by Chariklo 132 Replies latest jw experiences
Podobear, what is your version of truth?
It can be demonstrated from Scripture that Jesus is Jehovah, not Michael Archangel, that the Holy Spirit is personal, not active force, that heaven is not limited to 144,000, that salvation is based on grace/faith, not works, etc. Anyone who can read can fairly represent JW beliefs. The problem is that they are ever changing and most JWs are ignorant of their history, changing views, etc.
As are the views of many faiths... especially the so called "Born Again" versions... I have seen some vicious comments here about JW's which are patently untrue.
I don't have a version of Truth Godrulz... just the suggestions I have already proferred.
Stop stirring up contentions and promoting sects Godrulz... remember that in the First Century, Christianity itself was viewed as a Sect and Apostate Judaism! That is why the French refer to La CULTE Catholique.
Yes, Christianity is Cult too..
All the best
godrulz, what is it that you possess exactly that allows you to have the accurate understanding of the Bible? And why are some still absolutely certain of their religious perspective even after you lambaste them with the Good Book and share the REAL TRUTH?
There are brilliant people out there, theologians and others who have a better education, more experience, and a higher IQ... than you.... yet they sincerely believe in doctrines that conflict with your own. What do they lack, yet you possess, so that you have a better understanding of what god meant to say?
What causes them to continue to believe something that is false, even though you plainly show them from the Holy Scriptures that their interpretation is full of error?
I've posed the same question three different ways so now I'll hand it over to you.
SweetBabyCh, that's a really good question. In fact, it's the fundamental question that we all need to ask ourselves whatever our religion. And to extend it, isn't it true that devout members of every religion under the sun think that theirs is right? If I've understood it correctly, this is the very question that the WTS address at the start of the Bible Teach book, though of course at a very simplistic level and presented in a heavily slanted way, designed to produce agreement.
Well, it's Thursday evening and I didn't go to the meeting with the Ministry School. In fact, this is going to sound silly, it was quite difficult to give myself permission to stay away. Standing outside myself and observing what's going on, I'd say I've definitely been in the early stages of being brainwashed. I've heard many lovely, apparently intelligent witnesses say with a chuckle, "they think we're brainwashed!"
Yes, I think they are brainwashed and it nearly happened to me. Some JW arguments and ways of thinking and reacting have gone in quite deep. I was telling one of my daughters a bit about it and she said" how could you let yourself be taken in by that, it's insane!", And yes, I know it is, and yet a large part of me wanted to come back at her and explain just how it works and why it was right after all, because after all it's in the Bible. I've read my Reasoning book.
JW's aren't allowed to smoke but I've come to the conclusion that becoming a Jehovah's Witness (and I've got alarmingly close) is a lot like smoking. It goes deep into the blood. Like nicotine. It makes you feel good and at peace. And when you stop doing it, although bits of it leave you fairly fast, you find that a great big section of it has soaked in right down deep and is lurking there in unsuuspected places, ready to resurface with an automatic warning or justification of whatever, just like a nicotine addiction that doesn't ever really go away.
It's been an eventful day with several JW conversations, all polite. But I kept repeating George of England's words to myself, quietly, inside. "Run Like Hell!"
Thanks, everyone! Watch this space.
Cults can meet perceived needs, but they are a shallow counterfeit to transformation in Christ. JWs are indoctrinated and controlled, but often fail to realize it until they are out.
The Bible is meant to be understood. Most Christians are in agreement on the essentials of the faith, so peripheral issues will be debated, even as they were in the early church by Paul and his well meaning detractors. The body of truth passed on from the beginning has stood the test of time with heretical attacks (like Arianism followed by JWs) being condemned are marginalized.
Chariklo - I like your analogy with smoking. I've found for myself that religious stuff can be an addictive habit. Even if I let go of it because I know my attention should be directed more productively, I find it has gotten deep inside me so that my mind keeps reverting back to it - like you said with an automatic justification for doing so. Lately, I've been testing what it might feel like to just skip the god stuff. Yesterday, I tried just looking up at the clouds and not presupposing some sort of god. It felt good.
Perhaps that is why the cult of Athanasius had Arius murdered, godrulz?
I too like the analogy with smoking, Chariklo. I also like the quote, "Religion is the Opium of the People" by Karl Marx.
Don't be fooled by any religion, especially the so called "Evangelical" alliances who are just as divided and indoctrinated as the JW's they like to target.
Examine everything carefully.. but make your own way clear and strong. All the best.
Hi Chariklo
It's a sad reality that JW's clergy treats pedo's and abuse a lot like your former Church has. They are guided by the directives of the Watchtower Corps. Legal Dept. Check out this recent thread in which the elders hide behind the robe.
The elders refusal to testify was directed by Watchtower Legal, I can assure you. In all congregational legal matters, WL must be involved. The involvement will be denied if the elders are questionned about it. And yes, it is OK for the elders to lie to "Satan" about WL's involvement.
So if you're looking for a better church in this area. JW's aren't any better that the Catholic Church. The Church, at least, appears to be on a learning curve.
JW have, over the years, managed to keep their members in tight control, away from "worldly" and "non-believing family" influences. No holidays are to be celebrated (now frankly, what's wrong with Mother's Day. Is your mother really going to begin believing she is superior to God and think you should begin worshipping her L.O.L). Young kids can't join sports teams (reason given: competition...BAD!!! although it's OK for dad to watch competition sports on T.V. ...strange paradox!) Time 'in service' must be reported ( does it make sense to keep account of time you spend serving God?) University is a real no-no (but if someone is U-educated JW's are extremely happy to welcome them in and use their talents). And disfellowshipping...the ultimate controlling tool (when you can control people to the point of disowning their own kids for not believing in and following a faith, something is definitely very wrong).
The Watchtower's goal is isolation from all influences subject to free Rapunzal.
Without even getting into false dates, failed prophecies or the fact that they have been telling everyone for over 100 years they were not going to die, but cruise into everlasting life.....just think about the above and break into a run.
And those nice people you met.... Although they've done their very best to be extremely nice to you, keep in mind they've seen many people just like you get interested and not join them. They've come to understand and accept that Satan is strong and many (like you) just don't have the right heart condition. It's sad that you're missing out on being in paradise with them but you would be shocked to see how quickly they will get over your loss.
Welcome. Be glad you weren't assimilated!
Wheels
Welcome Chariklo,
I loved your smoking analogy. You summed up exactly how I felt as I left the witnesses.
Thanks, Listener!
I wasn't even properly in, though I suspect I was much deeper in than I thought. I also think I've been in a lull before the storm the last couple of days as some key people are away. Watch this space, I'll report back....
But I'm astonished at things being said to me. People "reminding" me that I need to be a JW to "save" my life. An old lady rang me this evening to tell me how worried she was that I'm changing my mind. She is a really nice and intelligent person, but lovely as she is there is no way I'm going to agree on some of the JW teachings everyone seems to take as given.
But then my family, when they can get a word in between their constant versions of "I told you so, ha ha" as they split their sides laughing, can't help reminding me of the things I've been saying and doing over the last few months.
Yep. I was brainwashed.
