Are you sure leaving is a wise decision ?- Lurkers think twice- Part 2

by mankkeli 283 Replies latest jw experiences

  • NewChapter

    Ummm, NewChapter, those little blue pills are not exactly anti-depressants ...

    Ohhhhhh. No wonder they are so effective at lifting the little fellas---er----moods.

  • mummatron

    (I personally don't feel that posting threads that display so much hostility towards XJWs in an XJW forum is conducive to the flow and normally welcoming atmosphere of the board, but hey, that's just my opinion.)

    Can I be serious here for a minute..? Those who are lurking may well be struggling with suicidal thoughts and being discouraged from coming on here to have a rant about what is bothering them (regardless of that being bOrg-related or not) could be the difference between them acting on those thoughts or not. If someone is sufficiently depressed to be experiencing such a state of mind then they are vulnerable and deserve to be treated with love and respect, and welcomed by having their voices heard, rather than have it suggested that they turn away back to somewhere where they no longer have a voice.

    If I hadn't have left when I did I very much doubt I'd have lived to see my 20th birthday. 2 of my friends from a neighbouring congregation both attempted suicide. Both were young women aged 17-20. Both were pioneers. 1 an elder's daughter and grandchild of an annointed, the other a MS's daughter. Despite having many so-called JW friends, not one of us felt we could confide in each other about how we were feeling. All of us suffered from the same feelings of inadequacy, guilt and shame brought on from our lifetimes of indoctrination from birth. None of us felt we were ever doing enough to warrant survival of the GT/Armargeddon. We all felt we'd be better off taking a direct route to the New System by ending our lifes in the current one. It's the collective "us versus the world" scenario. This fits in with Emile Durkheim's Theory of Egoistic Suicide where this is labelled as "excessive individualization". There have been many socio-psychological studies borne out of Durkheim's theory which corroborate the link between religious integration and suicide. You may or may not wish to read them, but they make for interesting reading and sure enough the same can be said for religious martyrdom, or the laying down of one's life for beliefs such as the JW blood doctrine.

    As for freedom, well to use a JW-style analogy... would you rather be inprisioned in a jail with regular meals, a bed and a roof over your head; or, would you prefer to be free from such restrictions but homeless and living hand-to-mouth? Despite the hardships, most of us would choose the latter. Personal freedom is priceless.

  • NewChapter

    Thanks Mummatron. That post could be incredibly helpful to any lurkers. I'm so glad you left and can be happy now.


  • flipper

    MANKELLI- You ask " What is the big deal about getting that freedom ? " Well for one thing you have control of your own mind which you don't inside the JW cult. So you have the option to pursue MANY positive things in life like : getting a higher education, having more people to choose from of the opposite sex for potential marriage partners, you can hanglide without being hauled in for a judicial committee , or have oral sex without elders wanting to know or sneak a peek inside your curtain , watch R rated movies with a good conscience, sleep in on Saturday & Sunday mornings and improve your physical health and not feel guilty about it, you can take a blood transfusion if your life depends on it or your childrens lives depend on it. You can actually raise children in a safe home environment without worrying if Brother Perverted is going to molest them because the elders want to keep his dark secrets " confidential " . You can grow a vegetable garden and on Saturday mornings be found working in it. You gain loving, unconditional friends who will accept you NOT on how many hours in service you get or how many times you comment at meetings - but actually like you for being a nice person.

    Perhaps you would be well served to read Steve Hassan's two books on cult mind control. It will truly show you how dangerous it is to BE in a cult like Jehovah's Witnesses and you will prove to yourself that YES it IS a WISE decision to leave the Witnesses ! Peace out, Mr. Flipper

  • thetrueone

    It appears Mankkeli is well versed in superlative fear mongering and avoidance of truthful based facts.

    In his this opening thread he stated that people who leave this cult come unto dire consequences such as suicide and other digressive social

    behaviors. How about stating the demeaning and destructive social behaviors apparent by devout members of this particular cult.

