Steven Unthank: What do we really know?

by SweetBabyCheezits 503 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

• 

  talesin

  Sweet Baby C,

  I do not think your OP was ill-intended; I just think that the wiser path (knowing how ppl around here will pounce on anything to make an argument), would have been to do your research FIRST, instead of throwing it out into the airspace. You are not a stranger to the forum, and I wish you would have paused a moment longer before you made your OP.

  Mr. Unthank is bound to make mistakes,,, I have apologized when I made my own,, but I think it was your mistake to bring this up before you had all the facts, considering the nature of the 'net. That is my only criticism (and it is slight) of the OP..... what I take exception to,,, is the way it has been twisted by others.

  The drama queens, and those who may or may not be, WT trolls, have blown this way out of proportion, and my only problem with the OP, is that you did not research it thoroughly enough, before presenting a premise in a forum where you, by virtue of your long-term experience in this, and other forums, may have stopped to consider how it would get twisted.

  Furthermore,,, MrMustard,,, the two most important facts of the case, which you so conveniently listed (and I thank you),,, are this:

  3) I can't verify any of the court case numbers on the original site

  4) The site given to verify the court case numbers appears to be invalid

  3. VERIFIED

  4. VERIFIED

  Let's not be like the JWs, and fail to 'see the forest for the trees'.

  THESE are the important facts ... did Steven's zeal lead him to illustrate these truths in a way that can be nit-picked? Perhaps.

  But the FACTS REMAIN .

  what is important here is this :

  THE COURT CASE IS A REALITY.. CHILDREN WERE SEXUALLY ABUSED, AND STEVEN HAS BROUGHT IT TO LIGHT AND MADE A CHANGE IN THE WAY THE WTS HANDLES THESE MATTERS.

  PERIOD

  CHILDREN ARE BEING RAPED, AND IT'S BEING COVERED UP. STEVEN UNTHANK HAS BROUGHT THIS TO LIGHT.

  He is NOT a lawyer,,, he is a PRIVATE CITIZEN, who made it his business to do WHAT HE CAN. Did he make mistakes? Perhaps. WHO CARES? As someone else said,,, you have no right judging this unless you WENT THROUGH IT. I, personally, can overlook the mistakes he made due to a passion for the cause,,, because TO ME, that cause is WORTH IT.

  Thanks, Simon, for taking care of the trolls,,, as always ....

  t
• 

  james_woods

  I think the question raised in the OP is a totally valid one and certainly the caption aroused my suspicions when I first read it in this thread. But it would have been far better to first privately ask Steven to clarify what he meant by that statement before doing a public expose.

  I don't understand why, Leolia. This was a public criticism of a public statement - SBC was in no ethical or moral obligation to "bring it up privately".

  If it were a private matter between private individuals, yes - take it up privately. But public things are fair game to question publicly.
• 

  MeanMrMustard

  @cedars"

  "All I'm saying is, what's the rush??"

  What rush? Did I convey urgency in my posts? I didn't mean to. I simply was wondering if anyone else was able to find documents on the official site. Why the urgency to drop it?

  MeanMrMustard
• 

  cedars

  Who knows . . . maybe backing the wrong horse will get me kicked off here as well. I have no doubt whatsoever that many would be thrilled. What a terrible personal tragedy that would be for me.

  Sizemik - please don't be flippant. You are sorely needed on this forum as a voice of reason. Hell, you've sorted me out more than once. This forum would be a far more sorry place if you left. I read the pages of this thread, and it seemed last night like you were overwhelmed by an angry mob. I'm sorry I wasn't around at the time to share the load. Please stick around, because you're needed more than you realize.

  Cedars
• 

  MeanMrMustard

  @talesin:

  You were able to verify the cases from the offical site? Can you please give the link to the official site - and directions on how you verified the case numbers. I will duplicate your results, if possible.

  MeanMrMustard
• 

  cyberjesus

  Yes I get to answer to LEO:

  There has been no restraint in this thread in checking facts before making accusations of lying and hoaxing; a mere suspicion has been enough.

