Biblical Prohecies That Came True?

by Viviane 250 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  jgnat

  The belief that Isreal would rise again comes from one of Jesus' prophecies and the fig tree, in Matthew 24:

  32 “Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33 Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it [ e ] is near, right at the door. 34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 35

  So I don't think it meet's viv's criteria. It is not specific nor did it happen on time. It was to happen within Jesus' disciple's generation. What might the fig tree be? Many things.
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  Viviane

  I don't think it's even my criteria, jgnat. Those criteria, to me, simply seem a reasonable standard by which we could determine whether or not something was foretold.

  Simply predicting that something reasonable would happen isn't agood standard. For instance, I am posting this from an airplane. It's not a prophecy to predict that at some point this plane will be back on the ground.
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  ilikecheese

  Here are some scriptures that talk about it. I'm not super passionate about this or anything. I just thought I'd put it out there.

  In Jeremiah 30... The word that came to Jeremiah from the Lord : “Thus says the Lord , the God of Israel: Write in a book all the words that I have spoken to you. For behold, days are coming, declares the Lord , when I will restore the fortunes of my people, Israel and Judah, says the Lord , and I will bring them back to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall take possession of it.”

  In Amos 9... I will restore the fortunes of my people Israel, and they shall rebuild the ruined cities and inhabit them; they shall plant vineyards and drink their wine, and they shall make gardens and eat their fruit. I will plant them on their land, and they shall never again be uprooted out of the land that I have given them,” says the Lord your God.

  In Isaiah 11... He will raise a signal for the nations and will assemble the banished of Israel, and gather the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.
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  Viviane

  In Jeremiah 30... The word that came to Jeremiah from the Lord : “Thus says the Lord , the God of Israel: Write in a book all the words that I have spoken to you. For behold, days are coming, declares the Lord , when I will restore the fortunes of my people, Israel and Judah, says the Lord , and I will bring them back to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall take possession of it.”

  The UN did that, not Jehovah. They don't have all the land they had. Also, it's a secular nation with many Muslims and Christians living there.

  In Amos 9... I will restore the fortunes of my people Israel, and they shall rebuild the ruined cities and inhabit them; they shall plant vineyards and drink their wine, and they shall make gardens and eat their fruit. I will plant them on their land, and they shall never again be uprooted out of the land that I have given them,” says the Lord your God.

  Well, clearly that one can't be true, one day the sun will expand and turn everything on it to a crisp, so the "never" on that one fails.

  In Isaiah 11... He will raise a signal for the nations and will assemble the banished of Israel, and gather the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

  Not all of the dispersed are there. Also, the UN re-established the nation of Israel, not Jehovah.
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  ilikecheese

  Just to play devil's advocate...

  If God does exist, the UN could have been who he used to re-establish Israel.

  Even if Christians and Muslims live there, it's still a nation that's "for" Jews. Sorry for the poor phrasing, but you know what I mean.

  If God exists, surely he will stop the earth from ultimately being destroyed by the sun.

  The verse doesn't say all of the dispersed will be there.
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  Viviane

  If God does exist, the UN could have been who he used to re-establish Israel.

  Could be, but now you have to prove that God exists. Theological argument, not a historical one.

  Even if Christians and Muslims live there, it's still a nation that's "for" Jews. Sorry for the poor phrasing, but you know what I mean.

  I don't, actually. Ethnically or religiously? What about Jews for Jesus or Jews by heritage but are atheist?

  If God exists, surely he will stop the earth from ultimately being destroyed by the sun.

  That's easily provable either way in about 5 billion years.

  The verse doesn't say all of the dispersed will be there.

  If you tell me to pay "the" bill or to bring "the" cake, and I only pay half of the bill or bring half of a cake, I've not done what you asked. It's simple, it wasn't fulfilled. Saying "the" means someting very specific that hasn't happened. Prophecy failed.
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  ilikecheese

  I mean ethnically Jewish, not religiously.

  The reason that I mention the whole God bit is that if you're trying to determine if prophecy has been fulfilled, there is an undercurrent of "if it has been fulfilled, maybe God does exist."

  As for that last bit, if you said, "The dispersed Syrians will come back when things are stable again," it doesn't necessarily mean all of them. The followup question would generally be, "All of them?"
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  Viviane

  I mean ethnically Jewish, not religiously.

  In that case it's very ethically diverse.

  The reason that I mention the whole God bit is that if you're trying to determine if prophecy has been fulfilled, there is an undercurrent of "if it has been fulfilled, maybe God does exist."

  Maybe it all fits exactly into Ba'al's plan. Who knows! Which God? Why that God? That's why this is a historical and not theological debate. I predict my plane will land. If it does, can I make claims of being God?

  As for that last bit, if you said, "The dispersed Syrians will come back when things are stable again," it doesn't necessarily mean all of them. The followup question would generally be, "All of them?"

  "The" means "the", not "some of". If that's not what you meant, then you should have the foresight to phrase it accurately. Another argument against God.
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  Vidqun

  Ilikecheese, has a point. If one can “prove” prophecy, that would be an indication that God exists. That’s why I would catogorize myself as a theist, until such time as I am proven wrong.

  For Punky: Seems like Nebuchadnezzar did invade Egypt, but the information is scanty. One thing I know for sure, Egypt was never the same after his invasion. From then on Egypt was a secondary power:

  Following the pacification of the Phoenician state of Tyre, Nebuchadnezzar turned again to Egypt. A clay tablet, now in the BritishMuseum, states: "In the 37th year of Nebuchadnezzar, king of the country of Babylon, he went to Mizraim (Egypt) to wage war. Amasis, king of Egypt, collected [his army], and marched and spread abroad." [1]

  The following article discusses the next chapter (Is. 30). Scholars split the two, because Nebuchadnezzar would only fulfill Is. 29. Much later Cambyses and Ptolemy Lathyrus would do the rest.

  Significantly enough, then, Egypt’s history records the fulfillment of more striking prophecy than does any other nation’s. Their mighty capital, Thebes, has fallen in ruin just as Ezekiel foretold (ch. 30:14–16). By No the Scriptures generally designate the magnificent city of Thebes. “Such vast and surprising remains are still to be seen,” says Pococke, “of such magnificence, and solidity, as may convince any one who beholds them that, without some extraordinary accident, they must have lasted forever; which seems to have been the intention of the founders of them.” However, there are no accidents with God. Thebes sank beneath two of the most terrible blows ever dealt by the hand of man, both of them after the prophecy of downfall. The first destruction came from Cambyses, and the second from Ptolemy Lathyrus. Not until 25 BC was the third part of Ezekiel’s prophecy fulfilled, when the city was finally broken up into separate villages. [2]

  ---

  [ 1] Elgood, Percival George. 1951. Later Dynasties of Egypt. Oxford: Basil Blackwell, p. 106.

  [2] Bibliotheca Sacra Volume 93. 1936 (371) (pp. 350, 351). Dallas, TX: Dallas Theological Seminary.
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  Phizzy

  As I said earlier on this Thread, all aspects of a prophecy must come true, or it is not a prophecy. The method you seem to be using Vidqun is the same as many have used with Bible "prophecy", pick bits which seem to fit , ignore the others,(i.e Eze 30v12, Nile dried up ? whole Land barren ?) or claim those bits await future fulfillment.

  Hardly convincing.

  The same method is used to interpret Nostradamus.

  Cities come and go, Nations come and go, this is as normal as the Sun rising, though takes longer, it is not Prophecy.

  Two words, Viv's criteria.