We're all Americans....Reparations?

by Country Girl 106 Replies latest social humour

• 

  undercover

  I ifnd it bizarre for a Canadian to teach an American about their own history. Country Girl, the American Civil War was not started over the issue of equality of man. Rather the civil war began over the issue of individual state rights. The Emancipation Proclamation wasn't written until well after the start of the war.

  That's because Americans are taught now that the Cival War was about equality of man. Anyone who studies history knows better, but the average high school educated American doesn't. It's called revisionist history. It's also one reason why Southerners are belittled for trying to hang on to their Southern heritage. They become labeld racists and bigots cause they want to fly the Confederate battle flag, when actually Southerners want what they wanted then, individual state rights.
• 

  bigboi

  State's Rights?

  State's rights to what actually? IMO, it was their right to keep the institution of slavery and the culture of good ol Dixie it supported alive and well. After Reconstruction, Jim Crow was put into effect and almost every advnce that Black ppl made was unilaterally taken away from them. The only thing that was left for most was a dismal lott as a second-class citizen and the back of the bus.
• 

  Country Girl

  Country Girl:

  One of the reasons you see things like BET or Black Entertainment Television is because it's the only designation that Black ppl can use because unlike most Americans, we don't know exactly what our origins were besides that our ancestors were brought here from Africa. It's a big place yanno, with lots of different ethnic groups that future slaves were culled from back in the day.

  For instance down here every year we have an Irish Italian day parade and a St. Patrick's Day parade. By bringin attention to and showing pride in their heritage, these ppl arn't separating themselves from other Americans at all. They are showing pride in their cultural heritage, which has nothing to do with being white.

  You know what? I don't know where I am from either. My Father comes from Greece, yet his parents were under Turkish rule. They were slaves of the Turks. My Father doesn't know if his Grandmother was a Turk or a Greek. To here tell, if she *was* a Turk, he would kill himself. My point being, there are LOTS of people that were slaves in the world... but we don't ask for reparations.. or special dispensation from the country that was our destiny. You say that blacks don't know their origins... well, alot of us European immigrant children don't either.. and we are even CLOSER to our roots than you are! I am only one generation away from my roots, you are three or four or five, sometimes.

  I agree that people should bring attention to their heritage. That is a GOOD thing. That is exactly what I am saying. WHY should we be ashamed of what we are? Irish people are white, mostly.. and Germans are white, mostly... but it's not the COLOR.. it's the HERITAGE. Black people distinquish themselves by being black.. and yet they are of a thousand different cultures and a thousand different voices. Just like white people.. there are germans, and belgians, and nords, and danes.. all white.. but all a different race and culture.. yet we are all just clumped into one thing: white. Just like YOU clump yourselves into one: BLACK. Why should we integrate ourselves when you want to SEPARATE yourselves with such things as BET, Miss Black America.. etc. But you still demand that we can't hav ethe same thing? I don't get it..

  So why shouldn't we German Americans, Greek Americans, Nord Americans all have a White Miss America since the black race has the Black Miss America? Shouyldn't be a problem.

  CG
• 

  bigboi

  That does make me somewhat irritated that black people are allowed to have all black societies and such but if a white wants to exclude other races it becomes racist and some kind of hypocrisy

  Dude that is a gross misrepresentation of the situation. White ppl have had their own societies catering to their cultural heritages for yrs. Being white has nothing to do with culture. For that matter no other races are exclude from going to black colleges or applying for any scholarships from agencies primarily aimed at minorities. At the Southern Univeristy at Bato Rouge the kicker for the football team a few yrs ago was an Israeli, a recent QB for the team was White as well. Fact is most whites would be ineligible, probably because they don't meet the financial qualifications to get help.

  Check out this page about an organization that caters to one group of white Americans.
• 

  undercover

  Not all things were fixed by the war, just as not all things are right now. But it seems to escape a lot of people that the North had slaves too. In fact, the United States of America who brags about it's freedoms used slave labor up until and during the War Between the States. So what makes the Union any better than the Confederacy? But I think we are digressing from the point of the thread. If reparations where suggested in the late 1800's or early 1900's maybe(not that it would have happened), but 150 years is too late to try to seek damages. And if you want to talk reparations, what about the Indians? Hell, we'd have to move out and give em back the country.
• 

  Country Girl

  I am not trying to be argumentative, at all. I just want people to know that EVERYONE, no matter who they are, has rights to be proud of who they are and where they came from, even if it is unpolitically correct to do so. But in the end. we are *all* americans, if we were born here.

  Whoever bombs us, they are bombing their own citizens, because Americans are a combination of *all* the countries and cultures, and we should be damned well proud we are. We fought hard, or at least our ancestors did, for *all* of us to be free to be, and free to say. I'd hate to see one group thinking they had a cornerstore on the right to speak their peace. That's not democracy, that's communism. So .. as much as you have your right to speak your peace, I have the right to oppose you. And if you try to stop me from my right to speak, well you are no better than the people that we fought against in the first place.

  CG
• 

  Country Girl

  I ifnd it bizarre for a Canadian to teach an American about their own history. Country Girl, the American Civil War was not started over the issue of equality of man. Rather the civil war began over the issue of individual state rights. The Emancipation Proclamation wasn't written until well after the start of the war.

