The brainwashing around the "Schiavo" case...

by Brummie 138 Replies latest jw friends

  • missy04
    missy04
    However, having these feelings would also mean that she can feel pain but cant disclose it, this would be awful. However she also smiles (which would indicate she is relatively at peace in her relationships). So the death sayers say her smile is just a reflex, she doesnt know she is smiling.

    Makes me want to cry. lots.

    The picture of her mom talking to Terri and Terri smiling, YES, smiling, breaks my heart...that people will take it away from her.

    ~Sarah

    In the case that this had happened to me, I can tell you that I would want to be around for every moment with the people I love until death took me away naturally.

  • kazar
    kazar

    This is a sad subject. As I have had two members of my family in a vegetative state; one died (that was merciful), the other is still alive and that is horrible to live with for everyone, including all who had to make the decision to keep them alive or not. I have two sisters who are nursing professionals at Johns Hopkins Hospital (which incidentally was where the two vegetative victims were treated to attempt to keep them alive). We have had many discussions over our personal tragedies, not everyone seeing eye to eye. I was also engaged in a life and death battle with my one of the victim's family. I have had a living will for over 12 years - right after the first of my loved ones fell into a coma. I say "don't criticize until you've walked in my shoes". Physicians should not preserve the body without the soul.

  • NewLight2
    NewLight2

    There is another thread on this subject:

    "WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THE TERRI SCHIAVO CASE?"

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/87180/1.ashx

    I've posted quite a few links on that thread and taken quite a 'beating' as a result.

    This was my first post:

    "Michael Schiavo wants Terri dead because he wants to destroy the evidence that he was a wife-abuser. The parents want to prove this, but he will not allow that to happen. Evidence may show that Terri was strangled and THAT is why she is in this condition right now."

    I posted a link and later had to explain that I did so as a 'quick and dirty' way for readers to get a little background information on the situation. It was done in a hurry as I was leaving for work. When I got home, there were all of the negitave comments addressed to me in that thread for posting that link.

    I have been following Terri's story since 2003 through the 'Google-News-Alert' emails. I have not kept the information as I did not ever expect to need to post anything on the subject. I knew that WorldNetDaily had an extensive 'archive' so that is why I choose to post that link. I say this now, so as to avoid the same kind of 'attacks' that I have already had to address in that other thread.

    In my opinion, there is enough 'questionable behavior' on Michael's part to warrent a criminal investigation of him regarding his actions in the 'Terri case'.

    Since his award of money:

    He has kept her isolated and deprived her of ANY stimulation that may have increased her chances of recovery. He will not allow any TV, radio, decorations, or plants in her room. The only time she recieves any outside stimulation is when her parents are in the room.
    Example:
    Her parents had her room decorated for her 40th birthday and Michael ordered all of that to be removed and tossed out when the parents left for the day!

    He has denied Terri the comfort of having physical therapy to keep her hands, arms and legs in shape.

    In short - if you don't use it, you lose it.

    Terri used to be able to drink liquids and eat jello, but Michael stopped that and had the tube inserted instead.

    I have posted a lot more on the other thread link - see above.

    NewLight2

  • Seven
    Seven

    The thing that disturbs me the most regarding this case is the lack of a signed and witnessed living will written in Terri's hand. There is no way to really know what her wishes were. Apparently though the people she expressed this to provided a convincing enough testimony to satisfy the courts. Nobody but nobody would choose to exist the way Terri is being forced to but do not let her die this way. End it now if it's "so right." End it now if you have no doubts. If it's so right load the syringe and get it done. It's obscene to allow this woman to die like this. Bastards!!

    I wonder if in the future someone will point to this case and petition the courts that "Dad in a nursing home" told me a few years ago that he didn't want to live this way so quit feeding him. Yeah, that'll work.

    Poor Terri.

  • Brummie
    Brummie
    Christopher Reeves was our hero.. Superman till his last breath.. His physical capabilities were limited to little more than his ability to form words... What if his mouth had been muted?

    A sobering thought huh.

    NewL, I dont know how true or untrue the accusations against the husband are. The article posted by Captian is very interesting regards to the accusations. I have with-held any comments on him since the pressure he is under may be fogging his ability to make rational decisions.

    Putting all of the controversail family issues aside, there exists a person who is alive and is currently being starved to death without being able to give verbal consent for the destroying treatment that is being forced upon her. A person whose is only able to smile every so many hours is being judged, they are saying she is "conscious" of nothing because her brain is damaged, yet they have no technology to weigh what she is conscious of or not consious of!

    There is no solid definition of which part of the brain makes us "conscious" some meical proffesionals say "All the brain" is conscious! so they are carrying out their death judgments on the abstract ideas and believes a men who have not suffered from PVS.

  • Brummie
    Brummie
    End it now if it's "so right." End it now if you have no doubts. If it's so right load the syringe and get it done. It's obscene to allow this woman to die like this. Bastards!!

    Applause.

    Brummie

  • Big Tex
    Big Tex

    With all due respect, I tend to side with the idea that each of us should be allowed to decide how something as private and personal as our death should take place. Her husband has said her wishes were that she would not want this life. Yes I understand the vitriol against him, and I admit I have not followed this case from the beginning. Perhaps this is an example of why we should all have our wishes in writing, as in this case we only have his word. Still, I choose to believe him about this specific point.

