Why Some Cannot "See" that the Bible is NOT the Word of God

by AGuest 98 Replies latest jw friends

  • Nickolas

    I agree wholeheartedly, Shelby, that the Bible is not the word of God, but thereafter we part company. On the basis of verifiable historical record and scientific observation and evidence, the Bible is a work of fiction generously laden with historical fact, timeless wisdom and beautiful prose that does an excellent job of bestowing upon it an air of legitimacy. There can be no argument that without the Bible having been carried forward through the ages there would be no Christianity today. I think you would agree the granite core of what you personally hold to be true comes directly from the Bible, embellished considerably by personal revelation - personal revelation, observed from your myriad posts, that you seem to maintain is available to virtually all 7 billion human inhabitants of this planet but the majority of whom are not tuned into the frequency required to "hear" it.

    I have to admit to being troubled by the Old Law / New Law dichotomy. I'm also troubled by your statement I see a people loved... GREATLY by God... when I see much more evidence to the contrary, but that's another conversation. Inherent in the Old Law / New Law dichotomy is a God who changes his mind. A capricious God is inconsistent with an omniscient God, but then again an omniscient God is inconsistent with an omnipotent God. If God is omniscient, he must already have known how he was going to intervene to change the Law. But that means he could not change his mind about his intervention, which means he is not omnipotent. If he is indeed capricious - has the facility to change his mind (or as sab asked above, unanswered, is a learning God) - then he is not omniscient.

    God seems to have some remarkably human characteristics. Could it be that man was not created in the image of God but the other way around?

  • NewChapter

    And why is it that those that ARE tuned in don't experience similiar revelation? On the contrary those personal revelations often contradict each other. If I understand these personal revelations to simply be an individual's interpretation of ideas, then that makes sense. But if I think these contradicting revelations come from the same perfect god, than we have a problem.

    Why is one person's personal revelation more valid than the next? On what do you base that decision? Is it simply what you feel is right?

    Let's say that your revelation says that all will be reconciled with god. Your neighbor's revelation says that sinners will burn forever. All this from the same omniscient god? No this smacks of human, not divine revelation. And this god seems very human indeed.


  • moshe

    The anonymous internet gives legitimacy to people you wouldn't even talk to on the street corner.

  • Nickolas

    Loved the OP, btw. It is very eloquent. Shelby at your best.

  • Awen

    An Iinteresting post as always AGuest (Shelby). What I am about to post has no bearing on you or what you believe nor is it intended to be a commentary/judgement on how you express yourself on these boards. I want to be clear on this. This is about me and similar experiences I have had.

    Back in 1994 I began to feel as though I was one of the anointed. I was still a JW at this time and under the age of 30. I spoke with various Elders and as you probably know being under 30 and one of the anointed was not acceptable. I did run into an Elder in the Chester, SC KH who proclaimed to be of the anointed and he was under 40 (which was also unusual). His advice to me was to ignore the nay sayers and just live with it. New information would come out eventually and people would be silent about it. So I did.

    Something I noticed about the "Holy Spirit". I call it HS because I really have no idea what else to call it. I could call it my "Higher Self" or my "Holy Guardian Angel" or my "Anam Cara (Gaelic for Soul Friend), or Awen (which is a Gaelic word meaning "Inspiration", which oddly enough is translated by Celtic Christians as "Holy Spirit".) But I digress.

    What I noticed was that when I left the JW's and picked up Druidry and studied various pagan paths, the HS still spoke to me. How could this be if I was no longer following Christianity? It gave me (and still does) information about people. places and things that I had never researched nor have/had known. I began work as a Spirit Medium and more insight came (proven true by those I did readings for). I did sometimes get wrong information though, but I chalk this up to listening to my own ideas versus that of this "inner voice". I have spoken to several psychics and what I described to them is exactly what they have experienced. Which makes no sense if you firgure it's YHWH's Holy Spirit, it would be a conflict of interest to say the least. I have been to various psychiatrists and psychologists and none of them have diagnosed me with being delusional, psychotic or any mental illness whatsoever. I could even demonstrate this ability to them personally and they had no explanation.

