Yes, but it's a crazed ad hominem to jump from the basic tenet of all Christianity, that the Jews are not God's people anymore because they rejected the Messiah, to holding someone responsible for past massacres.
Early Evidence for 1 John 5: 7
by Perry 114 Replies latest watchtower bible
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kaik
Or holding entire group of people responsible for event that happened 1970+ years ago for that long.
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designs
Apo- when you have the chance look up the Antisemitic statements of the Protestant founders Martin Luther and John Calvin. At that point Christianity's antisemitism had been in full rage for 1500 years.
You hold the current Wt. Leaders responsible for all past statements, right. Christianity was built on the same mountain of false promises, misplaced guilt, and failed prophecies.
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Rattigan350
1st John was not inspired. It was a letter.
1 John 2:15-17 should go the way that 1 John 5:7 went.
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Viviane
Apo- when you have the chance look up the Antisemitic statements of the Protestant founders Martin Luther and John Calvin. At that point Christianity's antisemitism had been in full rage for 1500 years.
Christianity is all about death. No way around it.
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Apognophos
I do hold the current WT leaders responsible for perpetuating doctrines that they probably know are wrong, like the blood doctrine. That's completely different, however, because it continues to actively endanger people. I don't see anyone advocating real violence against Jews today besides, of course, the Palestinians and various anti-semitic leaders in the Middle East.
Christianity today is not what it was in Martin Luther's time or even 100 years ago so in my mind it has nothing to do with past persecution of Jews. A modern Christian has no violent urges against Jews and is more likely to pray for them out of pity.
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designs
For millions of Christians Jesus must be God in order to save the world, they cannot accept any other formulation that would work. These have gone to the extent to venture into the Jews Bible and insist there is a "Implied Trinity" in the Old Testament. Google it and read the papers by Theologians trying to tell Jews what Deut.6:4, "Echad" and "we" -really- mean.
In 1263 C.E. King James I held a debate in Spain between the Dominican's Raymond Penyafort and Rabbi Nahmanides, the Rabbi was awarded the prize. That of course didn't stop this centuries old contest and Evangelical theologians today still try this argument out on their new students.
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myelaine
dear designs...
Yesterday my comments were (mostly) about what the Torah said about personal sin and the means of atonement required by God. Sacrifice. I didn't say anything that should provoke the response you gave.
Not once did I suggest that all jewish people are "christ killers". it is a fact that today evangelical christian support for the jewish people and israel is in the millions...but I wont shy away from pointing out that back in the day every time Jesus was approached by the religious leaders He showed them from the torah that what He did was "lawful". Unsatisfied, the religious leaders appealed to the roman government and brought charges of sedition against Jesus when all He did was "the works of God". Given that the supreme judge of the land found Jesus innocent of the charges against Him AND given that the religious leaders continued to call for His crucifixion after being found innocent...there is no way to avoid the conclusion that they WERE sinning against their "brother" according to the deut. 19:16-19...19:20-21 implicates the multitude who joined in, calling for Jesus' crucifixion. Jesus died for THEIR sin. that's why He said, "forgive them Father, they know not what they do" ...
Holding all christians accountable for the actions of some is NO BETTER than some christians holding all jewish people accountable for the actions of some. Holding these views in perpetuity IS bigoted and it smacks of narrow mindedness.
Jesus paid the price for not submitting to "authority" and was Himself like two sides of the same coin and He said it best, " render therefore to caesar the things that are caesar's and to God the things that are God's" (matthew 22:15-22)
love michelle
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Chris Tann
Designs- there are many ancient rabbis who wrote about Isaish 53 being a prophecy of their Messiah, not only that, they also write that this prophecy shows that the Messiah would have to suffer for their sins. The Talmud even says the Messiah woukd atone sins by his death. This is not a foreign idea to the jews. But over time, becsuse everything they believed about these prohesies identified Jesus ,the modern rabbis changed the meanings to detract from Jesus.
In Leviticus 17 God says animal blood must be poured out, why? God says because life is in the blood and it is blood that makes atonement for their lives.what can atone all of mans' sins for good than the blood of a perfect man? He doesn't deserve to die, so if he does die at the hands of others that blood now has reedeming power, it now can be symbolically passed on to imperfect humans who believe in its redeeming value, and then they, at Gods due time, can inherit that perfection which was wrongfully taken away from the one who willfully gave it up-Yeshua Maschiach.
This is not Pauline concepts, it is in the Hebrew Bible,and many rabbis knew this and wrote about it. Dont trust modern day rabbis interpretations. Go to the ancient rabbis, if possible the ones who wrote before Jesus. Thank you.
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designs
Protestants Ssshh.
Its unblieveable what goes through your meat grinder.
Try this- Nothing about the Trial of Jesus is accurate, nothing about the accusations in the Gospels about the Jews is accurate. Paul calls the Jews the killers of Christ, that and a few other nasty bits in the NT sent millions of Jews to their deaths.
Simply put Jesus of the Gospels is not the Jewish Messiah, Jesus himself by his actions and words proved that.