  As far as the issue of reparations go, I agree with your conclusions but not your reasoning.

  You are NOT teaching me something I didn't already know. However, it soon became clear that one of the BIG issues of the Civil War was slavery. If it wasn't .. it wouldn't have been necessary for Mr. Lincoln to decide to make one of his most pressing issues slavery, in that he issued the Emancipation. If it wasn't such a big issue, it wouldn't have been necessary for Union boats to come down the Mississippi and burn several homes and plantations down to the ground, thus annihilating several families from their homes and livelihoods. State's rights weren't the issue. If they were, Mr. Lincoln and his successors wouldn't have cared so strongly about slavery. I'm glad they did.

  They never did take on the state of texas, though. Texas is the only state in the union that is a republic on its own, and has the option to secede from the union based on it's own vote... to this day.

  CG
• 

  heathen

  Bigboi- Last I checked you don't have to be white to be italian or irish or german or french . I do not see the word white although I didn't go over the whole thing. I think it's beyond the scope of reason to try and legislate peoples preferences to the point of telling companies how many of each race they are allowed to hire or telling private schools who they are to admit.
• 

  undercover

  it wouldn't have been necessary for Mr. Lincoln to decide to make one of his most pressing issues slavery, in that he issued the Emancipation. If it wasn't such a big issue, it wouldn't have been necessary for Union boats to come down the Mississippi and burn several homes and plantations down to the ground

  Lincoln knew something that the President and his staff didn't know during Vietnam: A war needs a cause. Without it, the public will turn against it. The North needed a cause. Slavery. That's a good cause. Let's come together as a nation to do away with an evil thing. Lincoln wasn't that much a humanitarian or the Union boats wouldn't have come down the Mississippi and burn homes and plantations down to the ground.
• 

  StinkyPantz

  Being that I'm "Black", "Colored", "African-American", "Negro", etc. I suppose I should comment on this thread... but where should I begin?

  First of all, Country Girl, your post appears to take the stance that ALL Black people seek reparations. In reality, most Blacks aren't out to get reparations for several obvious reasons: 1) We don't blame White Americans now living for what happened, they weren't there, 2) We also weren't slaves, 3) We pay taxes too so any reparations could possibly be coming out of our own pockets, and 4) We wouldn't get much money anyway

  You said:

  Does anybody think how it was for a Mother to lose her children to a battle fighting for the rights of someone she considered less than an equal? What they fought for.. what they all believed in.. was the right for all men to be equal. No shame can be found in that.

  I think that someone already brought this out but the Civil War wasn't completely about equal rights for slaves. A lot of it was about the Confederacy rejoining The Union (money, power). The slavery/equality issue was merely a noble platform to stand on.

  How can African Americans ask for reparation when their lot has become better? Based on the history of civil rights, their lot is way better/ Through the deaths of many people that believed in equal rights as Abe Lincoln expressed it, or as Martin Luther King expressed it, their lot in life is better.. and things are so much more equal.

  -The reason that SOME not ALL Blacks want reparations is because 1) The slaves were promised 40 acres and a mule which they never received and 2) in some ways many Blacks still suffer. If you need me to elaborate I can.

  -Abe Lincoln owned slaves

  -Things are still not equal. Actually far from it if you actually do some research.

  How can people classify themselves as African Americans when they werent BORN in Africa, nor do they have a contact with Africa. They are Americans, cuz they were born here.

  Umm, I know many people that call themselves Asian-American, Hispanic-American, Italian-American, and guess what? They were born here too! Many people have pride in their heritage. My husband is Franco-American and proud of it!

  They continue to SEGREGATE themselves by calling themselves other than American. How can they expect to progress if they keep bringing attention to their differences? They keep saying that America has to pay attention to their differences, celebrate those differences, yet they keep asking America to integrate with them. You either want one or the other. Its okay if you want black colleges, black channels BET, black Ms. America pageants.. but then dont turn around and ask people to IGNORE their caucasion differences, and get upset cuz people want to have Ms. White America pageants, white only clubs, things like that.

  Honey, when Ms. Black America Pageants started there was no place for Blacks in the other pageants, so now it's sort of a tradition, and not a big deal. And I don't think I've ever heard a Black person say they that we should IGNORE caucasian differences, where are you getting this? Plus, there are plenty of white-only organizations (Aryans Nations, KKK, etc), we don't wanna join those.

  What is good for the goose is good for the gander. Do you know how UPSET the NAACP would be if white people formed a union and had a Ms. White USA? How upset people would be if someone formed a WHITE ONLY channel? Well, think about it like that.

  A White only channel. . .how about CMT (Country Music Television) hahaha

  Were all Americans, those of us that were born here. I like the fact that some of us continue to bring our traditions and cultures to the fore, but for the most part.. we are AMERICANS.. and we are all the same.. and we all are lucky to live here and we should be proud.. and should be become one.. AMERICANS.

  Umm, even people that were not born here are Americans too silly girl. Did you know that a person can be born in Germany, but become a citizen by taking an oath? They too are Americans (German-American).

  Edited by - StinkyPantz on 20 January 2003 17:35:49