Why aren't you an Atheist?

by Bloody Hotdogs! 697 Replies latest jw friends

  • DATA-DOG
    DATA-DOG

    I hate dogma of any kind. Dogma, and the persons who benefit from promoting it are stopping real progress for everyone. Religious dogma, scientific dogma, it's all the same to me. Science would seem to have upper hand because you can test your theories to see if they are true. Religious experiences can be anectodal and hard to prove. So until we can actually part the Red Sea no one will believe it. Still if I reason about my world, EVERYTHING I see has been made. The most gigantic skyscraper to the tiniest nano-bot all had to be made by someone. The natural world is infinitely more complicated. I just can't believe it came to be by pure chance. The Bible says that God created everything according to it's " kind ". What happened after that is anybody's guess, a slow evolution of the " kinds " into thier modern varieties? I could buy that. Life was seeded on earth by " God " I can buy that. A " spiritual " realm that co-exists with ours and sometimes interacts with it? I can believe that. What I can't believe is that a small mammal decided to swim into the predator filled waters in the distant past and survived long enough to either find another mammal swimming around and mate with it, Or it reproduced by masturbation somehow and little mammals came along. Then they were not immediately eaten. They swam around too, until they eventually became what we call dolphins today. All this from a "similar " bone from a fossil. That's as bat shit crazy as 1,600 furlongs being the distance from Hoboken to Bethel! THAT is why I am not an atheist. I may not know all the answers but I don't have to believe dogma that sells a Watchtower or a National Geographic.

    Dogma #1

    Dogma #2

    "By the space of a thousand and [six] TWO hundred furlongs. - This cannot be interpreted to refer to the 2100 mile battle line of the world war. A furlong or stadium is not a mile and this is without the city whereas the battle line is within the city. See Rotherham's translation. A stadium is 606¾ English ft; 1200 stadii are, mi., 137.9 The work on this volume was done in Scranton, Pa. As fast as it was completed it was sent to the Bethel. Half of the work was done at an average distance of 5 blocks from the Lackawanna station, and the other half at a distance of 25 blocks. Blocks in Scranton are 10 to the mile. Hence the average distance to the station is 15 blocks, or........... 1.5 mi. Official Railway Guide time-table distance Scranton to Hoboken Terminal, 133.0 ft. New York City Engineer's official distance Hoboken to the Bethel, via Barclay Street Ferry, Fulton Street and Fulton Ferry, 8,850, 4,950, 2,540 and 1,460 feet respectively, or a total of..............3.4 ft. Shortest distance from place where the winepress was trodden by the Feet Members of the Lord, Whose guidance and help alone made this volume possible. (John 6:60, 61; Matt. 20:11.)...........mi.,137.9"

    Neither should be believed by a reasoning person.

  • still thinking
    still thinking

    Thors pretty good too...but I need to have a word with him about this bloody rain at the moment...it's like he's trying to copy Jehooblah and cause another flood...

  • King Solomon
    King Solomon

    Thanks for nuttin, NC: I will blame you for my nightmare tonight!

    SNR said: "King solomon the not so wise, The only true statement is "We dont know."

    Firstly..I am greatful you dont work in science.

    Wrongo, but way to shoot your argument down (as I look at my doctorate diploma from Cal)!

    secondly... On probability and the evidence of gods invention along with lack of evidence of his existance. Saying I am 99% convinced he doesnt exist is not only NOT wishy-washy, it is kind for I am saying there is 1% chance you are right and not a blind, ignorant fool, worshing the empty space above you and praying to nothing more than an imagined egomaniac with tendency for genocide, slavery, war, incest, rape, racism, sexism and dictatorship that demands exclusive devotion, a jealous, wrathful ball bag.

    A whole 1%...... Just for you!

    Well, we agree; I think you should just tell them that, lol!

    You're getting warm, in that I can conclusively say that the Abrahamic God as depicted in the Bible does NOT exist. Why? We have evidence from geology, history, biology (evolution), anatomy, cosmology, astronomy, archaeology, anthropology, and anything ese with -onomy/-ology/ at the end to show the Bible is a work of men and not Divine Inspiration. We understand the motives of the men who wrote the Bible, and only a fool would allow their own desires and wish fulfillment blind them to reality and apologetics required to save ancient myths as truths. The stories display logical inconsistencies that would make a creative writing student give up in shame.

