Thinking of becoming a Witness again and my reasons for doing so :(

by reniaa 383 Replies latest jw experiences

  • OnTheWayOut
    I will admit one definate thing in favour of JW's is I've always applauded the 'Door to Door' work even now, jesus set the example and it's very definately biblical, much better than just preaching to friends and family who may feel browbeaten by family members always trying to convert them, 'Door to door' preaching is simple and honest, it's sad that more Christian faiths don't do it.

    The JW's have even warped our understanding of the door-to-door work.
    Jesus never did a house-to-house or door-to-door preaching. Find a scripture that says otherwise. You won't.
    He never sent his disciples out in a house-to-house preaching work. He sent them to preach in the
    marketplace and in the temples.

    The scriptures that say "house-to-house" are using one possible translation of the Greek, but the context
    indicates that the more likely translation would be "in private homes." This would be in contrast to their
    public preaching, and more like meetings in the home of the already converted, not a canvassing of the

    Door-to-door preaching is not prohibited in the Bible, but not promoted either. Today, in most industrial nations,
    nobody is home all day, and there would be better methods. JW's keep using this method to keep the
    members too busy to examine the doctrines, and to sell (with voluntary donations) WT literature.

    For more information, completely read Ray Franz's two books.

    You still want to doubt that they would DF you. Simply go back, see what happens, tell us how it felt,
    and if you can't stand being shunned in order to eventually gain back your "honest" friends.
    Before you put yourself through that misery, get a therapist. It's very depressing.

  • Not Feeling It
    Not Feeling It
    From what you said on the DF situation, the witnesses are still being very and overly strict on it, it's a shame although I can see why you can't just pat someone on the back and say all is forgiven, If you did that you'd be back to my ex-partners religion and their 'Get out of jail free' repentance card that has allowed him to justify abandoning me and our child with a little prayer and repentance. Still it does sound foolish and self-defeating to disfellowship those who have already been away years and would do nothing to help them,

    So what do you think is the right amount of penitence to expect? Should we go back to the Israelites standards of Mosaic law or even modern Muslim Sharia? If you (gasp!) had a child out of wedlock wouldn't you be subject to prompt execution? Take it a step down to the disfellowshipping rules and you have to be treated as dead until 3 men decide you have produced fiting works of repentence.

    Is it really up to a man-made church to determine if you are forgiven? They do it to "keep the congregation clean". I think that it should be up to the individual how to treat others. Personally, I would not regularly (or at all) hang out with someone who is a thief, certainly not a murderer, rapist, or a pedophile. Prison is an appropriate place for them. But when you get into issues that do not directly impact others that involve consenting adults I cannot see reason to shun a person.

    But by the same token, someone who is repeatedly cruel, shallow, self-centered, or treating the mother of his children the way you were... Those people don't warrant my association either. Do I need a religion to mark them in such a way? No. I think they choose thier own path. Good riddance. Call me when you can behave decently and make ammends for the harm caused.

    The Witness approach removes individual conscience and free choice.

    I think you may be looking for the congregation to "give you what you deserve" because of your earlier conditioning that it is "loving"

    Personally, I'm Not Feeling It

  • reniaa

    what about mathew's words

    << Matthew 10:14 >>

    New American Standard Bible(©1995)
    "Whoever does not receive you, nor heed your words, as you go out of that house or that city, shake the dust off your feet.

    King James Bible
    And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.

    that does seem to indicate talking to people in their homes, a\nd by your own admittance he did send them out preaching, and using private homes your saying after they are 'Converted' but surely it's in asimilar setting as a study talking to those who are interested. Hmmm would we even have christianity if the ones in the past hadn't took jesus's preach the word scriptures seriously?

    No I don't think your conclusions can justify only preaching to family and friends. Jesus obviously ment it further afield than that and his followers took it that way travelling from town to town, it's what paul and most of the desciples were doing through most of the new testiment, saying might be just temples and street is nit picking when homes are mentioned too.

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff
    I will admit one definate thing in favour of JW's is I've always applauded the 'Door to Door' work even now, jesus set the example and it's very definately biblical, much better than just preaching to friends and family who may feel browbeaten by family members always trying to convert them, 'Door to door' preaching is simple and honest, it's sad that more Christian faiths don't do it.

    One more - then I quit - seems like I am barking up a tree here.