    It doesn't seem to matter what the topic is. this "inner voice" always has a commentary on it. Interestingly enough in Druidry there is the concept of the tapping into the unconscious mind which supposedly gives one access to all information, past, present and future (sounds looney I know). Some mistake this for precognition. The Druids even underwent training for this. I forget the exact technique but it had to do with the hypothalamus and when you received information it would "wiggle" which gave a certain feeling. I wish I could describe it. Perhaps a feeling of "rightness" but that is more linear than physical. I guess it's like intuition but on a far higher level. When I have "listened" to this inner voice things have always proven correct or turned out okay for me. Ignore it at my peril. Again, I really have no idea what it is, but some will say "you have a demon" or some such nonsense. I say nonsense because it has spoken on matters of scriptural insight or any other topic for that matter. There is no category that is taboo.

    This "inner voice" though has caused some consternation on my part as frequently I am unsure of which religious path to follow. With Christianity I do not feel as though my prayers are answered much unless I follow a very strict moral code and then it's a quid pro quo (this for that) sort of relationship with God. In Paganism I actually had daily contact with beings I will call "gods" and was never given information that hurt me (though I was sometimes ignored when I did something stupid). I actually felt more alive and in touch with the Divine when I was a Pagan than at any other time in my life. I still followed a strict moral code (for the record I have never been married and do not engage in premarital intercourse), yet my life seemed much more fuller.

    Why then am I still drawn to Christianity? I suppose it has to do with left over baggage from the JW's and an innate fear of being wrong and paying the price for it.

    There are plenty of things in the Bible that do not make sense. Some of them I listed in previous posts on this thread. It could be that I lack the wisdom to understand them. I wonder about the Books of the Bible that were included in the canon whereas others were left out. We must remember that it was the Nicean Council who made this decision. There are plenty of other "Apocryphal" books that are left out that still meet the criteria for inclusion into the canon. It seems to me that they were left out because they didn't fit the mold the Church already had in mind and were labled heretical. Funny enough though, if you ever get to read the "Gospel of St. Thomas" you will find that according to Jesus, the Kingdom of God is already here. Thomas preaches spiritual enlightenment, not salvation through works or faith.

    Anyway, that's what I wanted to say and I fear I may have strayed off topic somewhat.



    P.S. As far as the whole "anointed" thing with the JW's I personally feel all Christians have the heavenly calling, not just a select few as the WTBTS teaches. This is because Jesus never identified any secondary calling. He said that anyone who asked for the Holy Spirit would receive it. Peter also mentions a "new heaven and a new Earth which we are awaiting according to his promise and in those righteousness is to dwell." My personal take on this is that those who are not chosen to rule with Christ (though still having the HS are given this secondary reward for their faithfulness). Oddly enough my understanding of the "heavenly calling" is that the person is chosen at death, not when they are initially "anointed" with the HS, despite what the WTBTS teaches. To do it this way would cause a person to become arrogant towards thier brothers and sisters and become objects of idolatry (much like is currently being done by the Governing Body and the rank-file JW's).

  • Band on the Run
    Band on the Run

    No clue as to what is happening. Sounds like another cult. Of course, one person's cult is another's grand religion.

  • AGuest

    Greetings, dear Awen... and peace to you! I would like to comment briefly (yeah, really - LOLOL!) on your last post, first, if I may, then to your previous one.

    My gift and that of psychics is bascially the same: to hear spirits. The difference is who we receive it from and how we use it. Because all are supposed to go through CHRIST in order to enter into the spirit realm, no psychics or mediums were to be found in Israel. Otherwise, they are "entering" by some other means (and thus, breaking in). If I were to use my gift in the capacity of a psychic or medium... people would come to ME, would they not? Yet, who am I? Sure, I can hear and get some answers for them... but I can't save them. Also, why should they come to ME? And, of course, there is a charge, is there not? Why pay for what you can receive FREE? So, really, it's a deceit abuse of the gift... because EVERYONE has the same ability. Just not everyone knows, recognizes, or uses it. Or knows HOW to use it.

