by atacrossroads 51 Replies latest jw friends
Remember the definition of lying from Insight On the Scriptures:
"Lying generally involves saying something false to a person who is entitled to know the truth."
Are those two men who came to your door entitled to know exactly what happened?
Lying is obviously not good. But when it comes to dealing with a situation like this, you have to use their rules and their semantics to deal with it. Theocratic warfare!
Ata my heart goes out to you.
If the elders came to your door so eager for your admission, I wouldn't be surprised if they just go ahead an announce you df in absentia without your consent. It seems like sadly both sides of your family are trying to do just that.
Please prepare yourself for anything that may come out of this. Hopefully they just back off for good and let it ride.
I really like how u handled yourself. I know saying that is probably pulling on your heart strings since its your mom on the other side of the accusation but remember like everyone else has said YOU OWE THEM NOTHING.
Dont give them the pleasure of disfellowshipping you with ease. You are bothering nobody they are bothering YOU.
Stick to your fade.
Sending many hugs to you. Hang in there hun!
Lost
Well from what i understand there isn't a second witness to the incident so they can't df you without you admitting you said it hence why they were at your door asking you to admit it. If the elders want you in a judicial i would say ok but i'm bringing my lawyer. In my experience they will never hold that judicial because of the human rights laws that they break when they df someone hence successful fade can commence. Whatever you do do not admit it!
Hi atacrossroads,
I happened to come across this topic from Paul last night. I don't know if something in it might be useful for you. http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/109423/do-disassociate-anull-your-baptism
Don't feel guilty. You did a good thing by standing up for yourself. No one deserves to be treated that way and there is something insanely wrong with religions that treat people this way, even your own flesh and blood. You must stand up for yourself, rather than let a cult treat you like a piece of trash because you aren't...you are far more precious than that even if they refuse to acknowledge it.
I told my mother a year or two ago that I would still like to have a relationship with her and what she said to me was, "I would too but what's the point? You're about to be killed at Armageddon anyway." So you know...it's not worth it. If they willingly choose to let religion come between you, it's their fault and their problem, not yours. Don't get me wrong...it's painful, it will hurt. But you and your husband can move on and live your best life - with or without them. Stand your ground and don't be guilt-tripped into going back or putting up with elders. You want no part of a religion that forces you to be in it in order to have contact with your family, no matter how painful it may be. God bless.
I don't want to drag things out or play some kind of catch me if you can game
This is a common feeling but paradoxical. If you are prepared to jump in and get DF or DA, then why worry if they play a catch me if you can game. Just ignore them completely and whether they "catch you" or not will become meaningless to you.
That conversation was a private one between you and your Mother, you were speaking to her not to them and if she chose to repeat what you said, that's her choice but you owe them no explanation. Call it "spiritual warfare" (they do when they aren't fully truthful) ...you were simply safeguarding your own spirituality (among other things).If you questioned them about something that was repeated to you about a private conversation they had among themselves, they'd tell you to buzz off.
Your Dad is heartbroken....well it's you who should be heartbroken. You had your own mother betray you to a bunch of men who she knows full well have the power to alter the course of her family forever. Your Dad should be angry at her, not you. She went over his "headship" and went to the Elders before he even had a chance to hear what you had to say and get it sorted out within the family rather than have them turn up on your doorstep demanding answers of you.
It might be a good idea for you to do a search of this site to see examples of "warning letters" that different ones sent to their elders, letting them know that if they make any announcement about them, there will be legal action taken.
Crossroads, well done for not letting them have power over you.
we all lose it with our family members from time to time, how ridiculous it would be if every time we do we had to explain our actions to some external body. You and your family's issues are nobody else's business. It's tragic that they are prepared to lose their daughter over a different in faith, but it's just sad evidence of their complete indoctrination.
It's just mind boggling that the witnesses have fought in the courts for freedom of religion, yet when one of their own exercises that right, they seek to destroy their life. Imagine if when they went on the doors to convert people, all of those converts were shunned completely by their non jw family. Personally I converted from CofE, my parents were disappointed because they thought (rightly) that jws were a cult, but they continued to support me and my jw husband emotionally for over 20 years. My husband converted from Catholicism, again his family were confused, disappointed, but they continue to love, support and communicate with him to this day. How many jws are grateful that other religions don't enforce such harsh shunning practices. Evidence alone this is not the true religion identified by love.
i am so sad for you facing the loss of your family. I would write them one sign off and then leave the ball in their court, something like:
I love you deeply and I want you to know I will always be here for you whenever you need me, and I a will always want a loving relationship with you, we have big issues to face in our future, the possibility of grandchildren, or inevitable old age and sickness, things which should bring a family together. I have changed my beliefs, I am sorry that is hard for you to understand, but I haven't changed my love for my family. I hope that you can respect we have different views from now on and 'agree to disagree', I won't critisise your faith and am sorry if I have done so, if you don't criticize my beliefs and decisions either. But we can continue to support eachother. If you feel you must shun me and my husband I am sorry and heartbroken for that, if you do so because of what the writers of the WT have told you to do, please remember that they will not suffer in anyway for giving that counsel, but you will and I will suffer greatly if you follow it and sever our family relationship. The choice is yours.
Enlightenment123
"I told my mother a year or two ago that I would still like to have a relationship with her and what she said to me was, "I would too but what's the point? You're about to be killed at Armageddon anyway."
OMG that is some messed up indoctrination. Wow. I am so sorry for you but so glad you have such a healthy outlook on it.
To consider we thought this was the true religion, Jeeesh!
You had to have so much courage (and anger) to be able to stand up to those men. Well done.
My husband went to visit a young sister who was inactive and separated from her husband. She was being hounded by elders, they would come to her door and demand to know if she was sleeping with someone. Her ex was well connected with high ups in the org and he wanted to get a divorce and needed her to be the guilty one, he just beat her up and got drunk so that did not count.
My husband used to be an elder and we left the org some years before so he went round and told her to tell the elders to get lost and never set their foot near her door again or she would call the police. Like you did, you take away any power they think they have over you. I would have loved to hear what they said to each other when they left your house. Keep strong, hope your family come round at some point.
