RICHIE RED ALERT (page 30)

looking_glass

My main concern is the reason RR did what he did. I do not know RR like Conf. so I may be projecting onto him motives that are not his own. But it would appear to me that he is seeking acceptance from someone - he was and has been rejected within the JW religion so he goes somewhere that he can feel "normal" and in turn he does something to get a lot of people's support and admiration. I am sure there are many ex elders here that have the same book? Those are only questions he can answer.

Regardless of the moral issue, the main issue now is making sure RR is ok. It is my understanding that he has a lawyer, however the damage is done. There are post that describe his every move as well as pictures of him. A judicial committee is not a legal one, so they do not have any authority over him. However, a court of law does. So if the owner of the book choses to purpose legal action, he can. If RR starts improperly quoting from the book or not giving the proper cite reference he may get pursued by the WTBTS. Who knows with those guys what their motivation is. As was proven by Elsewhere's site, if they can shut you down they will.

Also, unless RR is copywriting or selling part of the book, reproducing the book with out proper authorization, then the issue is now just one of having possession of it. Yes, the WTBTS can go in on a Motion for Temporary Restraining Order (TRO) and get a Preliminary Injunction (PI) but again, the consequences are not do or die. As long as he does not violate any type of TRO or PI that a court has issued, he will be fine. The JC is just a group of old men who wish they had the power to rule the world. The issue of the book is theft and chancery. If he turns over the book and apologizes (I can hear the screams now) the chancery issue will be most likely be dropped. If a TRO or PI is entered, RR may be stopped from posting or speaking against the WTBTS for a while (depending on how well the JW lawyer argues the issues). He may also be issued a fine if he does not abide by the order entered in the case. I am sure that his lawyer is handling it the best way possible.

I think in the end it would be more harmful for RR to be cut off from the frienships he has formed here and on other sites, because he will really be "cutoff" and that maybe more then he can handle.

I hope the best for him. He should tread carefully as this rises and falls on him and regardless of the "storm the castle walls" that he may get from various people, they are not the ones that will have to deal with the consequences of his actions (and I am not referring to the JC consequences, I am referring to the possible legal actions that could be taken).

RR, LISTEN to your lawyer, you may not want to agree with him/her, but they know the law and want to keep you out of harm's way.

NewYork44M

This is an amazing story. It will even be more amazing how the story plays out. In addition, because RR is a minor the society will have their hands full. Do they really want to publicize the fact that the flock book is out on the web complete with notations? That is exactly what they will do if they legally persue the case. The book is now on many many websites, so the society can't reverse what has been done. Aything they do has the potential of backbackfiring.

If RR listens to his lawyers, he should be fine. The society has as much to lose as RR.

kid-A

The legal system considers all church documents "public property". This would especially true for a confirmed member of the church wishing to examine the documents of the church. Richie removed a book from the "Library" of the KH of which he was a member. Legally, as a member of said church, he has as much right to this material as any other member of his hall. The WTS would have NO legal case against Richie because technically, he has not "stolen" anything. Copyright laws are another matter, but the "flock" book is already available all over the internet so I doubt they would have any case there either. Note the point about not promoting things that are contrary to public policy, which Richie has exposed regarding the notes about the child molestation. The WTS must be shitting their pants over this one. There are legal precedents for this:

THE UNREGISTERED CHURCH

Christian Churches Should Unincorporate to Please God,
Not Just to Avoid Additional Trouble With Government

By Pastor Kirk Coffia

Reprinted from The Plumbline

Would a pastor who wishes to be faithful to the Word of God ever sign a document in which he promises to abide by government public policy, whatever that policy may involve?

The vast majority of fundamental Bible believing pastors would answer with a resounding "No!" and of course they would be right in felling that way about it.

But, the fact of the matter is that every time a pastor fills out the Department of Commerce form CS-2000 entitled "Annual Report, Non-Profit Corporations," he is knowingly or unknowingly agreeing to comply with public policy as stated.

Private, non-profit church corporations in fact agree not to "permit or encourage the teaching of …anything that is contrary to public policy."

Can any pastor who is fully aware of that information and the full implication of what it means sign such a document with a right conscience? No honest pastor can, that is for certain.

But the problem is worse when it is understood that a corporation is a creature of the state¾ created by the state and subject to its authority.

It may not resist the court when it demands that its books and records be submitted for an examination at the suit of the state (Hale vs Hinkle, U.S. Supreme Court, 1905).

Pastor T.N. Taylor, of the Assembly of God in Mount Pleasant, Iowa found this fact out the hard way when he resisted state control of his church-operated school and was hauled into court.

The judge in the case ordered him to turn over all books and records of the church and although his attorney objected strenuously, he was forced to turn them over.

In the eyes of the court, the church records were not God’s property, but a matter of public property and subject to public scrutiny.

The church could not refuse to turn over its books to the court because it had already agreed by the articles of incorporation to abide by public policy.

RichieRich

RichieRich here, broadcasting live from the library.

Mom pulled the plug on the internet, but otherwise she is taking things very well.

Me and mom and dad will sit down this afternoon to discuss how things will go from here.

I called the PO last night to see how he was doing, and he quickly told me that another brother (mailman) is going to chair the committee... Oh well...

And yeah- I STOLE the book. I'm a thief. I'll pay for a new one- no worries.

And yeah again- I'm very in your face... but it still took them a year didn't it? So who cares?

Whats done is done and whats gonna happen is gonna happen.

Thank you, and I'll update tommorrow.

(is it just me, or isn't the roadrunner supposed to run away?)

I'm very proud of you for standing tall.I think I once described you here as a little brother.I still feel the same.

Goldminer

Maryjane

((((((Richie))))))

Hope it went as well as could be expected and that you & your mom come thru this all ok.

AuldSoul

Maybe the U.S. Department of Justice would be the proper place to send THE BOOK .

Excellent suggestion. Just scan and publish the handwritten pages in back first.

RICHIE RED ALERT

looking_glass

NewYork44M

kid-A

RichieRich

arwen

luna2

Honesty

Goldminer

Maryjane

AuldSoul

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