Jehovah's Witnesses Are Under Mind Control

by minimus 207 Replies latest jw friends

  • Mr Lebowski
    Mr Lebowski

    Well, at least we're not name calling :)

    I have a hard time with accepting it sometimes, but JW's choose to do what they do...and I have to respect that and honor their choice. To do less is to dishonor and disrespect them as individual humans... if I want unconditional love, respect, and acceptance, then I'd better give it.

    By viewing JW's as victims, you disempower them as individuals with the power of choice, and you deny them the basic respect that all individuals deserve (obviously they don't earn extra-credit points for advanced logical thinking, but we're talking baseline, thousand-year-old-carrier-of-the-light respect here - and lots of us suck at that! :)

    I have close relatives that are still active JW's, and if I choose to view them as victims, then I also choose to view tham in some sense as incapable. I refuse to view any adult human as incapable, short of physical defect or injury, or a condition that would support a finding of incompetence in a court of law. Viewing another human as incapable is a judgement of them as bad as their judgements on many of us.They have the same ability to excel, to soar, to paint or write or perform masterpieces, that we all do - and if we want to throw rocks at them for being incapable... well, we should first ask, what are we doing with our lives?

    Back to the crack pipe,


  • minimus

    Mr. L----Substitute JW's for battered wife. Not necessarily a wife that gets physically beaten, but emotionally and mentally. Perhaps this will help you see the error of your thinking......Now pass the pipe, dude.

  • Mr Lebowski
    Mr Lebowski

    OK, let's do that, min... and I have some background here, from my volunteer work in the field and what I've been told by professionals much more qualified than I.

    When a person is being physically attacked, in that moment, they are under duress of another, and in control.

    The rest of the time, they are free to leave at any time, and the only reasons they stay are the same as JW's:

    1) Fear of what will happen if you leave (note that that is a deterrent, but not a control - otherwise no one would leave their abusive husbands).

    2) the abusive relationship fulfills a negative self-belief, and until their need for well-being is stronger than their belief that they deserve what's happening to them, they stay.

    I am not a trained pro, and if min is not either, we might want to defer to the pros, but this is what I have read and been told first-person by the pros.

    Comments from others, please (especially those with expereince or from social professionals)?

    Cracked as ever,

    The Dude

  • Mr Lebowski
    Mr Lebowski


  • avengers

    We all do what we have to do. We all have full control of our own lives.

  • minimus

    I've been told first hand by persons that have been in abusive relationships that they do not feel free to leave at any time. I think you're insulting to anyone that's been abused.

  • garybuss

    I have tried to keep up with posts on this thread but I must have missed the post where the mind control advocates posted the Watchtower quotes on mental regulating of children. Mental means "mind" and regulating means "control". Or don't the advocates see those verses as support for their case?

    *** w01 5/15 p. 22 Building a Spiritually Strong Family ***

    5 Teaching your children to love Jehovah begins with your own love for him. A strong love for God will move you to follow all his instructions faithfully. This includes bringing children up ?in the discipline and mental-regulating of Jehovah.? (Ephesians 6:4) God counsels parents to set the example for their children, to communicate with them, and to teach them. Deuteronomy 6:5-7 states: ?You must love Jehovah your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your vital force. And these words that I am commanding you today must prove to be on your heart; and you must inculcate them in your son and speak of them when you sit in your house and when you walk on the road and when you lie down and when you get up.? By frequent admonition and repetition, you can inculcate God?s commandments in your children. Thus, your offspring will sense the love you have for Jehovah and, in turn, will be influenced to develop a closeness to him as well.?

    *** w01 6/15 p. 16 Do Not Become Forgetful Hearers ***

    15 We too would have no valid excuse if we were to become forgetful hearers. In the Scriptures, we have direction from God regarding many areas of life. For example, Jehovah?s Word specifically condemns the practice of borrowing and not paying back. (Psalm 37:21) Children are commanded to be obedient to their parents, and fathers are expected to bring up their children in the ?mental-regulating of Jehovah.? (Ephesians 6:1-4) Single Christians are instructed to marry ?only in the Lord,? and married servants of God are told: ?Let marriage be honorable among all, and the marriage bed be without defilement, for God will judge fornicators and adulterers.? (1 Corinthians 7:39; Hebrews 13:4) If we are determined not to become forgetful hearers, we will take these and other directives from God very seriously and will comply with them.

