Thinking of becoming a Witness again and my reasons for doing so :( (page 20)

reniaa

hi crusoe

Renniaa,
As far as religion goes I have to conced you and I are on different wavelengths!

I'm struggling with this thread because I'm getting christian, atheist, anti-witness viewpoints all coming at me at once /Ducks , I'mma run back to the atheist forums they are simpler just "All religion is insanity and delusion" but I won't, it's proving enjoyable to talk to people that do accept we can believe in God without becoming insane :)

Maybe I am an apostate to your subconscious?
Good luck on your journey!
If you ever desire a chat feel free - I sense something about you genuinely searching but I half sense the stacks of WT circles and spirals of reasoning/emotions/guilt/judgement I finally unwound and got back to zero from!
Lots of love to your family and I wish you a fun time ahead compared to the one many religions offer! Just chilling and maybe finding regular people with an interest in Biblical/religious introspection isn't easy but its what I think you feel is missing from life and why sites like this are unique - unless you live near some of us it hard to have it in reality!
Best ~~wishes~~ erm, of health (not sure if you're over that bit yet)

Hehe your right in many ways but the occasional Good luck pops out occasionally, on a side point it's easier to go back to swearing/bad language than saying 'Good luck' etc

I am genuinely searching though! but I'm not ready to give up on the bible yet, I just find the confounding christian religions coming from it pains in the asses for not actually practising what it says and thats inc the witnesses :) lol

sir82

Every religion has a weak point biblically! with witnesses for me it's the Blood issue ( icertainly think jesus talk of saving lifes on the sabbath does make a good argument against it)

If the JWs are wrong on blood, and their doctrine causes hundreds, if not thousands, to die needlessly, does that not make them bloodguilty?

If they are wrong on blood, and this has been pointed out to them numerous times, and yet they refuse to change (out of pride, or fear of litigation, or whatever reason), does this not make them purposefully bloodguilty, i.e., murderers?

What does Revelation say about murderers and the lake of fire?

It is of course your call, but I'd call the blood issue a bit more than a mere "weak point"!

reniaa

hey jgnat :) I learned how to paste and copy YAY on your forum :)

firstly I'd ask her if in both greek and hebrew is there a word for cross other than stauros and xylon that could have been used as an alternative, a definate word that only means Cross?
The genius of Leolaia's research is that she definitively shows that stauros was used for all sorts and shapes of crucifixion devices. The most prevalent use is for the crosspiece. So it is likely as Jesus was dragging the stauros through the marketplace, he was carrying the crosspiece.

That doesn't change the fact why was the word cross used when he was on "the cross" it might be a good arguement for when it was being dragged through the street.

In a modern illustration, when we use the word "cab" today we typically refer to a taxi. Even though the root word brings to mind a horse drawn coach or carriage. I can imagine an interstellar scholar thousands of years hence, studying the ancient language of English, might erroneously conclude that all New Yorkers in twentieth century America got around in horse and carriage. He could even produce evidence from ancient pictures of Central Park. But he'd be wrong.

a good illustration if a bit modern (by the way in england we still use word Taxi lol) basically they are using root word as apposed to a definate cross word that was in existance at that time, as a slang or possibly local viariant hmmm a little weak and more so if you take into account how christians use the cross as a way to describe God as 3=1 my mind is thinking of catholics doing the father, son, holy ghost to sign of the cross on there bodies with the hand signals, Do other christian faiths use the cross sign in that way too or is it just the catholics?

Surely in this case God would have made sure they used the actual Cross word as apposed to a possible derivitive (i'm still holding my opinion on this one till I see definate evidence that cross and stauros haven't become meaning both since jesus's death as a causal result of christian faiths saying it was a cross.)

reniaa

If the JWs are wrong on blood, and their doctrine causes hundreds, if not thousands, to die needlessly, does that not make them bloodguilty?

hi sir82 you make a valid point but if we make the argument that faiths and thats all religions, are blood-guilty if their doctrines lead to deaths, then none of them qualify and all are blood guilty, I know in this sense i'm sounding like a JW appologist but when i live in a time when you can have the same christian faith sending boths sides of a war with prayers for victory to the death of their enemies, it is confusing!

You are right though it is more than a weak point atm :) it's one of the things i'm stuck on atm.

reniaa

Another observation that I have. Being a single mother with 2 children, one with special needs, you sure have plenty of time to waste on the boards. I mean with all the research and energy you spend on them wouldn't it be more productive doing something else?
Your points are becoming a bit redundant.....again if that is what you want to believe DO IT!

You certainly given me some straight talking there and your right I do have plenty to do and about to do it! although being two weeks away from birth I do find a lot of time on my hands when advised to rest, which I find most convenient on my big comfy excutive computer chair reclining position, as I answer replies on here.

I don't want to get into a position of repeating myself though, I came on here for a few answers and you guys have given me lots to look into, so I will try only to answer now if some newer points etc come up, it's been a very fun discussion...lol my sister says she regrets putting me on the site now.

chikikie

My poor old sister...........

sir82

if we make the argument that faiths and thats all religions, are blood-guilty if their doctrines lead to deaths, then none of them qualify and all are blood guilty,

If all organizations are bloodguilty, then perhaps God does not view "membership to an organization"" as essential?

chikikie

I think we are going round in never ending circles now.

OnTheWayOut

Every religion has a weak point biblically! with witnesses for me it's the Blood issue
....But with christianity outside of witnesses their Weakest arguement is the Cross because it fails on 2 fronts, stauros/stake issue which we are currently discussing and the fact it is by bible definition and usage an idol

I tend to agree with that comment. I am pretty sure that it was a cross and not a
stake because we know that crosses were used by the Romans. Anyway, that's not
my comment.

The cross does seem to be an idol. It should not matter what Jesus was nailed to.
The difference here is that the "weak point biblically" with Witnesses will get children
(and adults) killed. They have Awake articles on children that died for this "weak point."
And if you disagree with this point privately, and it ever comes up, you either die or
get DF'ed and told that you will die at Armageddon. But if you disagree with most Churches
on their "weak point biblically" you don't even have to keep it private and there is no guilt
or fear laid upon you. In the few cases where you would keep it private so they don't know
that you disagree with the main doctrine, it never becomes a life-and-death issue.

This "weak point" is not just a minor thing to say, "Well, they ALL have a weak point."

ex-nj-jw

you no longer have a choice about sex with men I find, they tend to see it as a right to "Try before they buy" attitude to commitment, and if i'm then left holding the baby (literatually in my case) with only child support to try and get from him, is it really my fault? surely some blame can be placed at this "free and easy worlds" door?

I have two words for that BIRTH CONTROL!!! Or keep your legs closed! It's your choice that is unless you were raped then that's a whole other story!

After reading all 10 pages it seems to me that you want to go back and you are trying to convince us to convince you to go back. That's not needed! Put your big girl panties on and make a decision. Go back, why go round and round with us heathens here when what you really want is a religion to make everything in your life good? Stop blaming everything outside of the JW organization for your problems. The world as you so freely through around is the same place the JW's live, eat, sleep, work, raise children, etc. They are NO different than anyone else on this earth.

Sheesh! Run quickly to your nearest kingdom hall, through yourself at the elders feet, confess you sins, do you punishment and get on with your life!

nj

Thinking of becoming a Witness again and my reasons for doing so :(

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