Does anyone think that maybe we're just wrong?

by paul from cleveland 143 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Spook

  To the OP, welcome!

  But in answer to your question, no, I have never had a moments concern that JW's are actually correct. I let go of more beliefs than you did. I can't help you too much. I feel like if one believes the bible is true then one can make a case for almost anything. Some of the JW interpretations are marginally better than others - but many of them are much worse than others.

  In my strong opinion, no real consensus exsits among the authors of the bible. Focus on this:

  1. There is no good reason to believe Jehovah's Witnesses have special access to truth.

  2. There are good reasons to not be a Jehovah's Witnesses.

  3. At least some things they teach are patently false.

  4. At least some things they teach are bad.

  5. No good thing they teach is unique to them - all good things about Jehovah's Witnesses can be found in other religions if you choose to.

  Go see a talk therapist or counselor. You are probably dealing with anxiety or depression which is underlying this change. It could be a ratoinal choice for you to be a JW if you want to do so for friends / family. This does not sound like what you are dealing with.
• 

  diamondiiz

  I don't feel wrong at all. I wasn't DF but left because I've done enough research before leaving to know that wts is lead by just men who aren't lead by God nor at they anointed channel speaking for God. They're just typical men who decieve their flock and possibly themselves and that is why there were so many scandels from day one and why there are so many problems that people exxperience. When we leave a deception we feel sometimes unsure of what the future holds and we feel sad to realize that we're going to die like everyone else. General public doesn't dwell on dying when they're not getting up in years or have a severe sickness. Witnesses dwell on that all the time. Most don't think they will ever die so being delusioned by prospect of living forever on paredise they keep talking about it and the fact escapes them that they are growing older and will die. They point to everyone else dying but them. Now when those that get df or some of us leave we find ourselves in a real world and we must come to the realization that our time will come at some point in our lives. Problem is that general public doesn't dwell on the topic but because we have been in a cult for so long when we find ourselves on the outside these thoughts bug us.

  I never felt that NGO was a huge problem that some make it out to be. How the child abuse cases were handled out of court started my awakaning and I can to realize that gb doesn't rely on God but themselves as proof was how they settled out of court. I would guess that all religions have pedophile problems of their own and that wts problem isn't much different from other churches. But we believed we were part of something better where these sorts of things were not covered up and the difference with wts is that all are ministers and generally all practicing wts religion go from door to door. When known pedophiles, child and spouse abusers are allowed/encouraged to go door to door, this shows that wts doesn't care about the hart these people did in the past but they also don't care enough that these people can create more harm in the future as they're exposed to more kids and in many cases people who have just gone through some sort of life crisis and are vulnareble.

  When you do your thorough research on the history of wts and it's doctrine you will never doubt yourself that you're wrong about wts. Without that research you will still feel that you're wrong and they're right especially when you were df for something you believe was your own fault.
• 

  mouthy

  Welcome my friend. I was devasted when they kicked me out because I dont believe Jesus came in 1914(invisably
  I thought I was Judas..Wanted to kill myself....Then I found out all the LIES!!!!
  How wonderful,!!!! I had been knocking on door for 25 yrs teaching LIES!!Made 10 people JW's

  But If you believe the Bible....We are told Jesus died for us to live MORE abundently!!!!! Are you LIVING when aJW?

  I see where Angel eyes PM'd you,She will try to make you feel guilty & tell you to return to the fold....

  Read all of the sites on here including mine pleasehttp://exjw.weebly.com/
• 

  mrsjones5

  I don't feel I'm right in every opinion that I hold (Lord knows I ain't perfect) but I know for a fact that I'm right about the bOrg.
• 

  shamus100

  Hi Paul,

  I had doubts for years. It took a long time to get over it, and most of the doubt ended when I went when I did research, so my case was different from yours.

  Give it time - the worst thing that can happen here is you realize that you are wrong and you go back. I have no issue with anyone going back if they believe it is the truth. I'll disagree with you 100 percent, but that's just me.

  Take care, and I wish you all the best.
• 

  bluecanary

  I can't add much to the excellent advice you've been given. I just want to welcome you to the forum
• 

  TD

  The arguments I find against Jehovah's Witnesses aren't really that convincing. It's mostly attacking the messenger not the message.

  Hi!

  In this particular case, the "Messenger" is both an integral part of and the actual author of the messege. The unique theology of the JW's places them not just as a participant, but the actual target of an almost uncountable number of OT and NT types, parallels, parables and prophecies.

  This requires that they truly, actually be what they claim to be. If the JW's are not the "Watchman class," "Ezekiel class," "John class," "Man with the writer's inkhorn," "Faithful and discreet slave," etc., etc., etc., then scriptural interpretations that include these classes and types as integral parts thereof would collapse.

  When you think about it, that would comprise a suprisingly large amount of JW doctrine including most of their end-times speculation. Therefore the validity of their self-proclaimed status is certainly a fair area of inquiry.

  I think you would probably feel a lot better if you would do a thorough study of the JW notion of the "Last days." You will be surprised at how much of the supposed evidence has been distorted and misrepresented. As a start, try reading this book:

  http://www.amazon.com/Sign-Last-Days-When-Jonsson/dp/0914675095
• 

  Heaven

  Hi Paul and welcome to the forum!