  >> who should be checking facts? Us correct? but then when you go and check them what are you called?..... i wont say cuz the sizemik is gonna say I am playing the victim card. Suspicion is enough to research. you are a resercher and you know it. it is that curiosity that takes to places no others go...

  For instance, the matter with the string drawing. Because it looks too detailed, and because it shows high ELA values, it is not only considered suspicious, but a lie ("One lie comes with 100 hundred", as it was stated in the post about the photo forensics).

  >>The amount of detailed in the picture is relevant... why? because is is a drawing from a 3 dimensional object. To achieve that effect (foreshortening) required training. so that is why I reserched it.... What did I find and what did I state? I was very careful, go read again and see. the ELA values are related with a different issue.. those are related with the fact that the coloring was made in a computer and not by hand. that it was carefully edited in a program and then saved..

  oh and by the way one lie comes with 100 hundred might not be a fact... but it never comes alone.... well thats my observation.

  I don't see any reasoned argument of how the ELA pattern is supposed to indicate this. Looking at the tutorial page, it is quite normal for an original digital image to have high ELA values throughout the image with darker areas with lower ELA values. And to me, the image doesn't look too detailed at all.

  >>To you. but that is your personal opinion... look at the squared patttern all around the picture and the coloring in the middle.. that picture was a picture and then edited that is fact.. the coloring is edited.. thats a fact... not my opinion...

  It looks like an ink or paint (with two colors, red and yellow) impression of a ball of string -- exactly the kind of things I made in kindergarten.

  >>If you made this in kindergarden then you were a child genius... thats not a simple picture... open it and maximize it... you can actually follow the threads from one end to the next..one layer after the other... If you do that in kindergarden .... do an experiment... get a ball of yarn and attempt to do it ... and post your drawing as an adult..... lets see if your drawing skillls improved..

  Hence the detail and 3D look. And looking at the coloration and specks in the background when the levels are adjusted, it does look like a cutout that has been scanned. So what is the basis for implying that the claim about the image is a lie?

  >>The issue here is that the stamentes in the picture before that were a LIE and the apology misleading.... YOU CAN READ IT for your yourself dont take my word for it.

  That's different from saying that one is skeptical or has suspicions. I try to be skeptical of most claims when I see them, or at least want to see the evidence first, and I totally understand why people here are trigger-happy with accusations on account of what has happened here in the (recent) past, but there has been absolutely no caution shown here. Before running with the suspicion that the whole entire court proceedings were a hoax, surely some fact-checking could have been done first.

  >>Thats exactly what we are trying to do here. some fact checking....

  Thanks you know I admire you... i just had to respond... :-)
• 

  cedars

  MeanMrMustard - I'm not accusing you of anything, I'm just saying that many of the issues raised in this thread could have been easily settled with a little more patience and a little less finger-pointing. I'm certainly not suggesting that you have been hasty. If anything, I applaud your sincerity in wanting to know the truth, whatever the truth may be. I'm just noting that sometimes it takes time, that's all.

  Cedars
• 

  MeanMrMustard

  @all:

  This link is acceptable verification: http://www.heraldsun.com.au/ipad/bid-to-rein-in-jehovahs-witnesses-fails/story-fn6bfm6w-1226095947662

  cyberjesus, do you agree?

  MeanMrMustard
• 

  3dogs1husband

  you cant post a minors picture and claim that she was raped and that legos were used in the hororr....(and it was clear is WAS suspose to be her in the image) and not expect this kinda fall out.....
• 

  MeanMrMustard

  @all:

  Just a note: the link I just posted was from WitnessMyFury's post. It seems to show a newpaper article verifying there was some legal action in Oz over WWC.

  Another note: I can't find any case number from the "fake" site in the "real" site, and I can't find any case number from the "real" site in the "fake" site. So the case numbers just aren't working out.

  MeanMrMustard