by ScoobySnax 126 Replies latest social family
then maybe you should go back.<<<< said Mary!!!
Grace says PLEASE dont... check out all that has been shown on the varius subjects. I was a jw for 25 yrs. I honestly would have died for them... But after reading their studies in the scriptures --- any one can see they made up ALL their prophesies ...They truly are the false prophet.
Now if you think they are right remember what their Grace means <<<< Undeserved Kindness thats ME!!!!
"I still think that as a core belief system..."
Here is the crux of your difficulty - Anyone who bends their life to match the confines of a belief system, any belief system, is as much in "prison" as someone in jail, except they don't KNOW they are in prison. The invisible bars of beliefs do more to chain one to illusion than do the iron bars of prison in keeping one from walking about freely. Even in a real jail one can discover real freedom.
What is being called the "Truth" is nothing but a bunch of beliefs tailored to look a certain way, and beliefs are nothing but thoughts. How substantial are thoughts, how real are thoughts?
If they are right, they will be able to show where the Bible SPECIFICALLY and CLEARLY says:
1. Jesus is Michael the Archangel
2. Heaven is LIMITED to only 144,000
3. "paradise earth" (I can't find it anywhere in the Bible.)
4.That we are suppose to go to an "organization" for salvation
Show me these IN THE BIBLE, without any other man's explanations of what they "think" certain verses should mean.
These things should be clear and obvious, if they are in fact what Jehovah would have us believe.
Where in the BIBLE are they?
Would Jehovah write a book about Himself in a way that very few could understand it?
I do not believe so.
That would be deceitful and tricky.
I don't believe He is like that.
Do YOU?
but none of them seem to have the ring of truth that I remember from the Kingdom Hall.
scoobysnax- please study all the intricate laws from the Old Testament. Most of them don't seem to make a lot of sense or seem logical- certainly not something people would sit down and make up. That is precisly why you should be worried about JW teachings- THEY MAKE SENSE- but they don't to God, that's for sure. You can see the imprint of well thought out human logic to most of their study books and explanations of scripture. It's a mind trap that has snared many people who need logical answers to their questions.
Howdy Scott! How's it hanging my friend?
We've talked about this before, but I want to say it again. I went through the same struggle myself when I exited. In all candor I cannot say with 100% certainty that I am absolutely correct. It is possible, as God has not spoken to me personally, that Jehovah's Witnesses are correct in their teachings and that they alone have the Truth and will be saved.
However, Jehovah's Witnesses have not been able to answer some very difficult questions. To my poor way of thinking, if one has the absolute truth, one is required to have all the answers. When I left I posed these questions to all 9 of the elders in my congregation; I posed them again to 3 circuit overseers and to the district overseer. Finally I wrote the Society. Not one could answer even one of the questions. No games, just my sincerity and honesty here. Surely Jehovah understands that. Surely Jehovah, the God of Love, would care about an innocent child.
Scott, I'll make you the same deal I made 18 years ago with those elders. Answer these questions for me, and I'll go back. I don't mean a response, I mean a real scriptural answer.
