Should Gay marriages be legalised?

by jwfacts 89 Replies latest members politics

• 

  Latte

  Qcmbr,

  I so agree with your comments…..you have a great way of putting my thoughts into words! Thank you!

  You said......

  Now if marriage is IMO about family it is here that we would expect to see the greatest benefits for individuals and society when it works and the greatest suffering and hurt when it doesn't. I haven't yet seen a report that says kids are better when the father is not there or are smarter or do better in life but I have seen a lot that talk about social deprevation, higher crime and school drop out rates when a father is absent (especially for boys.) Now in general mothers look after the children so its the men who are moving away from the family as the marriage fails. This has a devastating impact on the men - socially, mentally and often financially (they will often struggle to support any new family as well as the old.) The children suffer for the rest of their lives - you never get over family breakup - you just learn to cope. For mothers left looking after children they are often finacially in trouble are less likely to be able to give the kids as much time as before (she will almost certainly have to work if she is to raise the family out of poverty unless the former husband was very well off.) Marriage failure is a world of hurt. When it works however, there is no better system for providing for the emotional, financial and physical needs of all the partners to the marriage , man , wife and children.

  I hope the gay community is as grown up as it thinks it is in that if it argues it already has these things then it doesn't need marriage as well - leave that for those who will bring children into this world through the love between a man and a woman.

  I remember Sir Bob Geldof, recently, being absolutely emphatic as to the fact that children thrive within a a family environment where there is a both a mother and father. I know such family situations are not always the norm these days, but as Qcmbr stated……..

  When it works however, there is no better system for providing for the emotional, financial and physical needs of all the partners to the marriage , man , wife and children.

  Latte
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  Enigma One

  I'm the prick?
  
  Please reread this thread. You have now added denial to your list of problems. You have attacked me again and again for me simply pointing out I think you have self-loathing issues. Simon and the mods deleted some of your more colorful (insulting) posts from this thread....but you know what you posted. Your posts scream out for help. I have spent a few months in Japan, and have not seen the kind of anti-gay culture you post about. I suggest you find some support groups, professional help, and a spiritual guide to help you find acceptance.
• 

  AuldSoul

  voit,

  Although I doubt your latest post will end in anything other than another ban (brought on by language used only by you in this thread and a direct insult to the mods) you should be intelligent enough to know you have self-loathing issues. You describe your own behavior in very denigrating terms. You obviously find homosexuality distasteful and you describe it as "not normal."

  It doesn't make a damn bit of difference where you live or if you are a flaming 12 on Kinsey's scale, YOUR POSTS make me believe you have self-loathing issues, not anything someone else typed. Your posts also make me believe you are in denial.

  You call stating viewpoints drawn from your posts as antagonistic? Maybe you didn't understand the nature of a "discussion" forum. Go play in a sandbox that encourages one-way "discussion" and you won't get "antagonized" like that anymore. Otherwise, expect that your views will be challenged and if the majority disagrees with you, it may feel like being ganged up on. No one has been abusive of you in this thread. What are you, eleven-years-old?

  Everyone doesn't have to agree with and respect your VIEW, but I respect you as a person. I also develop a VIEW of you from your posts. You don't have to agree with my view, but you have to—or at least pretend to—respect me as a person. You agreed to the terms when you signed up. Then you disrespected the terms, the mods, and the veteran posters. What did you expect besides getting ganged up on? Did you expect everyone to tell you how cool you are?

  AuldSoul
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  tetrapod.sapien

  oh brother...
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  AuldSoul

  "Dont [sic] argue with an idiot as onlookers may not be able to differenciate [sic] who is the idiot"

  
  

  Excellent advice that I will heed from this point on.

  How's life treating you tetrapod.sapien?

  AuldSoul
• 

  nilfun

  CountryGuy, Just wanted to say I appreciated your thoughtful and insightful post. SNG

  I second that.
• 

  Gretchen956

  Ok, I'm going to ignore the flaming and address the question about children. Many MANY gay families include children. This includes children who were artificially inseminated, children born prior to "coming out" and also adopted children. Studies have been done, and they find that children of gay couples are just as well-adjusted as children of heterosexual couples. They have found that children of gay couples are not more likely to "turn out gay," because you don't turn out gay, you are either born that way or you are not. The only "studies" that conclude otherwise are put on the net by religious sites that have an anti-gay bias. There is absolutely no scientific evidence that children of gay couples are more likely to cause societal problems, act up in school or any other issues than heterosexual couples and their kids. In fact the American Psychiatric group (whatever they are called) and many other medical professionals have endorsed gay marriage (or civil unions) due to these very things and the issues in the following paragraph.

  In case no one else knows about this, there is actually a baby boom right now amongst gay couples. More and more gay couples who have been monogamous for years are starting to have families. Don't these kids deserve the same sorts of protections that any other kids do? Yes, this does come down to the kids. Gay couples experience more legal dilemnas around their children too, in cases of severe illness or small things like signing for an absence at school, gay parents experience roadbumps, hurdles, obstacles, and even prejudice as regards to their rights as parents in the childrens best interest.

  Now I know that no minds may be changed by this exchange, but the facts should not be distorted.

  Sherry
• 

  tetrapod.sapien

  auldsoul,

  never been better, thanks! :)

  laters,

  ts
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  Enigma One

  Gretchen...do you have a link for the "gay baby boom"? I'd like to be able to use it in the future when debating about this with less enlightened people. Thanks.
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  Gretchen956

  Here are some, hope all the links work, if not please cut and paste:

  This is a book on the psychiatic association's study:

  http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0814742610/103-8369706-2365456?v=glance&n=283155&v=glance

  http://www.apa.org/pi/parent.html

  http://www.usatoday.com/life/lifestyle/2004-03-09-gay-parents_x.htm

  http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/local/daily/june99/gays14.htm:
  As with most things in the debate over gay parenting, just how many gay families there are is hard to pin down. Gary Gates, a demographer with the Urban Institute, has analyzed 2000 Census data and estimates that there are 100,000 female same-sex couples and 67,000 male same-sex couples with at least one child under 18 in the home. In his book due in April, The Gay and Lesbian Atlas, he estimates that 250,000 children are being raised by same-sex couples.

  Those numbers are probably low, says Bob Witeck of Witeck-Combs Communications, a marketing firm that specializes in the gay community. Using a variety of surveys and studies, he says a conservative estimate is about 3 million children being raised by gay parents.

  This data is a bit old, it's jumped in the last 10 years. http://adoption.about.com/od/gaylesbian/f/gayparents.htm:

  Q. How Many Children Have Gay Parents in the US?

  A. There were an estimated 300,000 to 500,000 gay and lesbian biological parents in 1976. In 1990, an estimated 6 to 14 million children have a gay or lesbian parent. Between 8 and 10 million children are being raised in a gay and lesbian household.

  http://www.usatoday.com/money/workplace/2005-01-09-gay-parents_x.htm:

  As the number of same-sex couples with children reaches records, more are confronting challenges about how to balance work and family. Gay dads are quitting work to stay home with kids, lesbian mothers are going part time — and employers are responding by offering work-life programs and benefits to gay employees.