**** Some people don't teach their children manners. Grrr. **** (page 4)

mkr32208

Nah, I like creating a scene. Brings a little sunshine to an otherwise boring life...

FlyingHighNow

Finally Free, I'd probably stand on the train. Were the women younger than you? If so, kudos to their parents for teaching them good manners.

When you're at the library and you want to look over some books you've selected to determine if you want to borrow them and bring them home, 7 books to be exact, you kinda need to sit down. This particular branch is a fairly small, but nice one. They provide reading areas for adults and there is an elaborate section for children with kidsized tables, chairs, sofa's, toys, etc. There are chairs for the parents to sit in to supervise their children.

The lady, and I use the term loosely, had set up her cherubs in the adult section. I was looking forward to sitting in the nice, quiet, serene, adult area and looking through some books until it was time to go pick up my grandson. I had two books about menopause I wanted to scan to see if they would be helpful and worth taking home. At this branch, if you don't live in the town, you have to pay 25 cents for each book, so you don't want to pay for books you won't need. I also had five Chicken Soup for the Soul books I had found to hopefully purchase, for 50 cents a piece. So I had a stack of seven books and my purse with me.

Yes, I could walk over to the children's section. And I did. But there were children playing with toys and the furniture was tiny. Not exactly a relaxing way to puruse my book selections.

I think you're probably raising some fine kids, there, Skully. I don't agree with you that children should not be taught to show respect for mature adults, men or women, by offering a chair in the adult section of the library. One reason a lot of kids are out of hand in school, and anywhere really, is their parents have not instilled proper respect for adults. I do believe children, especially teenagers should have a voice and be allowed to politely express their feelings and opinions. As long as they are polite.

I have seen adults be rude to children, too. I am taking another positive parenting course, currently. We discuss ways to treat children with the dignity they deserve and this includes relative respect. Having your child come to sit on the sofa next to you, so an adult can take an empty chair is good manners on the part of the parent and it also shows the child proper respect and concern for adults.

The scenario, the way it should have been: First of all, the lady should have had her kids sit in the kiddie section. But, not thinking, she commandeered the adult section. Okay so to deal with that situation, she should have said to her kids, "We will sit here, but if an adult comes to read, I want you to come and sit by me. There is plenty of room on the sofa for all of us."

One of the worst things about the situation is that only the two smallest kids were even in the section when I went to sit down. The older two were over in the kids' section. The boy came walking over just as his mother started speaking to me. So there were two empty, comfortable, adult chairs and room enough for two or three more kids on the sofa next to Mommie Dearest.

Finally-Free

Finally Free, I'd probably stand on the train. Were the women younger than you? If so, kudos to their parents for teaching them good manners.

Yes, they all looked to be anywhere from their late teens to mid twenties, less than half my age. I was impressed.

W

mrsjones5

I think parents do their children a disservice by not teaching their children to be respectful of others, to be polite, and have good manners. It's called socializing your child. I'm teaching my children good manners and I know that I'm doing a good job because I always receive compliments about my children when we're in public and when my children visit other folks homes with and without me. Most important of all I have respect for my children, they're not mini adults, they are children who look to me for guidance and protection. I would not be doing my job as a mother if I let my children run wild with ill manners and total disrespect for others around them.

Josie

Scully

FHN:

Skully. I don't agree with you that children should not be taught to show respect for mature adults, men or women, by offering a chair in the adult section of the library.

I did not say anything even remotely similar to what you are implying. Apparently you think it's perfectly OK to assume that the seating was available, without first politely asking the woman "Are these seats taken?" You want respect and politeness, but you aren't too keen on offering it. I would venture to guess that the lady may have thought you were the one being rude by assuming you could sit where her family was. I'm not saying that it's ok for her to "commandeer" an entire section, but common courtesy dictates that before you assume to invade another person's space, the right thing to do is ask if the seat is actually spoken for. You can't possibly know what is going on in that woman's private life. For all you know, she had just sent her kids to find an age-appropriate book and wanted them to come right back under her watchful eye. You don't know whether she is a single mom being wary of a stalker ex or even a care-giver with instructions to keep all the children with her as much as possible. Or maybe she has a personal history of being abused and wanted the kids to come back to her, instead of being sitting ducks in a kiddy section of a public library. Truth is, you have NO idea about her history. You're just assuming she has bad manners, and had no valid experience for behaving the way she did or why she wanted those children to sit with her. Giving someone the benefit of the doubt is never in poor taste. Coming here and complaining about her, when you don't know her motivations (beyond your assumption that she was just being "rude" and "disrespectful") on the other hand, is.

Perhaps it was a case of her feeling that you were being rude to her and hers in assuming the chair was not already spoken for, so she was responding in kind by not having her children offer a chair to you.

One reason a lot of kids are out of hand in school, and anywhere really, is their parents have not instilled proper respect for adults. I do believe children, especially teenagers should have a voice and be allowed to politely express their feelings and opinions. As long as they are polite.

Politeness goes both ways. I don't believe it is up to the children to show "respect" for adults when respect is not being shown to them. It's up to the grown-ups (on both sides of a conflict) to set the example. The news is full of adults behaving contemptibly, including professions we were once supposed to just "respect" and defer to and obey without question - like police officers, teachers, religious leaders, etc., and I have no problem teaching my children that not all adults automatically are due respect, just because they are adults.

mrsjones5

I agree, not every adult is due respect but knowing children as I do the ones who are taught not to respect will do that to everyone. I have respect for my children and I teach them to have respect for others...it's an on-going process. But teaching a child to be respectful is not setting them up to be victims or to disused by an adult or anyone else.

FlyingHighNow

Most important of all I have respect for my children, they're not mini adults,

Exactly, they are not adults. If they were, they wouldn't need parents or other adults. There are different rules for kids than parents and adults. That is as it should be.

I was thinking about what Skully said:

I know that I'm raising my children a LOT differently than I was raised, because like language, manners have evolved over the years. While I expect them to say "please" and "thank you" and to wait their turn when turns are being taken, they are also learning skills that I was never taught: assertiveness, to speak up when they disagree (even when it's an adult they disagree with), and to resolve conflict by negotiation rather than passive acquiescence.

I can understand this is very important after seeing what being raised as a JW can do to kids. I wasn't raised as a JW, but I can see how children do need to develop values and opinions of their own. As long as they are also taught proper manners, thoughtfulness and politeness along with assertiveness, assertiveness is not a bad thing.

mrsjones5

Being assertive does not mean that respect has to be thrown to the wayside. Every child has a right to say no. Lord knows my kids say it enough to me and I totally respect that. And being a born-in that was not the way I was raised.

FlyingHighNow

Skully, you must be under A LOT of stress. We really hit a sore spot with you. You did say that you have not taught your kids to give up a seat for an adult you think is able bodied. That's your perogative. And personally, I think you've made a mistake. That's my opinion. I am sure that there are people who share your opinion. I am just not one of them.

Yizuman

I had worked retail for 25 years and the one thing I hate is screaming kids. When I say screaming, with me being 97% deaf, my hearing-aids actually pick up their pitches. I'm thinking, "Damn, that had to be ear shattering for those that have full hearing!"

One time, some kid picked up a bottle of OJ, when the mom said no, she threw it clear across the isle, shattering as it landed on the floor. Luckly I knew how much it was, $1.89, so I rung up the mom. "You're making me pay for that?" "Yes ma'am, she's your kid and therefore your responsibility."

Oh she was pissed as she paid for it.

Yiz

**** Some people don't teach their children manners. Grrr. ****

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Some people don't teach their children manners. Grrr.