Why don't you just take it like a man?

by AK - Jeff 199 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Midget-Sasquatch

  Vinny

  Thats a fair summary of the whole thread as I see it. Although I disagree that some people are just posting here to be "after" Lola. Its an emotionally charged matter and naturally people are going to react heatedly.

  Lola

  I don't expect you to reply ( I think you made a good call in that respect ). You said:

  Yes it’s painful, I won’t dispute that but again we all make choices and we have to live with the consequences of those choices and it’s a tradeoff, you get to live your life as you want but in the process you have to give up a lot. Again totally unfair and wrong but that’s what it is and until the society changes the way they deal with DF’ed and DA’ed ones we all have to understand the sort of treatment that we will receive if we make the choice to leave.

  I'm the last person to tell others how to say things. I put my foot in my mouth and show completely oblivious tactlessness so many times, its sad. But this quote above is a hundred times more helpful than the short verbal quip. Again, I never argued with your essential points. Just the delivery.
• 

  Black Sheep

  we all have to understand the sort of treatment that we will receive if we make the choice to leave

  And herein lies the problem. For most of us leaving is not a 'choice'. We are forced out because we don't agree to pretend to believe their lies or abide by their rules.

  I did not choose to be born into this cult, so don't tell me it is my choice to leave and my fault that I am attacked by my family members who remain in. THEY are the cult members, THEY are the ones who need to 'take it like a man' and deal with their cognitive dissonance instead of attacking those that bring it to the surface.
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  beksbks

  Right on Black Sheep!
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  AK - Jeff

  I second that, Beks.

  As far as the isinuation that I started this thread to invite 'lola bashing'. Well......

  That's not true. I felt the subject was one of merit being discussed as a separate matter - the comment lola made was off topic [indeed the thread had moved off topic - not suggesting lola did anything personally wrong on the other thread]. It just looked like a good topic for general discussion in it's own place. Hence the new thread.

  It might also be noted that I did not 'attack' lola here. I posted her comment anonymously as possible, but wanted to create this as a grounds for discussion. I was not calling her out. I hope it did not appear to be the case.

  This is a good discussion. It cuts to the heart of what is wrong with the religion of Jehovah's Witnesses IMO. The entire issue of being a victim/suvivor, whiner, hater, instigator, apostate, evil, wrong,,,, on and on, is being debated. This is part of the healing process.

  This in not about who is right and who is wrong. It is about the various methods and efforts it takes to heal from the abuse that comes while you are a jw, and the pain that is inflicted to add salt to that wound, once you are not a jw any longer.

  One thing about it, kids. With raw emotion comes life. We are not sitting around contemplating suicide. Sometimes victims of cults commit suicide, including sometimes those who exit jw's. But we are sitting around discussing how to deal with the very real injustice that comes from leaving a cult. That is soooooo much more productive than many other options.

  And here's the beauty of the thing: WE DON'T NEED A CORRECT ANSWER! THIS IS NOT THE WATCHTOWER STUDY! FORTY DIFFERENT OPINIONS CAN ALL BE RIGHT! AND NO ONE IS TELLING US OTHERWISE.

  Now - there's something to celebrate.

  Jeff
• 

  Vinny

  Quote: "WE DON'T NEED A CORRECT ANSWER! THIS IS NOT THE WATCHTOWER STUDY! FORTY DIFFERENT OPINIONS CAN ALL BE RIGHT! AND NO ONE IS TELLING US OTHERWISE."

  **** Which is why I thought some were unnecessarily harsh with Lola's specific point of view here. Her suggestion makes a lot of sense to a lot of readers as well.

  I agree that this has ended up in a better direction that where it was going. A variety of opinions from a diverse group of people located from all over the world.

  Now can we break out the beer summit program yet?

  Vinny
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  AK - Jeff

  Now can we break out the beer summit program yet?

  Good idea. Just so long as Obama isn't invited, I will come.

  Jeff
• 

  The Berean

  Anger is fine until it affects ones health and longevity. I have too often seen early death as regards those emotionally upset for complaints which could have been concluded. Whichever position works best, to ignor past abuse or to periodically highlight same, each of us will benefit or pay for our own choice. He/she who lives longest wins!

  One point of confusion: It has been mentioned in several posts that the organization is counting on silence from past members ... yet, is it not our unproclaimed purpose to silence the WBTS by use of protest and education? If not, why are so many offended by words that are spoken by current members. Should we simply not consider the source and move on?
• 

  AK - Jeff

  Three years ago, a very good friend of mine died. I had to watch him die from a 'safe' distance. I had been 'marked' by the elders, though I was still short of having actually DA'ing myself.

  I never was allowed to speak with him, console him, sit at his bedside and recall the decades of memories we shared. I was not allowed to attend his funeral [I suppose they could not have stopped me, but it would have added to the pain].

  Something very precious was taken from me. Those precious memories cannot ever be regained. My dear friend died, thinking me a cad, a liar, an evil man. I was never able to correct his thinking. In the weeks before his death, I drove past his home often, hoping to catch a glimse of him in the yard perhaps, or sitting in his living room. I did not see him, but once saw his wife in the yard. I blew my horn gently and waved. When she caught sight of my truck, she instinctively turned her head, and walked directly away. I never saw my friend alive again. I did not see him off in death either.

  There is something very akin to rape here. I do not wish to forever live in the victim mentality of it all. But, I neither want to brush it aside as just 'what is'. Mostly, I don't want others to endure that. To watch an entire life just become totally gone, like pulling the drain plug on some dirty water. I know that we really are powerless to change the way this cult deals with us. Still, it is part of us. Part of me at least and at times it hurts like hell.

  Jeff
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  beksbks

  I was not allowed to attend his funeral [I suppose they could not have stopped me, but it would have added to the pain].

  My mother had this experience when her own mother died. She had DA'd herself. She was told she was not welcome at the funeral. As you say, she could have gone. I have often wished I was in a different place myself at the time, and I could have taken her.

  The thing is Jeff, this site is specifically for us. Those who have experienced some kind of loss because of the JW cult. If we can't come here and feel comfort and tolerance, then where? That is my issue with those who would say get over it. Who are they to presume at what point on the road to recovery each person here is? For some of us it is so ingrained, there may never be a day that it is truly over. No one who has not lived it could possibly understand that. Anyone who feels the need to come here and play that character, has issues of of thier own, and are not worth knowing in my book.
• 

  WuzLovesDubs

  The situation for most of us in here is that if we COULD just walk away from the WTS...we would. If I COULD get away from all the JWs I would in a heartbeat. If I NEVER had to be shunned, and be REMINDED OF MY "PLACE" by the JWs I WOULD. But they wont ALLOW me to! And make NO mistake about it...they REVEL in the constant reminders to both me and my mother in law, that we are BENEATH them and not worthy of association, nor unnecessary communication nor even CIVILITY. So yeah....Id love to walk away and start a new life and FUCKING FORGET ABOUT ALL OF THEM.

  But Im MARRIED to one for 22 years ...and he is my kids' FATHER and his FAMILY are in and my mother in law who is being shunned by her own KIDS is MARRIED to a self righteous prick of an JW elder who reminds HER on a daily basis with a SMIRK on his fucking face, that SHE and HER beliefs dont matter and HE will rule the house and HIS WILL SHALL BE DONE and she will be destroyed by his god at Armageddon because she dared to turn her back on Jehoovers Borganization.

  So yeah...Id like to just walk. Wouldnt we all love to walk away and flip the bird to ALL of them.

  Yeah...just be a man and take it in the a$$ and quit complaining...you had it coming to you you "apostate" you.

  The Borg IS "Hotel California" You can check out...but you can never leave.