    Most theologians would absolutely disagree with the WTS's position that Jesus supported 'door to door' work, or that Paul did so. You stated that you read CoC - going back to that - Raymond gives quite succinct proof that the Watchtower has misapplied those texts in his follow-up work entitled "In Search of Christian Freedom".

    After a discussion of the use of the Greek term kat'oikon, and it's rendering to support both the idea of a ministry that moved in a distributive [but nowhere a consecutive] sense between the houses of both believers and perhaps non-believers, and to include taking of meals in it's rendering in Acts 2:46, Franz makes this point:

    " That the apostles and other early Christians visited people in their private homes is clear. That they engaged in door-to-door activity as done by Jehovah's Witnesses today is definitely not clear. It may be claimed, but it is a claim with absolutely no supporting proof. " page 215
    "That Christ Jesus and his apostles and disciples had visited people in their homes was likewise clearly evident, undeniable. But that they had gone from door to door in doing so was nowhere indicated in Scripture.... Thus in the manual [Organization for Kingdom-Preaching and Disciple-Making] I presented door-to-door visitation as an effective means of reaching people, but I did not attempt to present it as something Biblically indicated." page 216

    Various members of the writing staff and Governing Body openly questioned [behind HQ doors of course] whether or not the society was attempting to "Bend the Scriptures to fit a preconceived idea", as stated by prominent headquarter writer Karl Adams regarding the Witness' position on this matter, as stated by Mr Franz on page 217 of same.

    I strongly suggest that you read this book - it may aid you in understanding that many of the 'admiral' actions of the society, are nonetheless not scriptural. That may be important if you wish to truly understand if 'truth' is even involved in the matter of returning to the organization or not returning. From a pragmatic perspective [obtaining friends, finding religious structure, emotional self-value] a return might be the choice you make. But a purely Biblical perspective, when looked at without the rose-colored specs, will begin to turn your opinions into just that, instead of acceptance that all the 'facts' you were taught are absolute.

    In addition - Raymond Franz, though very busy, and now quite elderly, will generally take time to address specific issues of those trying to understand the Watchtower Society. When I was debating the matter of leaving, after 48 years of believing nothing else, he spent long emails to me aiding me to understand the subtle and not so subtle matters that concerned me. Try and get an equally busy member of the Governing Body to do the same in defense of the Society's dogma. Good luck with that.

    Please listen to these people. Between us - we have literally millions of years of experience in having been slaves to this organization. Many of us left for soley one reason: The Watchtower does not act in accord with the Scriptures, and is not proven to be His single organization on the earth. In other words - due to conscience. If that is of any importance in your decision, then it involves a great deal of serious consideration before you re-dedicate your life to this organization.

    The world is not an easy place to live at times - but if truth is important to you, as you state, then give yourself time to deeply and carefully analyse what they teach. You will be surprised. I left after two months. I spent another 4 years learning the depth and breadth of it. Many have spent far longer. Almost none have ever found that they left in error and returned. That says something. It is one thing to know that all organizations are imperfect. It is quite another to allow a counterfeit organization to steal away years and decades of your life, promising Scriptural rewards that they have no authority to give in reward, whilst controlling your thoughts, actions and beliefs.


  • OnTheWayOut

    Just do the research yourself. I won't try to convert you. Here's some food for thought:

    Did JESUS preach from "house to house"?

    No. He did not. In addition to not one Gospel writer stating that he did, we have his own direct tesimony to demonstrate that he did not.

    John 18:19, 20 — And so the chief priest questioned Jesus about his disciples and about his teaching. Jesus answered him: "I have spoken to the world publicly. I always taught in a synagogue and in the temple, where all the Jews come together; and I spoke nothing in secret."

    And, indeed, the Gospel record of his ministry bears this out. He spoke to his DISCIPLES privately, but in the course of MAKING disciples he always spoke publicly.

    Mark 1:21-28; 35-39; 6:1-6; 14:48, 49; Luke 4:42-44; 13:10-17; 19:47, 48; 21:37, 38; John 7:14-24; 8:1, 2; 18:19, 20

    There are only three references in the entire New Testament that refer to "house to house", and in one of them Jesus says, "Do not keep transferring from house to house."

