My Apologies to Christians.

by AK - Jeff 119 Replies latest jw experiences

  • believingxjw
    believingxjw

    OTWO,

    "but I saw how upset you were"

    LOL. Nice try. I'm not upset, that's a ploy.

    Jeff,

    In my state there are many community churches who work non-judgmental outreach programs for many people including women who have had abortions or the poor or those out of work. Some of these could be called Progressive congregations others just trying to include those who need help rather than turning away the very ones Jesus would have ministered to. Below are 3 links to two mainstream churches that are evolving, lol. (pun intended) And it must not be forgotten that many nuns in the Roman Catholic church disagree with their church and quietly go about doing what they believe is good regardless. That's true of many other Christians as well.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Douglas_Glasspool

    "She is the first open lesbian to be consecrated a bishop in the Anglican Communion."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schori

    "she is the first woman elected as a primate of the Anglican Communion in the United States"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene_Robinson

    Episcopal Church "Robinson is widely known for being the first openly-gay, non-celibate priest to be ordained a bishop in a major Christian denomination believing in the historic episcopate."

  • tec
    tec

    I wonder though - what if the object of your affection was not Jesus, but Buddha, or Mohamed? Much of the same sticky-feely-love can be found in other cultures, cultures either unfamiliar with or un-engaged to the Christian Christ. If you had been born in Saudi Arabia, it is almost guaranteed that if you sought such feelings to the finish line, it would be toward another 'Christ' not Jesus - yet you would demand just as strongly that your God was proven to be superior to all others - that perhaps you were 'drawn to him' in the same way you believe you are to Jesus.

    Its possible, yes - but I don't spend much time wondering about it, since I could be one of those people who hear about Christ, and leave my current faith for Him. But I believe I already said that I feel more kinship with those who are displaying the 'fruits of the spirit' - whether they be buddhist, islamist, jewish, christian, atheist, hindu - than with those who claim to be my brothers and sisters and yet show none of those fruits. And I would not knock someone for their faith, when they show love and kindness and humility and forgiveness toward all, regardless of whether it is my faith or not. Their faith is between them and God. Not them and me.

    Of the atheists I know, all of them possess equal moral character to Christians.

    Until I joined this forum, every atheist I have known has been arrogant and condescending and derisive and mocking toward any faith system. I can find that on this board as well. But it was LeavingWT who was the first atheist/agnostic who showed me that this was not true of all of them. Others quickly followed suit. I mention this only so you understand that while you might be surrounded by judgmental 'Christians' (this is your experience for the most part), there are people who are surrounded by judgmental 'atheists'. (this was my experience for the most part)

    So while some of the virtues mentioned by Jesus are commendable, I believe mine to be equal or superior,

    These are the virtues mentioned by Jesus:

    Love your neighbor. Do no harm to others... more than that, take the initiative and do good to others. Give to anyone who asks of you. Care for the sick, the needy, the widows and orphans. Feed the hungry and clothe the poor. Forgive all who wrong you and repent of it. Judge no one; condemn no one. Love your enemies and bless (not curse) those who persecute you. Don't be a hypocrite, but practice what you preach. Be honest. Do not set yourself above anyone, but serve others in love and humility and kindness.

    Above all, show mercy and love to all people - for there is no law against love.

    If your virtues are equal or superior to these, Jeff, then all love and respect to you. You are more moral than most men and women - including me, for even though I strive for these, I don't always live up to them.

    Peace to you,

    Tammy

  • lovelylil2
    lovelylil2

    Jeff,

    Out of curiosity, which of your morals would you say are superior to that of Jesus Christ and why?

  • believingxjw
    believingxjw

    Excellent post, Tammy!

  • tec
    tec

    @ Believingxjw... and thank you for sharing your examples of non-judgmental Christian groups. I also didn't know this: And it must not be forgotten that many nuns in the Roman Catholic church disagree with their church and quietly go about doing what they believe is good regardless. It makes me smile :)

    Tammy

  • Gregor
    Gregor

    Isn't it great how christians assume that all traits of human kindness were introduced into the human race just 2000 years ago by Jesus Christ? Talk about hijacking a thread! How about hijacking the entire concept of human kindness, putting your label on it and trying to sell it as an original concept.

    And TEC, your experiences with atheists vs christians is just too pat for words.

    Why does it take the average believer (see several examples above) a half a page of christian apologist blather to try and make their tooth fairy belief seem almost...logical? It is based on human sacrifice because the creator of the universe needed perfect shed blood to forgive the children of Adam and Eve. A virgin birth and resurrection from the dead to a "spirit" life. Jesus gave his life for our sins? No he didn't. Even the Bible says he was in the grave for barely 3 days! It is all sold by promises of what is supposed to happen after you are dead! ?How perfectly convenient.

    Sorry, not trying to jerk the pacifier out of anybody's mouth who needs it, but for crying out loud people...

  • tec
    tec

    And TEC, your experiences with atheists vs christians is just too pat for words.

    Gregor, I don't know what you mean by this? I also didn't apologize for my faith. I simply explained it as best as I know it. Please note that Jeff's responses to me were just as long as mine to him :)

    Tammy

  • lovelylil2
    lovelylil2

    I didn't read anywhere where Tammy or anyone else said human kindness was introduced only 2,000 years ago by jesus Christ. Just the opposite, many have shown there is kindness in Christianity as well as Atheism. But that BOTH these groups could at times be condenscending towards the other group and jugemental. However on this particular thread it was an atheist who started mud slinging first by attempting to tear down all christians for their beliefs. I think the Christians have been very kind and fair in their responses. Lilly

  • Gregor
    Gregor

    Well, isn't that swell that the christians have been "kind and fair" from their lofty vantage point over the great crowd of unwashed non believers.

    Thanks.

  • tec
    tec

    Well, isn't that swell that the christians have been "kind and fair" from their lofty vantage point over the great crowd of unwashed non believers.

    Thanks.

    No one on this thread has said or even implied this, except for you. On the contrary, in fact.

    Tammy

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