    *** w01 7/1 pp. 12-13 Share in the Joy of Giving! ***

    3 Yes, just as Jehovah and Jesus rejoice in imparting spiritual gifts, Christians do also. The apostle Paul found joy in the knowledge that he had helped others learn the truth of God?s Word. To the congregation in Thessalonica, he wrote: ?What is our hope or joy or crown of exultation?why, is it not in fact you??before our Lord Jesus at his presence? You certainly are our glory and joy.? (1 Thessalonians 2:19, 20) In like manner the apostle John, referring to his spiritual children, wrote: ?No greater cause for thankfulness do I have than these things, that I should be hearing that my children go on walking in the truth.? (3 John 4) Think, too, of the joy there is in aiding our own children to become our spiritual children! Raising children in ?the discipline and mental-regulating of Jehovah? is an expression of love on the part of parents. (Ephesians 6:4) Parents thereby show that they are concerned about their young ones? eternal welfare. When these respond, parents experience great joy and satisfaction.

    *** w01 10/1 p. 8 Imitate Jehovah When Training Your Children ***

    2 Why do parents have trouble rearing their children? A major reason is that we are living in ?the last days,? and ?critical times hard to deal with? are here. (2 Timothy 3:1) In addition, ?the inclination of the heart of man is bad from his youth up,? states the Bible. (Genesis 8:21) And youths are especially vulnerable to the attacks of Satan, who like ?a roaring lion? preys on the inexperienced. (1 Peter 5:8) Obstacles certainly abound for Christian parents, who set out to bring up their children ?in the discipline and mental-regulating of Jehovah.? (Ephesians 6:4) How can parents help their children to grow up to be mature worshipers of Jehovah, able to distinguish ?both right and wrong???Hebrews 5:14.

    3 ?Foolishness is tied up with the heart of a boy,? observed wise King Solomon. (Proverbs 13:1; 22:15) To rid their hearts of such foolishness, young ones require loving correction from their parents. Youths, though, do not always welcome such correction. In fact, they often resent counsel regardless of who gives it. Parents, therefore, must learn to ?train up a boy according to the way for him.? (Proverbs 22:6) When children take hold on such discipline, it can mean life to them. (Proverbs 4:13) How vital that parents know what is involved in training their young ones!

    Discipline?What It Means

    4 For fear of being accused of abuse?physical, verbal, or emotional?some parents shy away from correcting their children. We need not harbor such fears. The word ?discipline? as used in the Bible does not imply any kind of abuse or cruelty. The Greek word for ?discipline? primarily relates to instruction, education, correction and, at times, firm but loving chastisement.


  • Mr Lebowski
    Mr Lebowski

    Jesus, Gary, if I wanted to read that much of the Watchtower...:)

    More on the question posed by min. I just had a conversation with a longtime friend who is a therapist of 20 years' standing (and female, if it matters). She confirmed the two categories I posted (1, fear, and 2, negative self-image compatible with the abuse).

    It is also her professional opinion (which may wind up a few of you, I suspect) that mind control of any kind is a myth, that controlling organizations of any stripe - religious, professional, etc., all attempt to influence our behavior,but that control of our minds is a far different thing. She felt that members of Scientology, Moonies, etc, are influenced by their groups, but that they are getting benefits from the structure that solve some problem, fill some void, or address some need in their lives at that time. People leave when they discern (not us, them!) a deficit in the benefits vs. the prices.

    Anyway, for what it's worth...

    Look both ways,


  • minimus

    It's time to find a new therapist.....Mr. Lebowski

  • Mr Lebowski
    Mr Lebowski

    min, you don't get to speak for other people. I've talked to the same sort of people, and I've reported what they have said, as well as what mental health professionals have told me. If neither you nor I have actually been in the abusive relationship, we don't get to speak first hand. I'm not insulting anyone.I acknowledge that some of them may feel that way (as if they were not free to leave), but I do not acknowledge that that feeling is based on reality, thank goodness, since they eventually did leave.

    I have some very dear close friends with this background, min, and I would sooner insult you and your childish communication style than I would insult them in any way, even inadvertently.

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