Does Watchtower Society monitor this board?

by Quotes 75 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  Farkel

  Simon,

  Barbara Anderson left Bethel in the late 1990's.

  : Is there any direct or indirect/circumstantial proof that the boys in Brooklyn are keeping an eye on us?

  I was told by a Bethel insider that the WTS regularly monitors not just high-profile disucssion boards, but high-profile "apostates" and anyone claiming to be elders, COs, DOs, etc. The UN fiasco was a prime example. VERY shortly after their little scam was revealed here, they disassociated themselves from the UN. The reasons for this should be obvious. They want to get ready for any necessary damage control and want to know what is being said about them. Paranoids are like that.

  Doctrine aside, there is a another VERY good reason for some of the brothers want to monitor this board. Have you seen the "Boobs" thread, for example?

  Farkel
• 

  Simon

  doh !
• 

  Quotes

  Thanks guys/gals.

  Let me look at the "proof" offered thus far critically.

  LDH: has proof but can't share it here. That doesn't help us here at all. We don't know the nature of his proof, and can't analyse it. Damn.

  SaintSatan, willy_think, Farkel: Soon after the UN thing broke here, WTBTS disassociated from the UN. Again, this "proof" is an example of "post hoc ergo propter hoc" reasoning.

  Let me put it this way: The same UN story broke in UseNet newsgroup alt.religion.jehovahs-witn at the same time. Maybe WTBTS monitors USENET but not JWD? Of course, I have no proof of that last statement, and the fact that the UN disassociation happened shortly after the story broke on Usenet does not proof that Usenet is what alerted WTBTS to the situation.

  The story broke out here at the same time as The Guardian story. Maybe WTBTS monitors The Guardian? That is plausible, but also unprooved/unproovable.

  Farkel "was told by a bethel insider" -- that is still not proof. Was this person relating something they heard around the water cooler? Maybe "Apostate" Monitoring *IS* an urban legend -- a myth that is believed by JWs and XJWs alike!

  To make my point, turn it around. Imagine I asked "Do Smurfs really walk out of Kingdom Halls?" None of the proof offered so far would be accepted by anyone of us as proof for the demonization of Smurfs.

  Furthermore the boobie thread (I know you were joking about this!) actually makes a point: this is an example of exactly the kind of stuff that WTBTS would want to stay far away from! In fact, the more boobie threads, the less likely it is that WTBTS would risk monitoring! So more boobie threads, I say. Come on gals, post those naughty webcam pics!.... whoops, I'm hijacking my own thread... but for a very good cause.

  Edited by - Quotes on 9 June 2002 9:43:50
• 

  Quotes

  I forgot to add: is it not more likely that some, or perhaps even many, of the R&F lurk here (because they have questions, are weak, are curious, etc.) and they are reacting strongly to their elders or to the WTBTS directly is the actual vector of information travel? Just seems more likely. In fact, I'll bet there are people on this board that were once lurkers in this category that can, anecdotally at least, confirm this.

  Another question: if the Society monitors, where do they do it? They have already stated that viewing apostasy is like letting Satan into your home. They wouldn't want Satan in their little bethel home, so they wouldn't do it at Bethel. But they would want to keep an eye on those doing the monitoring (so they could be releived of duty if they started to show signs of thinking and waking up from the daze) so they would want to do it at Bethel. The whole thing sounds like a logistical nightmare!

  Edited by - Quotes on 9 June 2002 9:40:33
• 

  Quotes

  Another point against the "UN story is proof of monitoring" idea:

  We have been talking about Bill Bowen/Silentlambs issues for many, many months. The first notice of the Dateline show was a year ago (or more).

  When did the WTBTS decide to reprint the "protect your children" stuff on their website? Shortly before the airdate for Dateline -- a date they likely new about directly from NBC, who had been in contact with them while preparing the story.

  If we had any pull at all, they would have started the "we stop molestors, we report" bulls**t spin doctoring a year ago. But they didn't. If they monitor here, and react to what hey see, they would have. But they didn't.

  Edited by - Quotes on 9 June 2002 9:50:18
• 

  Pathofthorns

  I forgot to add: is it not more likely that some, or perhaps even many, of the R&F lurk here (because they have questions, are weak, are curious, etc.) and they are reacting strongly to their elders or to the WTBTS directly is the actual vector of information travel? Just seems more likely. In fact, I'll bet there are people on this board that were once lurkers in this category that can, anecdotally at least, confirm this.

  Again Quotes, I agree with your reasoning and find the above situation a more likely scenario than believing the WT has authorized monitors of this board. I think it is more likely the WT is reacting to information filtering through the "brotherhood" that lurks here, rather than reacting directly to the information passed on by authorized monitors.

  Thanks for bringing this topic into the open.

  Path
• 

  Simon

  of course though ...

  They could never afford to let the info out that they did monitor sites. Even JWs would see this as a "do as we say, not as we do" thing.
• 

  Farkel

  Quotes,

  : Farkel "was told by a bethel insider" -- that is still not proof.

  If you knew what position this insider holds, you would accept it as proof. Frankly, it doesn't matter to me. I know what I know and if you don't choose to believe me, that's your business.

  Farkel
• 

  Quotes

  Interesting point, Simon. Although that takes us into the dangerous world of "conspiracy theory" alarmist arguements, which basically go something like this:

  "Of course there is no proof (for monitoring JWD, for alien creatures on earth, for CIA using mind control waves) because they had to eliminate the proof. Don't you see? They fact there is no proof, prooves it!

  Sorry, I'm not trying to me a wise ass. Just trying to seperate the wheat from the chaf... damn, there I go again using a JW analogy. Sorry!
• 

  Pathofthorns

  Farkel,

  Did your "insider" tell you where and how and by whom this monitoring is carried out? Is it a daily thing or is it when certain issues surface? Who exactly is aware of the monitoring and to whom is any information gathered passed on to?

  I think we all generally agree that information here makes it's way to the organization somehow, it is just in the particulars and the extent of the WT's direct involvement that is of interest to most here.

  Path