Awesome Video on debunking 1914!!!!! Follow it carefully to the end!!

by Beth Sarim 168 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  scholar

  TD

  How are Jehovah's Witnesses immune from the uncertainty inherent in the Bible itself, over the counting system in use vis-à-vis the reigns of kings?-

  ---

  You ask a very good question and the answer is very simple. It comes down to a very important word in Chronology -METHODOLOGY. Scholar was the first person in the world of academia not just in this form but also in the academic literature pertaining to Chronology to introduce this was about 2000. A short time later 2004, Rodger Young in the Evangelical Theological Society Journal discussed this concept as a tool in settling the controversy about 586/587.

  Chronologists in constructing a scheme of Bible Chronology use a regnal/calendrical approach with at least one Absolute Date. This approach has two disadvantages:1. It is complex beyond the comprehension of the average reader 2. lacks uniformity'

  Celebrated WT scholars have a different approach which has none of the above but has the advantages of simplicity as it is event based and uses Absolute dates or at least one eg. 539 BCE for the Fall of Babylon

  ----
  Do not Jehovah's Witnesses themselves date Nebuchadnezzar's dream of the metal image to 606/605 BCE?

  -- Correct, because the event lies midway between to fixed calendrical years lacking a specific month which would give a specific year.

  scholar JW
  
  
• 

  TD

  Anna Marina,

  Events in the Bible do not tie directly into our calendar. We have to turn to archaeology, astonomy and other calendaring systems for that.
• 

  Anna Marina

  Beth Sarim - it was a popular subject 15 year ago - this thread got 77 pages! Little Bo Peep really started something.
  

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/87714/daniels-prophecy-605-bce-624-bce
  
• 

  Mr.Finkelstein

  Scholar was the first person in the world of academia

  If there is any indication of this guy being full of shit this is it. .

  Full of shit and arrogant, typical JW syndrome.
  

  The WTS GB heads probably never heard of the guy and I suspect he's in a mental institute somewhere in Australia.

  This problem with the WTS use of Jerusalem's destruction in 607 was brought on by themselves, what they should have done is stated Daniel's dream of annexation over Jerusalem/Judea was concurrently 70 years, that would have held up itself in evidence and history.

  Twisting history is not an honest and viable means to build an image of truthfulness and respect.
  
• 

  scholar

  johnamos

  Now notice what Dan 2:1 says:

  [In the second year of his kingship, Neb·u·chad·nezʹzar had a number of dreams, and he* was so agitated+ that he could not sleep.]

  Okay, even though the WTS claims Neb became king in 625 (which we know it was really 605) they say 624 was his 1st official year of his kingship. So with that being said and using that date (624) then based on Dan 2:1 then Neb’s 2nd year of kingship should be 622 (623 if we use 625), so we should expect that the WTS says Dan 2:1 occurs in 623/622…but NO instead they say Dan 2:1 occurred in 606/605.

  They twist the Scripture to say that he became ‘world ruler' in 607 but the Scripture reads that it was in the 2nd year of his KINGSHIP

  ----

  The accusation of twisting is nonsense and shows that you lack an understanding of the matter. Dan 2:1 is a good example of the need for exegesis. Have you done that? If you had done that then most likely you would have arrived at a different conclusion..

  This text omits any specific month and reads according to the NWT: "In the second year of his KINGSHIP,(emphasis added) notice not his reign, This means that Neb's 'second year' must be viewed not in terms of his reign but from another perspective such as Babylon's becoming the new World power in 607 BCE in relation to God's people.

  There is one at least well-respected Commentary on the OT which makes a similar point which came to my attention when we studied the Daniel book years ago at the Book study and I made a marginal note in my personal copy. I can expand further on this matter but this will do for the moment.

  scholar JW
• 

  Anna Marina

  TD - you have to forget our calendar. First you sort out what the Bible says.
  

  Archaeology cannot be relied on 100%. You start digging up bits of clay tablets and handing out money to people who are capable potters. It's not beyond them to forge a few old Babylonian receipts.

  Back at the British Museaum, like a urinal in an art gallery, your bit of clay aquires a status it never had before and may not actually deserve.
• 

  scholar

  Mr. Finkelstein

  In fact you idiot it was for the first time the concept of 'Methodology' in the academic literature was introduced by Rodger Young for I was familiar with the concept because Methodology was a Unit of study as part of doing an Honours program of my Arts degree. Methodology is an essential tool, one masters when beginning a Research degree at least in all Australian Universities.

  scholar JW
• 

  johnamos

  This text omits any specific month and reads according to the NWT: "In the second year of his KINGSHIP,(emphasis added) notice not his reign, This means that Neb's 'second year' must be viewed not in terms of his reign but from another perspective such as Babylon's becoming the new World power in 607 BCE in relation to God's people.

  [Daniel 2:1 In the second year of his kingship, Neb·u·chad·nezʹzar had a number of dreams, and he* was so agitated+ that he could not sleep.]
  

  [Insight on the Scriptures, Volume 2 p. 480 - In 624 B.C.E., in the first official year of his kingship, Nebuchadnezzar again led his forces through Hattu; he captured and sacked the Philistine city of Ashkelon.]
• 

  Beth Sarim

  ''Do not Jehovah's Witnesses themselves date Nebuchadnezzar's dream of the metal image to 606/605 BCE?''

  For them to support 607BCE, yes.
  

  They have to. They have no choice. They're chronology HAS to fall-in-line with Russels' 'pyramid' roots in order to support 1914. Otherwise their whole 'belief' crumbles.

  Probably why the 'Reasoning From the Scriptures' book is now discontinued. Because of the 1914 is talked about so much in there. 1914 is on thin ice. Probably be phased away or something. It's mentioned less and less in WT publications, meetings or broadcasts.

  Like Kim always says 'Boyvay' 'Boyvay'.
  
  
• 

  scholar

  johnamos

  [Daniel 2:1 In the second year of his kingship, Neb·u·chad·nezʹzar had a number of dreams, and he* was so agitated+ that he could not sleep.]
  

  [Insight on the Scriptures, Volume 2 p. 480 - In 624 B.C.E., in the first official year of his kingship, Nebuchadnezzar again led his forces through Hattu; he captured and sacked the Philistine city of Ashkelon.]

  Notice that the Insight volume, p.480 uses the expression' the first official year of his kingship' so this specific expression refers to his initial reign as King beginning Aug/Sept 624 BCE

  Further, Dan 2:1 cannot have referred to his regnal years beginning in either 624 or the accepted date of 605/604 BCE as Neb had not yet then brought the Jewish captives including Daniel who interpreted the dream recorded in Dan. ch.2 to Babylon later on with the first deportation in 617 BCE or the accepted date of 587 BCE some 5 years later.

  scholar JW