    The reason you are drawn to "christianity" is because it PRETENDS to know the One who you are really looking for... and often calls itself by HIS description: the Truth. The Light. Wisdom. Etc. Some folks (me, perhaps you) are drawn to those things. For some of us, it is what we spend our lives "searching" for. And religion says THEY have it. So, we are drawn there. But the truth is that HE... the Truth, the Light, Wisdom... is not in religion: he dwells in PEOPLE. Perhaps you. The voice that you hear is him... and once he dwells in you, you hear it even more/louder.

    Perhaps you "thought" you were anointed because you "heard" the "call." If so, ANSWER, dear one... even now, if you've a mind and heart to. It's not too late. Because you cannot be chosen if you don't answer! How do you ANSWER? Well, outright, of course "(Here I am!"... or "Who is this, please?" but ANSWER). You can also do so by ACCEPTING THE INVITATION. How do you "accept"? Since you may no longer know what that invitation is/was, I am directed to send you BACK... to the pedagogue: read John 6:48-58 and see if that gives you some "recall." Then, if you've a mind... and heart... to do so, obey. It is least thing... and you what being faithful in THOSE things, mean, right?

    Okay, now on to your other post:

    I will share something I've only thought about and never shared with anyone. It causes me no end of confusion on the topic of the Bible/Judaism/Christianity.

    Greetings, dear Awen, and peace to you! My sincere apologies for the delay in responding. Seeing that this is something very close to you, I didn’t want to respond cursorily but in the depth and detail that you deserve. I also needed to make sure that whatever I heard from my Lord was restated to you accurately and I wasn’t sure I could do that from my Palm, so I had to ask your patience, for which I thank you, now.

    I sometimes think that the Bible is nothing more than a history book and a collection of mythologies meant for the people of Israel only.

    This is partly correct: it does contain histories (in addition to “scripture”)… and the first part of it (the OT) was meant for Israel only. Note, this does NOT mean simply the Jews: they only make up 2/10ths of Israel – there are 10 other tribes, though the world… and especially modern Jews… would like us to forget that truth. Are there some mythologies, as well? Well, if you consider what isn’t truth to be myth, the answer would have to be, “Yes, of course.” However, they are not myths in the manner of, for example, Greek/Roman/Norse mythology, etc. They are more embellishments, exaggerations, downplays, and things like these. While there ARE many contrivances, a great deal is based on a true foundation, if that makes sense.

    Consider that the New Testament was written 2,000 years ago and to them the world was very small.

    Yes, but what many of us FORGET… is that the writings contained in the New Testament ALSO wasn’t written to the world, per se. Yes, it was written to people IN the world… and of every nation, tribe, tongue, and people… but only those FROM AMONG THOSE… WHO BELONG TO CHRIST. Problem is (1) there’s a whole lot of folks who BELIEVE they so belong… but do not, and (2) believe that it applies to ALL… because they confuse that word (“all”) with “anyone.” The INVITATION is open to “anyone”, yes… but not ALL are chosen to attend! The truth of THAT statement is in the words, “Many are CALLED, but few are CHOSEN.”

    Like Israel before it, “christianity” has an obsession with numbers. But although the Bible is [mis]used to support that obsession, MONEY is the true motivation behind it. Really. I know… a lot of folks believe in the “good” of their religion. And I don’t deny that there is some good. BUT… that “good” is more often a smoke screen to deflect… and divert attention from… the underlying wealth. I used to be amazed at the “blindness” of those who can’t see this. But my statement in this very thread explains WHY they can’t: because THEY CAN’T/DON’T see CHRIST! Where, I ask you… would Christ be in, say, the WTBTS’ educational center in Patterson? Where, in the Vatican? Where in the temples of the LDS… or the Crystal Cathedrals… or other holding of “christianity”? Christ? The One who had “nowhere to lay [his] head?” SERIOUSLY?