    NOW, do I admit there is the possibility that some OTHER unknown deistic being somewhere started life processes? It's possible, but there's absolutely no benefit to believing that: it only kicks the "who created life?" question down the road, and gets us nowhere closer to finding an answer. It's an impediment to finding the answer, intellectual laziness.

    The problem with the cautious "scientific" stance is that Bible thumpers assume that ANY shadow of doubt on your part means you lose (you lack faith), when you and I know that you SHOULD always allow yourself to entertain hypotheses, remain open-minded, even for the highly-improbable.

    In law, we don't demand ABSOLUTE INCONTROVERTIBLE PROOF to convict someone, because you NEVER have that. Instead, you need sufficient evidence on which to act (where extraordinary claims has a higher burden of proof). An infinitesimal possibility of being wrong doesn't handicap you from moving forward and acting on your beliefs.

    As a trained physician, we have a saying: "if you hear hooves approaching, think horses, not zebras (if you're standing in California, not Africa)". This means when considering tentative diagnoses for clinical signs you see, you start with the MOST LIKELY, and work your way down to the least-likely. The same approach can be applied to any situation in life, AKA Occams Razor.

    There's no demand for absolutes in ANY field of knowledge, BUT theology (and those who misunderstand practical science).

    Ah, never mind: I just realized YOU may think I'm a theist?

  • ziddina
    ziddina

    Is it just me, or does Chthulu look an awful lot like Zoidberg from "Futurama"???

  • Kojack57
    Kojack57

    Bloodyhotdogs: Welcome! I still believe in Jesus, just not the BORG.

    kojack

  • 144001
    144001

    I think the origin of humans and our purpose on this planet is beyond human comprehension. I reject all of man's ideas regarding deities, yet allow for the possibility that some superior entity of a nature entirely unfathomable by man exists or existed and played some role in the development of our universe and everything in it. However, if such an entity exists or existed, I believe it, and everything about it, was and is beyond human comprehension.

    Because man doesn't like unanswered questions, religion was born. The world has been adversely affected by the cancer that is religion ever since.

    I'm quite happy stating that my faith is "none."

  • DarioKehl
    DarioKehl

    I'm officially jealous now. Congrats, Bloody Hotdogs!!! Your first post already has 4 pages in less than 24 hours. Good topic! I gotta start more interesting threads, apparently.

    Athiest, btw =)

  • ammo
    ammo

    Welcome Hotdog!

    For me atheist is a little too cut and dried, I know there so much evidence to suggest there is no God, and one can surely question their whereabouts when I see starving generation's and wartorn countries that never had peace, but the spiritual realm holds way too much we as humans cannot fathom, and to disregard it all and seal it up with a Nothingness well I'm not sure if I could ever accept that.

    I do think that as humans we have fallen for a lot of tripe, and there is an inate yearning to know about our beginning's and our future-ending's, but I do not think we as human's have gotten over the basic lesson's inlife yet, to get along with each other, to learn forgiveness and to really Love, we can do that on a small scale but imajine it on a global scale, we are capable of it, but like breaking a diet we tend to gravitate to wards whats not good for us or our world. I know we could feed all those starving, educate those without, stop all war's, if we just learn to forgive and love,instead of greed and territorial leaning's that prosper only a few.... I live in hope, I try to live by these way's nowaday's, specially after leaving the WTBTS BS behind.

    Anyway enjoy your stay and great opening topic mate!!!

  • tec
    tec

    If you have used reason, logic, science, whatever, to liberate your mind from the JW faith, why haven't you also let go of God? Of course, this question does not apply to everyone...

    Because the JW faith is not God. Rejecting jws was just rejection of a lie about God.

    I had faith in God before the jws. I have faith in Him after. JW's were a step on my path. (a stumbling step, perhaps... but when i regained my footing, I did not reject the path)

    Peace,

    tammy

  • rip van winkle
    rip van winkle

    Welcome Hotdog! Just because someone realizes that the WTS is full of sh*t doen't automatically make one dismiss their belief in God.

    However, the short journey I have been taking leads to other possibilities. I'm not against what others believe and I'm willing to view different opinions and ideas. And I am doing my own research- not just listening to the opinions on JWN. But if it wasn't for JWN and some very opinionated people(which I like BTW) I probably would never have begun to read "The Athiest's Way". And I also got a Hitchens book.

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