Here they are:
Jehovah's Witnesses say they have the best child abuse policy of any religion.They base this boast on the 'two witness rule' which basically decrees a child abuse victim must have two eyewitnesses to 'prove' their rape actually happened. I have several questions regarding this rule. (1) Please name one scripture in the Bible in which Jehovah, one of his prophets, the Mosaic law, Jesus, or one of the apostles, dictates that a child abuse victim must present two eyewitnesses to prove their abuse. Just one scripture is all I ask. Realize I'm not talking about a dispute between brothers, I'm referring specifically to the assault and/or rape of an innocent child. (2) Why did Jehovah made very specific provision for a woman who was raped , working in the field and away from any eyewitnesses, and yet not make the same provision for a child? Jesus said that anyone who harmed a child would be better off having a millstone tied around their neck and thrown into the sea. Surely Jehovah, the One who sees all (even things hidden behind closed doors), would know that children are not sexually abused in front of other adults who can bear witness. Why then did Jehovah give an adult woman who does not have an eyewitness, but did not do the same for a child? (3) Why do Jehovah's Witnesses not recognize the courts of law as a second witness? When one of Jehovah's Witnesses is convicted of child abuse, the elders will not disfellowship that one if the victim cannot present 2 eyewitnesses. If however, the offender is tried in a court of law, and convicted, why is that conviction not considered a second witness? (4) In the "Flock" book, elders are instructed that they may accept the testimony of unbelievers. Please show me the scriptural basis whereby Jehovah puts conditions on the two witnesses. Please also show the scripture whereby Jehovah gives his followers leeway to accept or deny testimony based on acceptance of Jehovah alone (i.e., whether a member of Isreal or a Christian). (5) In the "Flock" book, elders are instructed that they may accept the testimony of minor children. Please show me the scriptural basis whereby Jehovah puts conditions on the two witnesses. Please also show the scripture whereby Jehvovah gives his followers leeway to accept or deny testimony based on age alone. (6) Do you believe every single account of child abuse amongst Jehovah's Witnesses is false? If not, then do you believe one of Jehovah's Witnesses has molested a child? If so, then please explain what Jehovah's Witnesses are doing, or have done, to correct errors? Realize of course, that Jehovah again and again provided correction for the nation of Israeal when that spirit directed organization made errors. Therefore, what is the current spirit directed organization doing, or has done, to correct errors made regarding child abuse?
Scott I choose to believe that if "Jehovah's spirit directed organization" cannot answer something as important as child abuse, they are not truly from God. I have no proof, no empirical evidence, just my own logic and intelligent deduction.
I submit to you that, if I am wrong, then it is up to Jehovah (whose son Jesus said 1 lost sheep is more important than the 99 who have not been lost) to come find me and save me from Armageddon for I am honest and sincere in these questions.
I further submit to you that I, and every other person on this board, are displaying more faith than Jehovah's Witnesses because we are putting our lives on the line. How many Jehovah's Witnesses go to meetings, out in service, etc. but don't believe or are scared of leaving? The people here on this board, and elsewhere, left because ethically, morally, and spiritually we just couldn't do it anymore.
If Armageddon is really that close, any day, isn't Jehovah obligated by his own words in the Bible, to come find us and save us?
And if he doesn't, what then does that say about this religion? Why doesn't that make this religion a sham?
Be well,
Chris
Who cares if it's true or not? If you want to live a miserable life under a cult that's allegedly being controlled by an EVIL, vengeful, mass-murdering, son-of-a-bitch god, go ahead.
Yep, it was Jehoover who supposedly killed innocent men, women, and children with his big, bad flood. It was he who smashed little kids with the walls of Jericho, burned them in Sodom and Gomorrah, and will let crows peck their eyes out in Armageddon. Are you so afraid of death that you'd follow that sick, hateful bastard for all eternity? The Bible is one huge contradiction after another. And where are the other 520 books of the Bible? That's right, MAN chose which books would be included, not any god. I believe in fact is was the Romans who picked and chose which books to include. The books that contradicted core Christian beliefs were cast aside (while others were left in for some reason). What a lovely group they were...
And yes, the JWs are a cult. If a religion forcefully controls every aspect of your personal life while telling you no to associate with the outside world, it is indeed a cult.
Scoob, you do this every year. I don't know why you keep trying to convince yourself they are right. What kind of sick benefit do you get out of torturing yoruself like this? Have you ever sought professional help in making a decision and getting on with your life? I mean that in a good way, man. I really do. This is not healthy!
Jean
Scoob ---
I'm with sonnyboy...and it really never was, is not, and will never be "the truth". Ya just hafta do more research to get to this point. The entire JW mindset edifice has to be de-constructed, brick by brick, in order for you to effectively release from this cult. Eventually you will realize that "it was only a movie".
Did you really LOVE all your brothers and sisters?
I usually did love sisters
Were your thoughts humble and pure, chaste and righteous?
Damn!!
Why did Jehovah made very specific provision for a woman who was raped , working in the field and away from any eyewitnesses, and yet not make the same provision for a child? Jesus said that anyone who harmed a child would be better off having a millstone tied around their neck and thrown into the sea.
Excellent point Big Tex....I'll remember that one...
