Proof of God

by MrDantastic 91 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • MrDantastic

    I'm an atheist as I do not see any evidence for the existance of a God. I encourage critical thinking in everyone and am ready to debate anyone on whether or not there is a God and what that God might be like. Hmu.

  • cofty

    Welcome to the forum MrDanastic.

    Are you an exJW? Almost everybody here were JWs, some are still connected to the cult through family ties. Many exJWs are now atheists, others still believe in a 'god' of some sort. A few are bible-believing fundamentalists. Personally I was a xtian for about a decade after I left the cult. I am now convinced there is no supernatural realm.

    We debate these topics frequently on this forum.

    I'm curious about your position. In a short sentence or two, what are your top two or three reasons for rejecting theism and what would it take to change your mind?

  • blownaway

    ExJW here also. I am not an atheist because I can not prove a universal Neg. It would take faith to say you are an atheist. I am an Agnostic. I can not prove there is or is not a god but since I have seen no evidence of one, I tend to lean that there is not. The strongest argument for god in my mind is the argument by design. Although I do not believe in the bible or any book of religion, there seems to be a lot of design in the diversity of life. But if god or some supreme being exists he does not seem to really give a shit about us.

  • Whynot

    I used to be an atheist. I don't believe in the bible. In my honest opinion I think it's very difficult to debate the existence of god. There were, and still are things that happen in my life that I cannot explain. Personally, I don't see god as an actual person. It's hard to explain and it's even more difficult to debate. The reasons I believe in god are very personal to me. My husband will test me and ask for certain things to happen, I will do my meditation prayer and within days it happens. Like I said it's very personal to me. And yes I have been evaluated by a psychiatrist and no I don't have psychosis.

    Now I just need to figure out how I can win the lottery lol

    Because I used to be an atheist I can completely understand why anyone wouldn't believe in god. A lot of times I feel that it's better to not believe in god since, well, there's soooo much suffering and injustice in the world. The best explanation for some people is that there is no god or if there is he doesn't care for us. I don't try to convince anyone there is a god.

    For me personally, I see and feel the divine power and I'm grateful for it.

    I also want to say that you don't need god to be a decent human being. You don't need a book or religion to be happy and be the best version of yourself. So honestly, the belief in a god isn't really important imo.

    My belief in god is very different from the bible. It's more like Budhism and Sikhsm. Because I was raised as a JW I still refer to this divine power as YHWH. But I have been catching myself refering to it as Eternal Power more and more.

  • galaxie

    @why not " i see and feel the divine power" ..seeing and feeling are the senses we derive directly from our brain,if you are convinced this is divine are you saying some supernatural force is influencing your brain personally? ...if so what evidence is there? or is it a faith based assumption?

  • cofty
    I am not an atheist because I can not prove a universal Neg. It would take faith to say you are an atheist - blownaway

    This objection comes up frequently.

    The question 'can you prove there is no god?' is utterly meaningless because the word god has an endless number of meanings as we have already seen in this thread.

    If somebody asked me whether I could prove beyond reasonable doubt that the god of Jesus does not exist I would not hesitate to say yes I can.

    What people usually mean is 'can you prove that something that I could put the god label on and which I refuse to define in advance does not exist?' then the only sensible reply is 'go away and think about your question'.

    Personally I don't believe in agnostics. They are just muddled about the question.

  • waton
    the word god has an endless number of meanings as we have already seen in this thread. : cofty

    defining the g-word would focus the discussion.

    I like to zero in on the existence question, the footprints a possible creator left behind. artwork even.

    Things that "science" has proven: Energy, even its alter ego, matter, can not be destroyed or created, so it must be eternal. For energy to exist, it must have time to exist in, so "time" is eternal, not just the past, but also into the future.

    With that out of the way as over the horizon, beyond our grasp, now what?

  • cofty
    Energy, even its alter ego, matter, can not be destroyed or created, so it must be eternal

    That isn't true. The total amount of energy in the universe has been measured and the answer is zero.

    See 'A Universe From Nothing' by Lawrence Krauss.

  • waton
    See 'A Universe From Nothing' by Lawrence Krauss.

    read the book more than twice, it is getting long in the tooth by now. and there is no such thing as nothing.

    The zero energy slogan is a croc too. just because energies balance out, like in our 4 billion year old orbit, gravity pulling in, orbital velocity pulling out, does not mean there is 0 energy: contrary, there are 2 "energy forces" pulling against each other.

    same goes for the eternal energy potential. there are (2) equal parts, 1 on on each side of the balance,

    even LK's "nothing" needs time to exist in, energies to balance, and

    that ultimate question, never mind the answer, is beyond our comprehension, mine anyway.

  • cofty

    Krauss is very explicit about what he means by 'nothing'. He does NOT mean two energies existed balancing each other at all.

    No energy, no time, no matter - NOTHING!

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