intentional. They view their material as not coming from the minds of imperfect men, but rather from Jehovah. It's impossible to reason with them on higher education having any value when these delusional men believe that their literature is not from them, but rather from God. They view the meetings, assemblies, conventions, and even the family worship night as being provisions from Jehovah too.
You know, the more I think about it, it reminds me of Moses when he gave credit to himself and Aaron for producing water from the rock, instead of giving proper due to Jehovah. The only difference is, now the roles have been reversed. This WT organization makes decisions, creates doctrine, changes docrine, reverses decisions, sends this or that letter to the BOE, rescinds this letter, asks that letter be destroyed, and then they give credit to Jehovah for all of it. It really is a bizarre, twisted organization any more. It leaves their flock confused, it leaves the elders confused. It's more of an emotional nightmare built off of absolute authority and uniformity than any so called spiritual paradise. If this is a spiritual paradise, I cringe to think of their private thoughts on how they envision an actual physical paradise that they'll serve as kings and priests.
Amen, MLE.
Sorry to keep hovering over this thread, but the other comments SIAM made are also notable. The admission that there have never been more problems within the congos? That stands in stark contrast to their spiritual paradise teaching. Now, admitting that to the circuit elders isn't nearly as big of a deal as announcing it to the r&f but how much do you want to bet that that comment will find it's way into local parts?
If the GB knows that there local reps are under pressure, why can't they see that it's because of them? It's the GB's directives that are causing the average JW to rebel. Now, that's spread to their appointed elders/ms.
I know high control religions react to the loss of control by tightening their grip. It's clear here thats what is happening. I'm not surprised that they're blaming the locals for all the problems when in reality, they should take a look at the culture they've created and do something about it.
This is the reason why I don't think reform is possible because they refuse to look in the mirror as a source of the problems.
Thanks for the added info, SIAM
After reading this a couple of times, I do have to say that, as controlling as it is, it's not much different than the one and only KM school (for elders and MSs) that I attended way back when.
The propaganda machine pretty much worked the same way then. "you have to be faithful" "don't do this" "don't do that" "worldly this; worldly that" "control your family" "do more" "give more"
I remember coming out of that weekend exhausted and downtrodden. It was not refreshing. It was not exhilirating. There was no pat on the backs. There was no "we appreciate what yhou do..." there was no 'good news'...the whole thing was a downer. It was all heavy handed brow beating. As I type this I can recall the surreal feeling I had as we left. I was numb. I just wanted to have a drink and go to sleep and forget everything I had just experienced. Yet I knew I was supposed to feel happy and reinvigorated, ready to do more in the service of Jehovah but it just wasn't there. Something was wrong. Something that I didn't figure out until later...when I realized the whole thing was a sham.
These questions are just ridiculous.
1. Does he show by his example that he is putting the Kingdom 1st?
2. Does he teach his family to put the Kingdom 1st?
Translation to 1 and 2: Kingdom 1st = Organization 1st.
3. Does he respect and obey what has been published by the FDS?
Respect and obey = punish and enslave the flock.
4. Do his speech and conduct reveal that he is a spiritual person?
Conform conform conform!
5. How is this decision or attitude viewed by the congregation?
Encouraging gossip and slander if one is not a conformist.
6. Why is his child pursuing higher learning?
Gee, I don't know, maybe to be able to have a decent career to support a family some day?
7. Does his Family have theocratic goals?
Theocratic goals: Slaving for the organization for the rest of your life.
8. Does this pursuit of learning push out meetings and service?
This question just stinks of them encouraging retardation within the R&F. If not that than at the least they want brain atrophy so the R&F don't question anything or use critical thinking skills.
The more I read this the more hate I have for the WTS. I need to let it go, I need to let it roll off my back. But after being lied to your whole life and coming to that realization... I just want to let out a primal scream.