    Perhaps he should have been intellectually honest and stated how this encouraging corruptive cult has caused people to commit suicide,

    due its strongly enforced self created shunning laws. Of course its wise to leave any socially and personally destructive maligning cult.

    Humanity has improved the human experience greatly by separating away from religious dogma which mostly contained ignorance,

    fear and superstitions.

    Seems Mankkeli found himself the power of god and now he doesn't want to let it go, no matter how diversely corrupt and destructive it

    is to himself or others, but then again doesn't that stereo typify the Watchtower Corporation in its entirety.

    Every religion espouses that they are god's divinely chosen organization and that if people come under their subjective control and guidance,

    happiness and contentment is there to be had. The WTS has just cranked this up one notch and said if you don't join are organization,

    you are most likely to experience a horrible death by god himself very soon .

    This self marketing worked well to manipulate and exploit people to meet their means, ominously corrupt as that may unfortunately be.

    Once this is realized by people who've been lured into this cult, they're most likely quite happy in leaving it and be done with it.

    The WTS was and always will be be a decisive marketing fraud designed and created by a religious publishing house.

    It was created by opportunistic men endeavored to cultivate circulation of its own published works as well as to cultvate a sense of self imposed power

    by taking on the identity of an organization solely chosen and sponsored by god, which again is a marketing ploy in itself.

    Consider this food at the proper time Mankkeli

  • mrquik

    And so all you lurkers; you can appreciate the value of this site. We hope these discussions open your eyes a little further. As to how you personally react; that's up to you. Good luck.

  • mrquik

    On a separate note; Hi Mummy, how's the weather in Wales?

  • ShadesofGrey

    I wouldnt want anyone to walk down that hideous path because of an aggresive need for ”freedom”. I repeat again, of what value is that freedom if it comes along with loneliness, depression, sleepness night and many horrible circumstances?. Please tell me what is the big deal about that freedom?. You may think there is light at the end of the tunnel, but you may not even survive the journey to see that light.

    Well quite a few of us were fighting severe depression as a result of or exaserbated by that religion. The JW organization emphasizes fear and shame. We had no friends until we started allowing ourselves outside association, and then the active JWs attacked us for that.

    Two active JWs that I was close to committed suicide, one of them a young pioneer, the other active in the congregation, and my active JW mother threatens suicide and complains of depression often.

    Many, many JWs fight depression and many, many exJWs report that it is gone.

    Whatever view any individual may claim to present, the reality is that leaving the organization is not a suggestion that should be offered to anyone who has become dissapointed or disillusioned one way or the other.

    I am pretty good with telling anyone to get out of a destructive cult.

    Consider your steps carefully before taking it.
    Yes, most definitely, especially open steps.

    I really don't care what Ray Franz did. Jesus rescued me from the cult before I read one page of apostate material. And besides that, I think I know better than to follow any man ever again.

  • mummatron

    MrQuick, it's awfully wet here in Wales and the south west of England. Due to the bad weather there has been a nasty, fatal 27 vehicle collision in Somerset. Tragic.

  • mankkeli

    thetrueone - I get your point, but dont lets deceive people with the intention that happy times are ahead once you are out of the borg. From a selfish point of view it appears that the control tactics the borg uses comes along with too many restrictions, but in the long run, it is just the most appropriate measure needed to coordinate decent living and inject sanity into an ever degrading human lifestyle.

    You need to remember that in this world, we are not really "free" , even the so-called "freedom of speech" has its own borderline. We are all captive of one thing or the other at every point in time in our lifetime.

    My message can be consummated with a proverb that goes this way "The devil we know is better than the God we don't know". That being said, Instead of dragging people out of the borg with our version of twisted speeches and masterful misrepresentation of reality, rather, lets encourage them to make peace and get-by with the reality they are familiar with by enhancing their motivation to keep their senses while serving Jehovah with their fellow brothers.

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