    Having said that, I side with Terri. Her wishes were to avoid just the life her parents are wanting for her now.

    I saw my mother in law live for 5 years in a vegetative state with Alzheimer's. It was not only painful, but frustrating as well. I knew for a fact she did not want to leave this life in this manner, and where it within my power I would have granted her wish.

    Nina and I have not only made our wishes known to each other but have put it in writing in a legal document that was notarized.

    As an aside, I found this article interesting:

    http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20050323/hl_nm/rights_schiavo_videotape_dc

    Schiavo Videotape Misleading, Experts Say

    Wed Mar 23, 5:06 PM ET

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The videotape that runs endlessly on television stations around the world shows an apparently smiling Terri Schiavo being caressed by her mother's loving hand.


    AFP
    SlideshowSlideshow: Terri Schiavo Right-to-Die Case
    Yahoo! Health
    Have questions about your health?
    Find answers here.

    She seems to look deeply, even lovingly, into the off-camera eyes of her mother.

    Schiavo's parents and their supporters, including doctors in Congress, have used the tape as evidence the 41-year-old brain-damaged woman is at least occasionally aware of her surroundings and might even be revived from her condition.

    They are fighting to get her feeding tube reinserted against the wishes of her husband and legal guardian who says Schiavo would not want to be kept alive in that condition.

    But many experts agree the tape is a cruelly misleading trick of biology.

    "Pictures do lie," said Dr. Lawrence Schneiderman, a physician and bioethicist at the University of California, San Diego.

    "Every time they have done a videotaped neurological examination, the courts have reviewed them and said, 'Yes this woman is unconscious.' Those movements of her eyeballs are reflexive and have nothing to do with recognition."

    Studies of people whose cerebral cortices are damaged in the way Schiavo's is show that their eyes will respond to stimuli such as movement or a human face, but there is no way for them to be conscious of what they are seeing.

    Florida Gov. Jeb Bush, who has been part of the fight to prolong Schiavo's life, said on Wednesday a review of Schiavo's medical records by a neurologist for Florida's Adult Protective Services indicated she may have been misdiagnosed and was more likely in a state of minimal consciousness rather than in a persistent vegetative state.

    Such a condition, in which a patient slips in and out of consciousness, was sometimes mistaken for a persistent vegetative state, said Dr. Joseph Fins of New York Presbyterian Hospital/Weill Cornell Medical Center. But Schiavo was not in that state, Fins said.

    "I think now it can be argued that with the advent of minimally conscious state (as a diagnosis), that permanent vegetative state as a diagnosis becomes much more certain," Fins said in a telephone interview.

    It is almost certain that when someone suffers brain damage from a lack of oxygen, they are permanently vegetative, Fins said. Schiavo's brain was starved of oxygen after her heart stopped 15 years ago and most doctors who have examined her say there is no chance of recovery.

    'UNNERVING PHENOMENON'

    Dr. Ronald Cranford, a neurologist and bioethicist at the University of Minnesota Medical School, said reflexes can fool nonspecialists.

    "To the families and loved ones, and to inexperienced health care professionals, PVS (permanent vegetative state) patients often look fairly 'normal,"' Cranford said in a statement.

    "Their eyes are open and moving about during the periods of wakefulness that alternate with periods of sleep; there may be spontaneous movements of the arms and legs, and at times these patients appear to smile, grimace, laugh, utter guttural sounds, groan and moan, and manifest other facial expressions and sounds that appear to reflect cognitive functions and emotions, especially in the eyes of the family."

    Dr. Timothy Quill of the Center for Palliative Care and Clinical Ethics at the University of Rochester in New York, said reporting about the case had confused people.

    "Distortion by interest groups, media hyperbole, and manipulative use of videotape have characterized this case and demonstrate what can happen when a patient becomes more a precedent-setting symbol than a unique human being," Quill wrote in a commentary published on Wednesday in the New England Journal of Medicine ( news - web sites ).

    "Anybody who been around patients in a persistent vegetative state knows that it is an unnerving phenomenon because they are alternate between sleep and wakefulness but that have no ability to interact," Quill said in a telephone interview.

    "It is difficult for families because it is very difficult to discern that."

  • SixofNine
    SixofNine

    Thousands of people die every day, yet when Teri does finally die, now or later, she will have suffered far more than all but a tiny handful of people who have ever lived.

  • Brummie
    Brummie

    Six, according to those who are letting her die, she has not suffered anything because for 15 yrs she has had no mental capacity and does not feel pain. She is not even aware that she is alive.

    Mums the word, how could family keep her alive if they thought she did not have hope or if they thought she was in pain everyday. The fact that they are fighting for her suggests that they have seen a good side to all of this.

    Brummie

  • Double Edge
    Double Edge

    As more of the facts tend to surface, the opinion polls are turning in favor of Terri. Personally, I think the husband has something to hide. It was reported today on the radio, that when she finally succumbs to murder death, her husband wants no autopsy and wants her immediately cremated.... no graveside for her family to visit. I have no kind words for the husband. Such a miscarriage of justice and respect for humanity.

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