    The nation of Israel was the center of the world (in their eyes) and everything written in it is from their point of view.

    This is not entirely true. They knew of and recognized MANY nations. In addition, at the time the NT writers lived, they were under Roman rule… and Rome was a MUCH larger force. Prior to that, they were inundated with the Greeks. Before that, Medo-Persia. Before that, Babylon. Before that, Assyria. Before that… Egypt. No, Israel knew how SMALL they were… which is one reason why they had to “beef up” their god.

    This makes me think of the "Book of Going Forth by Day" (The Egyptian Book of the Dead) and how all the rituals and such are written from an Egyptian viewpoint. Never does it enter into the Egyptian mind that their viewpoint is somehow flawed. Their viewpoint and commentaries are the only ones that matter to them.

    Well, Egypt was pretty much the world power at that time, at least, for most of what we call the “Middle East”, Africa, and parts of “Europe.” But there were also forces to reckon with in the East/Orient… where Abraham came from. He was led from the East because of the direction “religion” had taken there. He was led to Canaan (where he could learn more about and worship JAH)… which land was under Egyptian control: although there were minor “kings”, they were all under Pharaoh (which is why Jacob and his sons WENT to Pharaoh when the famine took over the land). AT THAT TIME… Egypt didn’t really have a religion, per se. They didn’t have a belief in “higher” gods… but only one God higher than Pharaoh. Because as far as THEY believed, PHARAOH was god… on earth. They didn’t interfere with others’ beliefs in a “true” God, however, but had that belief, as well.

    It was Joseph, however, who brought a lot of what you believe originated in Egypt TO Egypt. Life beyond the physical world was one such thing. Indeed, the purpose of the pyramids was the Pharaohs’ attempts to fulfill the hope of ABRAHAM, et al… to be “under the altar” once the physical body died, awaiting resurrection. That’s why so much “stuff” was buried WITH the pharaoh’s: so that would have their “stuff” when they returned to life… HERE (and not somewhere else, as many scholars have misunderstood). The pyramids are not just huge tombs, but ALTARS… “high places”… under which the bodies of dead pharaoh’s were interred. As second in command in Pharaoh’s house… Pharaoh who believed in God… and thus, considered Joseph to be a “man of God”… Joseph took that “hope” TO Egypt.

    Such seems to be the case of the Bible. You can look at it from a strictly Israelite point of view and how everything relates to them, or you can read the scriptures and say "hey, Jesus was talking about everyone when he said "go therefore and make disciples of all the people of all the nations, etc." He was talking globally. But is this simply not an assumption on our part?

    There is some assumption, yes. He was speaking GEOGRAPHICALLY, not DEMOGRAPHICALLY. That’s because (1) Israel was/would be “scattered” throughout the earth, AND (2) the “great crowd” would come FROM every nation, tribe, tongue, and people. BUT… not from every PERSON of every nation, tribe, tongue, and people.

    I have done a lot of research into the personage of Jesus.

    Sorry, but such a statement makes the hairs on my neck hair stand on end – LOLOLOL! Your next statement is why:

    Some say he existed, some say not.

    And that can be a conundrum, can’t it?

    Some show similarities to the Roman God Mithra (virgin birth, 12 Apostles, rising from the dead) and say that the Chritian writers merely co-opted many already existing religions to further their own goals.

    I understand. Did you know that “Mithraism” was not really a Roman religion… but a secret society of astronomers? And did you know they came about AFTER Christ? I shared what I was given on that here somewhere. Keep in mind, that my Lord’s birth (of a virgin) and resurrection from the dead was prophesied even before the first records of the god “Mithra” came about (i.e., Persia). Those prophesies were used by the Roman Mithraics to cover what they were really doing: star-gazing. At the time this secret society was instituted, “christianity” had began to take hold and to THEM (so-called “christians”), astronomy’s cousin, astrology, was unacceptable. That’s because, like the Persians, who first coined the god “Mithra”… some took studying the heavenly bodies to another level and began to “divine” based on the position of the stars. Of course, the divination was false, but just as with today, folks were making a profit from it. They (“Christians”) considered this a form of deceit, and thus from the Devil, and thus, wicked and evil… and needing “righteous” abatement.

