Greetings from a new member (page 11)

Vidqun

Eden, I would love to hear your view on "the disgusting thing causing desolation" as touched upon by Daniel and Jesus, and the beast that ascends out of the abyss in the book of Revelation. This is where JW are condemned by their own doctrines. They still assert that above refers to the UN. How is it that they can take out membership of the DPI of the UN as a NGO for nine years? The different JW orgs (European are still part of the OSCE. You know what the book of Revelation has to say about those worshipping the beast or having the number of the beast on their forehead and hand (it is repeated seven or eight times in Revelation). By the way, you cannot have the number of the beast AND the name of God and Christ on your forehead. If these things are indeed so, the Watchtower is in grave trouble (cf. Ezek. 38 & 39; Dan. 12:7; Zech. 13:7, 8; 14:1-5; Matthew 24:14; Mark 13:14; Rev. 11:7, 8). By the way, because I disagreed with the Watchtower on their interpretation of Rev. 11 (amongst others) I was disfellowshipped as an apostate. So beware.

Hoffnung

Hi Eden,

I checked out your website and can identify with how you feel about it all. You made some real good points in the 2nd part of your Mission Statement. It is great you can do all this research and draw conclusions at your own pace, and just as you I was struck by the somehow peaceful way Ray Franz wrote about his own experiences inside the GB.

You wrote that meetings provided you a spiritual routine and fellowship, and you just have to weed out what you know to be incorrect. I thought like that for a while too. The problem is, or will become, you know now what it means to really see. It will be hard, if not impossible, to become blind again. The longer I kept attending meetings, the more I noticed how many points were advanced without back up from the bible, and how many verses were pulled out of context to fit an idea. In the end, the ride home after every meeting, was a discussion between my wife and me about such points we had noticed during the meeting. After about one year like this, it became obvious for us that attending meetings was a waste of time. By then, I had also stopped going in service because I could not continue spreading ideas that I knew to be falsehoods, and as a reaction to being inactive, our "friends" started to keeping their distance from us, so that took away the last reason for us to keep going.

We are both inactive now, and reconnecting with the worldly family of my wife, and making new friends, enjoying simple things like birthdays etc.

I don't know if anybody recommended it, but I would like to encourage you to read Steven Hassans book: "Releasing the Bonds, empowering people to think for themselves". You will understand better what really happens at the meetings, and why many people need a lot of time to move on after having quit being a witness.

Hoffnung

00DAD

Hoffnung,

Well said!

Great suggestion for Eden to read Hassan's book.

00DAD

cantleave

I appreciate your response to my question Eden. I wish you every success on your voyage of discovery.

ABibleStudent

Eden to ABibleStudent " . . .As for the Holy Spirit being the channel ... I believe the Holy Spirit is the vehicle, not the channel; It's the difference between the car and the road. The GB claims to be the only road by which the Holy Spirit travels. However, that is not what Jesus said. He taught that anyone who sincerely asks God for his Holy Spirit and looks into the Scriptures for direction, will be able to be guided by that spirit. "

Hi Eden, I have a slightly different view than you have about the Holy Spirit being the channel between God and Jesus Christ and people, but we would still arrive at the same conclusion about the relationship of reading the Scriptures and being guided by the Holy Spirit.

Are you worried about losing relationships of family and friends because of the Shun Gun that the WTBTS points at the minds of all JWs? Do you know the history of the WTBTS' Shunning Doctrine? JWfacts has a good and detailed article about it in "Disfellowshipping and Shunning" - the article is a little long for me but has good references. Did you know that C.T. Russell the founder of the Zion Watchtower (later to transform into the WTBTS) wrote in the April 1887 Watchtower magazine on page 923 against shunning as currently practised by the WTBTS? I know that C.T. Russell's ideas are "Old Light" and not "New Light" but how did the light get brigther by the change and why was the light changed?

If you are worried about losing relationships with your family and friends because they will shun you, you really should read Steve Hassan's book "Freedom of Mind" because you will learn how to communicate better with your family and friends through their BITE control indoctrination.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

EdenOne

Ok, I can post again. This limitation isn't so amusing.....

First of all, regarding the book by S. Hassan, I will only read it if I one day make up my mind about leaving. Until then, I will make a mental note of it for a possible later use. Thank you for the tip anyway.

Of course, losing family and friends in "the truth", that one was taught to cultivate in a regime of almost exclusivity, while discarding everyone else, is a devastating horizon to contemplate. Moreso when your own spouse is very straight about divorcing if you turn out an "apostate" for her loyalty is stronger to "Jehovah's Organization" than to any man - husband included. So, yes, there are circumstances like these to ponder. However, I'm headstrong enough to get over it all if remaining a member becomes unbearable. But it has the potential to leave bruises and scars for sure.

Thank you for the sympathetic words.

Eden

cofty

regarding the book by S. Hassan, I will only read it if I one day make up my mind about leaving.

You are hiding from information that you and your family need to know.

ABibleStudent

Eden "Of course, losing family and friends in "the truth", that one was taught to cultivate in a regime of almost exclusivity, while discarding everyone else, is a devastating horizon to contemplate. Moreso when your own spouse is very straight about divorcing if you turn out an "apostate" for her loyalty is stronger to "Jehovah's Organization" than to any man - husband included. So, yes, there are circumstances like these to ponder. However, I'm headstrong enough to get over it all if remaining a member becomes unbearable. But it has the potential to leave bruises and scars for sure."

Hi Eden, Based on your previous post, I presume that you are married to a "Spiritually Strong" (gag!) JW? If you are married to a JW, I would recommend that you read the following thread by stuckinamovement "Progress ( I think? ) in helping my wife to see the "truth"". From what I have learned from reading Steve Hassen's books and posts by other exJWs, it is best not to bottle up your feelings inside of you, it is best to start making non-JW friends and introducing your wife to them, and planning fun and enjoyable holidays away together without thinking about the WTBTS. Something as simple as going to a nice hotel that is not recommended by the WTBTS to attend an assembly could be a nice way to appear like a JW but not get totally sucked into the JW indoctrination and expose your wife to a different perspective.

If you are very conflicted by your feelings that the WTBTS is wrong on many issues and that you love your spouce very much, I would also recommend that you start another thread and ask members about their experiences dealing with "Spiritually Strong" (brain dead) JW spouses.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

jgnat

I am so grateful to have myself a "spiritually weak" JW.

soft+gentle

edenOne

I have strong JWs in my family, my husband included and they are the reason I tend to toe the line as far as possible. I love them very much and honestly believe they need input like mine more than I need them. It would be even better if they read sites like this one, cedars and yours, juan viejo's and others. but perhaps in time they will

Greetings from a new member

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