But what if they're right............still the Truth? (page 3)

jgnat

There's that slippery reasoning again. Keep picking and choosing what you hear, Scoobs, and you will always be torn.

jeeprube

This just proves how powerful the cult mindset really is.

JamesThomas

Any one who believes that the moronic and finite tribal-deity that is found within the pages of the Bible is the true Source of an INFINITE universe, sows his own seeds of fear and dread.

j

ScoobySnax

Thankyou for your definition of "slippery" and I think "EEL" jgnat. And the lovely picture, I think jeeprube came in shortly after you with that "Cult" word again.

Double Edge

Well, take this with a grain of salt (I've never been a JW), but you could go the Logic route:

Take a sheet of paper and make 3 lists - the first list, put down all of the attributes why you believe they are right - put down the three major points and then list the additional ones. the second list, put down all the points where they fall short (leave yourself plenty of room, it will be huge). Thirdly, list all of the misc. (if any) "I don't know if it's positive or negative"...

The second list will speak for itself. The third list doesn't matter since there is probably no real answer. But combined, they are important when weighing an outcome, so put them aside.

Now that brings you back to the first list - all of the attributes why you believe they are right. Can every point be exclusively made by the JWs? What other group makes similar claims? The only way you can answer that is if you absolutely know not only what other groups believe, but how they carry out those beliefs. If you consider yourself a Christian, how important is it to follow exclusively the example of Christ's life - love, forgiveness, service to fellowman, no matter who they are, etc.? If following Christ's example is important in being a Christian, how do the JWs measure up? Do any other Christians do a better job of trying to follow in His footsteps, rather than in religious traditions?

From list #1 you're going to have to take each point and figure out how they compare to others that are trying to follow Christ - I can tell you, having attended many different Christian churches, the JWs are left wanting....BIG time. Every church has a list #2.... however, there are not too many Christian churches that leave such a wake of misery in the lives of those they claim as members or past members. Just the break up of families alone is something that just can't be explained away. Personally, for me, that alone PROVES that there is no Heavenly "stamp of approval" on the JW, but that's just me.

There is no overwhelming point that can be claimed from list one that can't be claimed by other followers of Christ to "prove" that they are "true". That fact, along with counter-weighing lists 2 and 3 should give you your answer.

Hey....I know, it's dry statistical reasoning. But, at the end of the day, does your heart of heart tell you that Christ would acknowledge all of the shananeggins that have taken place with the JWs since their inception in the late 1800s, or would he be more apt to acknowledge individual attempts from those who follow the Golden Rule in living a life of love, service and doing the best one can in following the example of Christ?

bebu

Underbeliever hits the nail so squarely on the head Scooby... re-read his post!!

And the interpretation of the F&D slave in Matthew... is that the "clear" verse you refer to? Why is it that no group before CT Russell has ever bothered with this verse and used it in the manner he did? I think it is because the interpretation was more clearly about Christian stewardship in general: the wise servant vs the wicked servant (honest service vs hypcrasy). Jesus also told a similar tale of a wise man--who put into practice what he learned--vs a foolish man --who listened and IGNORED what Jesus had said.

You have more than enough pieces to see how to practice what you know. Is the WTS a false prophet? (1874, 1914, 1925, 1975, etc. etc) Does love mark the WTS' actions, such as of the repentent, or the hungry? (Charitable works? Shunning?) Are they deceitful? (UN, Randcam?) Are these the hallmarks of "God's Organization" (a term which appears NOWHERE in the Bible, OT or NT)??

At the very least they are like the doomed wicked servant, or the pharisees of Jesus' time, and Jesus did NOT heap praises on them as an 'organizational group' but condemned these guys most of all!

Look up the very simple Apostles Creed, the earliest creed of the church. Look at the simple commands to repent and to believe in Christ, or the 2 greatest laws (to love God & love your neighbor). The overflowing doctrines of the WTS--which must be updated--evaporate next to these basic things which people anywhere, of any age, can grasp. Get simple like a child, because if a child can 'get it', you can, too.

bebu

BizzyBee

Actually, that eel looks vaguely familiar.................Edward, is that you?

Anyhoo, I've always been fascinated by the fact that many of those who are most certain that 'this is the truth' are ones who, by their own admission, would be found 'unworthy' of salvation as a JW. Because they therefore feel hopeless, they are justified in standing on the sidelines whining "Poor me," and simply don't participate. These are the sad souls who will defend the possibility that "this is the TRUTH, goddammit!" They'd also rather be persecuted for their belief that actually go in field service, give a talk, or go to the meetings.

Isn't there a scripture about, 'neither hot nor cold, but lukewarm, He will spew them out of His mouth'?

barry

Schooby, The doctrine where Jesus came down and inspected all the churches in 1914 is based on the day year rule and the historicist method of interpretation of the bible. The Adventists have a similar doctrine its called the investigative judgement doctrine in 1844 .

Both doctrines take liberties with the interpretation of scripture and methods scholars would not support. Im an SDA myself and dont beleive such these doctrines. I make it well known in my own church these interpretations are rubbish and not supported by scripture.

Schooby some adventist are brainwashed just like you its not uncommon.

moanzy

You mentioned God had a chosen people? Are you sure? Try out some books addressing who the Israelite people were. It's becoming more obvious to me that they were just another civilization and the bible is a sort of history on them and what they believe and how they developed into a nation. The Hebrew scriptures were not written during the time of Moses, but many years later. The stories were probably orally passed down and eventually written. Who knows if they are even true. Just because someone says they are "chosen" doesn't make it so.Look at the religions today that claim "chosen" does this mean it's true?

Moanzy

ScoobySnax

BizzyBee........My, how wonderful to be just like you it must be. Chucking a "Poor Soul" out here and there, pittying from the sidelines on us poor un-enlightened souls in the darkness. I read all the replies to my post, and self righteous twats like you on ex JW boards always make me laugh. Oh and before I go, I have a scripture for you, Isn't it "Pity the twatacus amongst us, who knoweth so much, but speaketh such crap. Woe! to them" I'll get back to you on the chapter and verse when I find it.

But what if they're right............still the Truth?

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