    Because of this, those who “looked” to the starts were often in danger: “christians” now had the BACKING of the Roman army (due to the conversion of the Roman emperor, Constantine). As such, they turned from being the hunted… to the hunters (which their “consciences” allowed, due in great part to the “apostasy” (turning away) that had begun after the death of the Apostles). In order to “hide” their passion for astronomy AND astrology from “christians”, therefore, some star-gazers formed the secret society of the Mithras (or the Mysteries of the Persians)… and used “christian” symbols as a cover. The “12 Apostles” are actually the 12 signs of the zodiac.

    There exists very little secular evidence for the person of Jesus, only the influence he had on others and second hand accounts.

    But truly, isn’t that it’s supposed to be? He wasn’t looking for prominence in this world, dear one. Indeed, he rejected it. But even so, a LOT of the evidence about him has been lost or destroyed. Even Luke wrote that MANY undertook to compile a statement of the facts. Where are those compilations? At the time Luke wrote his gospel, the only other account contained in the BIBLE that had been written was Matthew’s account. Where are those “many” Luke wrote about? Again, lost or destroyed. Or… (well, one does wonder, doesn’t one, what REALLY is under the Vatican… and in various monestaries? Is it possible if some of these were brought to light “christianity” as we know it would meet great demise, if not complete devastation?)…

    It's so very hard to put together the pieces of evidence and decide if he really existed at all.

    If you’re looking to books, perhaps…

    Outside of the Bible, there is almost no mention of Jesus at all. Yet that isn't true of other historical figures. Why is that?

    The word of my Lord is that (1) there really was (and is) a lot more written; but (2) it shouldn’t matter because those who follow him must do so by faith, not sight… and it’s his voice that leads them, not a book, anyway. So…

    Why does the Bible only exist in fragment form and not a complete set of books?

    Because you got what earthling man wanted you to get. Truly. Neither God nor Christ compiled the Bible, dear one. Yes, they commissioned the scriptures… but the Bible is not scripture. It contains scripture, yes, but even then not ALL scripture. For example, where is the Book of Enoch? Baruch? Jasher? Why do some Bibles (i.e., Douay) contain other books, such as Judit, Tobit, etc.? Why isn’t the Book of Jubilees included? What of the Didache, I mean, since it was supposedly written by the Apostles (neither Paul, James, or Jude were of the 12, yet THEIR letters are in there). How about Thomas’ gospel? Barnabas’? What about that little piece that some identify as Mary (the Magadalene’s) gospel? Who decided what went in… and what didn’t? For example, why Paul’s 2 nd and 3 rd letters, but not his first?

    What you have, though, is what you GET… when you put your trust… in EARTHING MAN and nobles! PART truths… and PARTS of writings… and fragments… and speculation… and… and… AND… some of those fragments/writings already “false” due to the false pen of the scribes… AND some things not even in order (who decided what chapters follow which, what verses follow which, how things are numbered… heck, even who WROTE some things, because “John” was not written by any John… the Apostle, the Elder, John Mark, or whoever – it was written by Lazarus… and Nebuchadnezzer wrote/dictated some of Daniel, although the entire book is attributed to Daniel, etc.)…

    I would think that if YHWH wanted us to know it all, it would be available to us, but it's not. We have copies of copies who's literary value is called into questioned by the discovery of scribal errors. Consider the Gospels were written 40 years after the death of Jesus. Who can recall events that far back with any degreee of accuracy?

    NO ONE! But, like many, you assume that (1) the writers were “inspired,” which they weren’t (except John, during the “revelation”), and (2) that JaHVeH wanted “us” to know… through a BOOK. He didn’t and doesn’t – He wants us to KNOW… by LISTENING TO HIS SON.

