Interesting Jesus cults

by Christ Alone 205 Replies latest jw friends

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  NewChapter

  I don't think the bible advocated much of it

  Well now you don't get to make assumptions that I'm just an angry person that hates WT and doesn't know my bible, as you did with other atheists there at the top. So perhaps you will consider me qualified to make this argument. There will be no invalidating baby/bathwater assumptions here.

  Your above comment is dead wrong---not spoken from a place of anger or ignorance---but from a place of deep research. It advocated all of it, and it's time to stop pretending that those that think so are ignorant or angry. Stop pretending that we are merely focusing on the negative, as you seem to only want to focus on the positive. Taken as a whole, positive and negative, the message and the law is very brutal by today's standards. And there would be no real anger there, as you like to point to the anger as though there is absolutely nothing to be angry about, how could this affect anyone, kind of attitude, except that we are judged by and forced to live with many of the concepts of this ancient, unenlightened, culture.

  That's where the anger comes from. Dismiss it if you like, that doesn't matter to me, it simply makes your assumptions wrong.

  Genocide, rape, stonings, women-hating, ethnic cleansing---this is all advocated by the bible. Jesus did not disagree with the law. He read from the law. He modified things, but he did not criticize what had come before. He basically said it was right for its time. And perhaps it was, if it came from a purely human place. But because you want to claim this came not from humans, but from a god of love, wisdom etc, then we get to hold it to a higher standard. We don't hold it to human standards, because most Christians don't. Before Tec jumps on and dismisses this---yeah, yeah, Tec, we know, you go directly to the source. The source you learned about from the bible. The source you will quote when it suits you, and dismiss what does not suit you.

  CA, you can't see it. I get that. I know how that works. You can read about mass killings, horrible injustices, unequal laws and somehow filter that through and see love, forgiveness, wisdom and so forth. Yet if I were to read it while hiding the source, you would see. You would be appalled.
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  Christ Alone

  I wasn't accusing all atheists,NC. Just the ones that claimed to do a thorough investigation, but clearly don't know what the bible says (whether they agree with it or not). As I said, you are not one of those.
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  Christ Alone

  Taking just one of those, how did the bible advocate rape?

  and no, I don't accuse all those that disagree with the bible as being angry. I just call it anger when it's expressed angrily. Your post, for example, was not angry, and was well thought out. That's the difference. I read what you wrote and I can logically debate it.
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  EntirelyPossible

  Tec, they don't know that the bible supports what we are saying because thy don't know the bible.

  Let's be fair, there is a ton of stuff going on like "the Bible says God lives outside of our universe and spacetime" and when asked to be shown where the Bible mentions spacetime (or the word universe), you get a scripture that talks about heaven. Sure, go ahead and claim atheists don't know what the Bible says, but there is, from theists, a whole of claiming it says things it doesn't actually say.
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  tec

  Jesus did not disagree with the law

  You're right. He did not. But some of what was written AS the law, was NOT the law. Hence, he corrected those. (woe to the SCRIBES and TEACHERS... the people who WROTE and TAUGHT the law... or rather miswrote and mistaught)

  If they had gotten it all right... then he would not have had to correct any teachings.

  Tec, we know, you go directly to the source. The source you learned about from the bible. The source you will quote when it suits you, and dismiss what does not suit you.

  I don't ever dismiss the source, as you state here.

  I do dismiss what is in conflict with Him though.

  Peace,

  tammy
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  Christ Alone

  And NC, when you researched this subject, did you read what skeptics as well as Jews and Christians say about the passages under consideration? If so, what about their arguments did you disagree with?
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  Christ Alone

  EP, you were one of the worst offenders. You would say the bible didn't say something when it did. And when shown you would merely say you didn't agree with no proof either way
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  EntirelyPossible

  Just the ones that claimed to do a thorough investigation, but clearly don't know what the bible says (whether they agree with it or not).

  What about beleivers that claim the Bible says things it doesn't say?

  I don't ever dismiss the source, as you state here.

  I do dismiss what is in conflict with Him though.

  As I wrote once before, you treat the bible like a booty call. You ignore it when it suits you and then ride as long as you can when you want it. The Bible is the gateway to Jesus. Without it, you have no source material. If you could get to Jesus without the Bible, you would have Muslims that had never read it, Native Americans 500 years ago suddenly getting revelation about Jesus, aboriginals in Australia and remote tribes in south america suddenly popping up knowing all about Jesus from revelation.

  But that doesn't happen. Because they don't have the Bible. In order for that Jesus to make any sense, you have to get through the murder, rape, genocide, abortion and death from a petulant God stomping his feet because people wanted to play without him.
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  EntirelyPossible

  EP, you were one of the worst offenders. You would say the bible didn't say something when it did. And when shown you would merely say you didn't agree with no proof either way

  I know I offended you when I kept pointing out the Bible never actually said what you were claiming it did on multiple ocassions. The example of God living outside of spacetime is one of those times you needed that correction.

  There is no need to get emotionally involved in whether or not a text actually says something. If you say "this says x", we just look and see if it says "x". If it doesn't, you are wrong (and you were).

  Now, you can play the game of "well....this really means what I am claiming", and that's all fine and good, but you have to restate that as your opinion and choice to personally interpret the text to mean what you want because, at the end of the day, it doesn't actually say what you claim.
• 

  tec

  What about beleivers that claim the Bible says things it doesn't say?

  Then you can draw the same conclusions about them if you like.

  The Bible is the gateway to Jesus.

  It is just a tool. A finger pointing the way to Christ. Written witness accounts to Christ. At the time, they were verbal witness accounts to Christ. There was no bible back then, or even any gospel accounts.

  For Christ to make sense, you just have to listen to what He teaches.

  Peace to you,

  tammy