    Acts 5:17-21; 41, 42; 9:19-22; 13:13-15; 14:1-3; 17:16-22; 18:24-28; 19:8-10; Acts 21:27-32

    ALL these references cite either markets, Temples, or synagogues as the places where they were preaching and teaching. One of them mentions "and from house to house" as an ADDITIONAL method of teaching, but not as a primary method.

    If a Jehovah's Witness currently went REGULARLY to a Jewish synagogue or Temple to preach on Sabbath they could expect to get disfellowshipped for Interfaith, a classification of apostasy among Jehovah's Witnesses.

    The phrase "publicly and from house to house" would be like saying, "publicly and privately", yet JWs teach that their house to house ministry IS a public ministry.

    Jehovah's Witnesses ARE NOT following the model Jesus left in the manner of their preaching. They disfellowship people who follow the primary model of the 1st Century Christians.

    Check the Scriptural references I cited and you will know I am not lying to you. However, you HAVE been lied to.


    Matthew chapter 10 was a command to go to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. These would be, essentially,
    family. Reaching out in the marketplace would not be limited to family- so the work expanded that way.

    Private homes could have been used for "Bible study" as you say. A door-to-door ministry is not condemned in the
    Bible. Feel free to conduct one. I only object to saying it is "Jesus' example" or his command.

    Make note that The Watchtower message focuses largely on the earthly organization and earthly paradise rather
    than the heavenly aspect of the kingdom.

    There are other door-to-door preachers, there are Christians who preach in the marketplaces. Find a reference to
    any apostle (try Paul- the preachiest of them all) going door-to-door. You won't. He preached in the city where
    he found people. Many today casually preach to coworkers or neighbors when they encounter them. They don't
    get pressured (unless they are in a cult) to put in so many hours and count the literature they "placed." Part of
    what makes some depressed JW's more depressed is the pressure to "DO MORE."

    Do what you want as far as the service of God and "door-to-door" preaching is concerned. It is your right. Don't
    let someone else manipulate it into a command.

    Here's an excerpt from Ray Franz's 2nd book:

  • reniaa

    Questions for way

    If anything your scriptures show that paul lived and breathed preaching he went into a city preached openly then onto peoples homes who were interested sent out followers who also preached everywhere, if anything door to door work is too narrow, is more what your arguement is pointing out?

    The christians in the past took preaching seriously hense why christianity is so widespread now?

    Paul probably did more hours preaching in a week than most auxillery pioneers did in a month, and the scriptures do show preaching wasn't just the mileu of the leaders elders etc?

    When paul couldn't preach he wrote letters instead. So a certain amount of flexibilty in preaching is shown in getting the message to people.

    Once gentiles were allowed into the faith only preaching in synogues wouldn't have allowed for them too?

    what is so different from preaching house to house that makes it so wrong than preaching in the streets, as you say houses and going to peoples homes is allowed, Most Christian faiths I've researched now think only talking to family and friends is enough and I think that is just not backed up by Paul's example?

    I will research your info though,

    Thank you one way

  • isaacaustin


    Preaching door to door is NOT wrong...nowhere is Scripture is it denouced. At the same time nowhere in Scripture is it mandated. The commission is to preach- the how is not defined or mandated. The WT is actually deceptive in its renderings of Acts 5:42 to Acts 2:46. The exact same Greek phrase kata oiken, which they render house to house in 5:42- which is speaking of how they preached- they render as in private homes in 2:46 which speaks of how they worshipped. Why so? So one would not make the connection between the two verses and realize that Christians obviously did not worship together and break bread at each and every home in a row of homes...thus seeing no justification for carrying this meaning to 5:42.

  • isaacaustin

    What I am bringing out is this...door to door preaching is fine if an individual feels moved to share the Gospel in this manner. However, for an org to present this particular manner as mandated by God, to use it as a barometer of one's spiritual then deride or denigrate members who do not share in this particular method sufficiently...and to use the word of God in a way that one-sidedly slants the info to portay their view...this is what is oppressive and wrong.

  • desbah

    To me your making a strong arguement to go back, it's like your trying too hard to convince everyone of your decision. If you want to become a Witness again that's your decision to make.

  • Sirona

    You are doing everything you can to show how the JWs are the best of a bad bunch.

    You are ignoring mountains of evidence of their deception and bloodguilt.

    If thats the sort of life you want, go right ahead.

    I feel sorry for your kids who will be subjected to this cult.


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