    Some might say his influence on the world shows that he existed.

    Ummmm… okay… but has that been a GOOD influence, overall?

    Yet that can be chalked up to how his followers spread the Gospels, usually by politics and the point of the sword (both of which Jesus opposed) and this is still being done.

    See what I mean?

    I've looked into the Deluge of Noah's Day and I get conflicting accounts. Not only from Theologians, but from Geologists, Botanists, etc. They all seem to have a different opinion and different "evidence."

    Yes. So why go to them? Why not go to someone who was THERE… and/or at least had some part in and knowledge OF it?

    I would think that if any of it were true, there would be concrete irrefutable evidence. But there isn't.

    I don’t know if you can say that, can you? Wouldn’t it be more accurate to say, “But we haven’t come across it, yet,” or “So far, no one’s presented anything concrete or convincing to ME”? You see, we really do believe ourselves to be SO “enlightened” today that “there’s really nothing more to learn.” Everyone believes that, though, don’t they, during their day.

    It seems that it all comes down to faith and faith alone. That is a problem for me as my exit from the WTS destroyed any faith I had and now I'm left with only questions.

    First, I understand the destruction of your faith. What YOU might not understand is that THAT… is EXACTLY the PURPOSE of the WTBTS! NO OTHER religion could have done that for/to you. Truly. Every other one would may have left you wondering, but it is the JOB of the WTBTS to move you PAST wondering… to NO faith, at all. And they do their job WELL. But, yes, it does come down to faith; however, FAITH, dear one… is NOT just the assured expectation of the thing hoped for, but the EVIDENT DEMONSTRATION of reality… though not beheld (with one’s empirical senses; however, there really are more than just the five physical senses. Really. Ask any woman – LOLOLOL!). What does this mean? It means that you ARE given SOME EVIDENCE… some DEMONSTRATION… of the SPIRITUAL REALITY. True, your physical eyes, ears, etc., may not behold it… but by SOME means… you KNOW it… because SOME evidence is provided. Problem is: folks keep looking for that evidence with the man they are on the OUTSIDE, not the man they are… on the INSIDE.

    I can debate a Bible topic easily enough and put forth a hypothesis based upon my own understanding of the text. But when it comes down to whether what's in the Bible is true or not then I'm left with doubt and questions.

    Who isn’t? That’s why I don’t look to Bible to corroborate what my Lord tells me (as some state I should); rather, he has said to ME… and taught ME… that it is HE who corroborates… or disspells… what is written in the Bible. Because HE is the Truth. NOT the WTBTS… and NOT the Bible. And so he said to me, and I have learned this to be TRUE:

    “Everything I will tell you IS written, but not everything that is written is what I will tell you.”

    He said this to me in answer to MY conundrums about what I was hearing from him, reading in the bible… and what others say/said “the Bible” contains, means, it, etc. What did he mean? He meant that everything he would tell is written… SOMEWHERE… but NOT NECESSARILY IN THE BIBLE… and that not everything that is written… INCLUDING IN THE BIBLE… is what he would tell me. And HE… ONLY… tells me the TRUTH. And so, I gotta go with what HE says… not what the BIBLE says.

    And what is the BASIS for my faith so as to be able to do this? What is the “EVIDENT DEMONSTRATION”? One thing. One consistent thing: he has NEVER lied to me. Ever. Not once. Ever.

    Doubt for me doesn't mean something is wrong, it simply means I haven't found the answer.

    That’s what it means for you, yes. It means something else to God and Christ, though: it means you lack faith. Wait, let me explain: you lack faith because you don’t KNOW the One in whom your faith should be put. And that absolutely makes sense. When James wrote about faith, however, he was speaking to those who either walked with Christ… or had received holy spirit. In both cases, there is no excuse for a lack of faith, truly. Yet, Thomas lacked faith, no? Which means… IT’S NATURAL. It is a function of our flesh. But those who belong to Christ TRANSCEND the flesh. They are NOT the sum total of their physical bodies, organs, and other parts. That is only PART of who and what they are… and a very small part, actually.