  You said: Recently, however, I have started to have doubts. Maybe I'm just wrong. I've started to have panic attacks about dying at Armageddon again. I don't know what brought it on.

  Perhaps you need to consider that maybe the dilemma you are experiencing is that you are not wrong but right... and that you are afraid of what this actually means.

  For me, I was amazed at just how right I was. And I was left with many questions. I still am. It takes a while but all I can suggest is that everything you believed in now comes into question. What I did was move from believing (at least some things) into questioning all things and awaiting the proof the Bible says we are to seek (1 Thessalonians 5:21: "Prove all things; hold fast to that which is good." -- KJV). Without proof, I now believe that all anyone can actually do... is have hope ... hope in what is good and principled.
• 

  AGuest

  May you have peace!

  One of the greatest "truths" I've learned since [being asked to leave] the WTBTS is that most people do not know how to live... as a FREE people. That is why religion... and particularly the WTBTS... has lasted as long as it has. They possess many things that our FLESH needs: rules (laws)... and something to "see." Regarding the first, the flesh is, for the most part, "lawLESS." And laws... are for the lawless. So, most of us need to exist in a system that has limits and boundaries set for us... because we don't know how to set them for ourselves. Truly free people, however (and I am referring to those set free by Christ)... LEARN to live as such... as a "free" people.

  As for needing something to see, as one JW "sister" said to me when I shared with her what was occurring with me (you can read my other threads for info on that), "People can't worship what they can't SEE!" Thus, the golden calf at Sinai. Thus, the temple at Jerusalem. Thus, religion. Thus, the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society.

  However, FAITH, dear one, is not something we do with the flesh... but with SPIRIT. Afterward, the SPIRIT moves the flesh to action. Problem is... the flesh does NOT like to be deprived. It does not like to be deprived of food, of air, of water, of sleep... of company. It does not LIKE to be "alone." (Yes, there are exceptions to that rule; however, while many don't have a problem being alone, that "alone" is "sometimes." And even for those who like to be alone a lot... sooner or later they "need" to be with at least one other person for at least a couple/few minutes). That is one of the reasons why my Lord went ALONE to the wilderness to be tested by the Adversary. Had he been among his disciples... and thus, with a visible support system... Satan would have claimed that he hadn't really been tested, that he had had "help."

  You have lost your "visible" support system, the WTBTS... and, perhaps as a reselt, your family... and so are now your flesh is feeling "lonely" which is afecting your SPIRIT. But it is exactly at times like this, dear one, that our Adversary will work on you... attempt to draw out what is "in" YOU... your desire to be a part of something... and, understandably, something "visible"... as well as any crumbs of DOUBT... and attempt to exploit those. It is that very desire that causes MOST to avoid leaving the WTBTS... indeed, religion: they don't understand that the relationship with Christ (or God) is VERY personal... between you, him, and no one else... and so they cling to their various "support" systems. Whether it be family... a congregation... or the Organization/a religon itself.

  I would admonish you to take care with this particular "desire of the flesh"... the one that craves a "visible" support system. Because THE universal challenge is NOT JAH's "sovereignty" (He IS the Sovereign; even Satan knows that and doesn't dispute it). It is... "skin in behalf of skin... and ALL that a man has... he WILL give... in behalf of his flesh." Indeed, our Adversary SAID... of you... AND me... that we will give EVERYTHING... even our eternal spirits... to "save" our souls, our flesh. Don't let your flesh dissuade your spirit. You know they are not who/what they claim to be.

  I bid you peace.

  YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,

  SA
• 

  GromitSK

  It seems to me that this is about making a decision. To make a decision wisely one needs sufficient information. JW's along with all cults effectively cut off one's access to information other than that supplied by the cult. As a consequence it is difficult sometimes to even find the type of balancing information needed to make a rational decision, on top of the fact the cult will make you feel guilty for even considering looking for it, let alone reading it. It amounts to control by fear. It is unpleasant, frightening and effective and relies on you trusting the source of the information that is fed to you.

  When I was booted out of the Org in the mid-80s there was no easy access to information opposing the witnesses or access to people who had left the organisation to whom I could turn. There are many sources of information and support available these days - this place being one such. What kept me sane (assuming I was) at the time was identifying one piece of information or fact that I could prove didn't make sense and was wrong. What it was, was personal to me and wouldn't perhaps mean anything to you but it opened up reasonable doubt. This was all I had for many years as the only people I met either had their own religious message to push (as on here from some) or didn't have any religious conviction and couldn't understand my dilemma. To give myself permission to research the witnesses and read more widely all I needed was one thing that showed they could be wrong. It wasn't difficult then to do more research although the advent of the internet made it much much easier.

  On this forum you will read about experiences from people who have been at the very heart of the organisation and had access that most publishers could never even dream of. These experiences have the ring of truth to me. I would also recommend Crisis if Conscience if you haven't already. Surely researching to find the truth with an honest motive cannot be a bad thing? If it is, then one would have to ask why this is so.

  I would also recommend finding one or two people who give you a balanced answer and opinion. Then you can run your concerns past these people and check your logic.