    I find myself arguing many times in favor of Jesus and many times against religion.

    Well, the One you currently know as [Jesus], YES!!!

    I don't really have any beliefs, just a lot of ideas.

    Nothing wrong with that…

    I don't know if Jesus is the Son of YHWH, or YHWH himself or a flying spaghetti monster in human form. I just don't know.

    I totally understand. But I also KNOW… that you CAN know. All you need to do is ASK… and then PUT FAITH IN WHAT YOU HEAR… including WHO YOU HEAR IT FROM. It you aren’t SURE who’s speaking… ASK. There really is something to that “KEEP asking”… directive – LOLOLOL!

    I do believe (the one belief I do have) there is a God.

    Well, that’s actually a very good place to start, dear one, truly!

    What form or how He/She interacts with us and how we are to interact in return is what baffles me.

    Then look to the One who can REVEAL all of that TO YOU: the Holy One of Israel, JAHESHUA, the Chosen One of JAH (MischaJah)… the [Holy] Spirit, who, along with his Bride KEEP saying:

    “Come! Take ‘life’s water’… FREE!”

    May you be given ears you hear… if you so wish them… when they call to you. For as it is written:

    “Sacrifice and offering You did not desire, but my ears YOU have pierced*…” Psalm 40:6

    *(Depending on the Bible version, it states that JAH opens ears… or prepares our bodies. Either way, we can hear… Him, His Son… and whatever else He wishes… as a result. But our ears aren’t COMPLETELY stopped – we can already hear on some level. Faint, true. So, it is with His help that we hear even more. Fully. So… ASK for EARS to HEAR … if you ask for nothing else. Then… LISTEN.)


    Again, peace to you, as well!

    YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,


  • AGuest

    Greetings, dear Moshe… peace to and thank you for kind patience!

    Orthodox Jews go to a Synagogue, Reform and most Conservative Jews go to a Temple. The former are waiting for the Temple in Jerusalem to open back up for business- the latter know better and their local meeting place is their "temple".

    Yes, okay.

    Rabbi's are not priests.

    Yes, I'm aware of this. Hence, my question. I mean, I understand that there are Reformed/Conservative Jews, but doesn’t their religion have its roots in the priesthood/temple worship? So, okay, they’re tired of waiting… and apparently have taken the proverbial bull by its horns, yes? But how do they get around the Aaronic priesthood?

    I used to be a Christian, then a JW, then a back to regular Christian churches and then I converted to Judaism.


    I can't begin to explain where your ideas have gone off track, but it all starts with a false idea of what happened in Eden.

    Please, do try and start. I mean, if I’m offtrack shouldn’t your “love” for me compel you to at least try? Also, are you sure I have the same “false idea” of what happened in Eden? To be honest, my Lord hasn’t told me what “Christianity” teaches, but something different and much more indepth. I do recall some Jews believing Eve to be Adham’s second wife, after Lilith. But my Lord hasn’t shared such an account with me. Now, you must keep in mind, that the Jews’ track record for honesty has some of the same problems as does “christianity”… yes?

    The Torah is the Jew's book and the New Testament is your book.

    Moshe, Moshe, Moshe… dear Moshe. And here I thought that all this time you’ve been actually paying attention. My bad. I have no book dear one.

    That being said, the Jews don't presume to tell Christians what their books mean

    You're kidding, right? Have you not seen the number of books on the NT written by Jewish scholars and such? I mean, seriously?

    but some smarmy Christians have the audacity to tell the Jews what their Torah teaches.

    I’ve actually learned to listen to neither: smarmy "christians"... or Jews. Rather, I listen to the Son of the One who is supposedly the God of BOTH: "christians" and Jews...

    The Ten tribes were dispersed long ago

    Thankfully, the Most Holy One of Israel knows where Abraham's blood is, though...

    and maybe you have some of their dna in you, as I have discovered I have the same Y dna as some modern day Samaritan Jews in Israel.

    Actually, no, my DNA is 2-tribe (Judah), through Benjamin. I do know some, however, from Levi, Issachar, and Zebulun. Even so, that I am Judah does not preclude my concern for my brothers of the other tribes, does it? Should it?

    I have been following your posts for a long time and if anyone ever wished they could wear a priest's robe, with all it's attendant authority, it is you.

    A priest?! ME!?? Lordy, chile, yo u have seriously got to be kidding! First, Israel is entirely too hard-headed, hard-hearted, and stiff-necked for ME. Oh no, I would lose my life in a matter of seconds. Moses being provoked to strike the rock would be NOTHING compared to how I would “lose” it! I’d would be, like, “LOOK, idjits! He just got your butts outta hard labor in Egypt! Quit yer whinin’, load up yer dang camels, grab yer crumb-snatchin' rugrats... and git yer butts across that sea! NOW!”

    No, seriously... the TRUTH is that I’m really nothing but a servant, dear one. Even YOUR servant. And nothing more. There is NO way I can offer up sacrifices for anyone; heck, I can’t even offer up anything for my own self… other than the “fruit” of my lips. And even that is lacking and insufficient. I just don’t like lies, dear one… about God and Christ… regardless of who they come from. Regardless of their station… or recognition in the world. Because so many have lost SO much because of such lies. Jews AND Gentiles.

    And since the tendency of earthling man is to LIE… whether Jew OR Gentile… I choose to go to a Source that doesn’t: the Truth. That’s really it and all.

    Really. Again, peace to you!

    YOUR servant… because I am a servant to ALL those of the Household of God, Israel… whether they recognize Christ or not, but as a “least” one… and Abraham’s seed… and of those who go WITH Israel… and a slave of Christ,


  • EntirelyPossible

    I did run into an Elder in the Chester, SC KH who proclaimed to be of the anointed and he was under 40 (which was also unusual).

    Chester? Really? I lived there as a kid. Maybe we know each other...

    I love this thread so much..

  • AGuest

    Dearest Nick, and by connection, dear NC... peace to you, both! I think we're going to have to agree that we don't "see" things the same way. I can't see where we parted ways, dear Nick, as to the Bible: I don't put or have MY faith in it. It contains SOME scripture, yes, but even that's been tampered with. As for my hearing... and "revelations"... I truly cannot explain them much further than I have all these years. It just is what it is. I get that you cannot grasp this. I can only tell you the truth, how it is with ME, how it can also be with YOU... but that's it, isn't it? I mean, I can TELL you... but if you don't believe me, so as to put it to the test... then... well, what? Here we are.

    You don't HAVE to believe me, though, OR test it: I do NOT judge you. I realize that some hear my message and "take it" as being judged. But the truth is that that is on them. Unless I am responding to comments/questions directed at/TO me, the majority of the time my words are to the "Household of God, Israel, and those who go with." Who get it. Now, all kinds of folks post all kinds of things on this forum. I confess, I don't take it personal or get offended when some here post to the effect that those who don't believe as they do are... in some way... inferior. Either spiritually, psychologically, intellectually, what have you. I know who... and what I am.

    Those who take offense, regardless of "where" they perceive the contention to be coming from... or "whom"... do so because THEY'RE not REALLY sure of themselves. They don't like the "questions" that come up inside THEM... or the feeling of uncertainty or uneasiness. I really don't have that anymore. I cannot deny what has and is occurring with me anymore than I can deny being female, black, short, having brown eyes, being the mother of my children, etc. These are things that no matter how hard I might TRY to hide... the truth is still the truth. And I have shared the truth with you all here.

    More important... I have shared the truth as to my SOURCE. I get it that some would rather me recant. I can only say that doing so would be lying to you. And no one here has even come close to giving me a valid reason to do THAT. Not even close... by any stretch. Honestly, I don't think there is any valid reasons.

    I hope this helps and, again, peace to you both!

    YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,


Share this