I just got back from my circuit assembly !

by 5go 98 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  Mary

  The only thing of note no one is to talk to inactive ones exept to invite them to the hall. That includes and was stressed family as well.

  LOL! Did they give any scriptures to back this up? I doubt it, since the only scriptures they can use are the ones where Jesus condemned the Pharisees for doing the exact same thing. Idiots.
• 

  slimboyfat

  I don't believe it.
• 

  drew sagan

  Since this would effect me and my wife i'm really hoping that this way just one uptight guy at the ASSembly instead of a ruling from Brooklyn.
  
  Wonder if anybody else can verify this information?
• 

  Jourles

  Got a recording?
• 

  nvrgnbk

  EVIL PHARISEES!

  And they say whose beating up their brothers?
• 

  Jim_TX

  ...Bizzarro Superman...

  I remember this one!!! hahahahaha!!! As a kid, we never got comic books, but one time a couple were given to us. One of those was an issue about the Bizarro World and Bizarro Superman! It was hilarious!

  Oh. Sorry. I just hijacked the topic.

  *slowly backs out of room*

  Regards,

  Jim TX
• 

  JH

  I'm inactive since over a decade, and although they were always allowed to talk to me, many chose not to, or limit any conversation to a hello or a nod of the head if they met me in a public place.

  A few still had a limited conversation with me.

  I didn't receive any phone calls or visits from ordinary JW's in decades. Even when I was an active JW, the only phone call I'd get was if I'd pick someone up to go to the meeting....

  Only the elders came once a year before the Memorial. I don't call that a friendly visit.

  If they do shun the inactive even more, it won't change anything in my case.
• 

  JH

  Jesus wouldn't shun or teach others to shun inactive members, so the Watchtower is getting their new light from a dark source.
• 

  restrangled

  Here is the "dark source"....

  On the WBTS web site they quote Edward Gibbon on shunning as part of the their justification but left out most of what he said on the subject.

  This is the entire quote:

  It is the undoubted right of every society to exclude from its communion and benefits such among its members as reject or violate those regulations which have been established by general consent. In the exercise of this power, the censures of the Christian church were chiefly directed against scandalous sinners, and particularly those who were guilty of murder, of fraud, or of incontinence; against the authors or the followers of any heretical opinions which had been condemned by the judgment of the Episcopal order; and against those unhappy persons, who, whether from choice or compulsion, had polluted themselves after their baptism by any act of idolatrous worship.The consequences of excommunication were of a temporal as well as a spiritual nature. The Christian against whom it was pronounced, was deprived of any part in the oblations of the faithful. The ties both of religious and of private friendship were dissolved: he found himself a profane object of abhorrence to the persons whom he the most esteemed, or by whom he had been the most tenderly beloved; and as far as an expulsion from a respectable society could imprint on his character a mark of disgrace, he was shunned or suspected by the generality of mankind. The situation of these unfortunate exiles was in itself very painful and melancholy; but, as it usually happens, their apprehensions far exceeded their sufferings. The benefits of the Christian communion were those of eternal life; nor could they erase from their minds the awful opinion, that to those ecclesiastical governors by whom they were condemned, the Deity had committed the keys of Hell and of Paradise. The heretic, indeed, who might be supported by the consciousness of their intentions, and by the flattering hope that they alone had discovered the true path of salvation, endeavored to regain, in their separate assemblies, those comforts, temporal as well as spiritual, which they no longer derived from the great society of Christians. But almost all those who had reluctantly yielded to the power of vice or idolatry were sensible of their fallen condition, and anxiously desirous of being restored to the benefits of the Christian communion.

  With regard to the treatment of these penitents, two opposite opinions, the one of justice, the other of mercy, divided the primitive church. The more rigid and inflexible casuists refused them forever, and without exception, the meanest place in the holy community, which they had disgraced or deserted; and leaving them to the remorse of a guilty conscience, indulged them only with a faint ray of hope that the contrition of their life and death might possibly be accepted by the Supreme Being. 145 A milder sentiment was embraced in practice as well as in theory, by the purest and most respectable of the Christian churches. 146 The gates of reconciliation and of heaven were seldom shut against the returning penitent; but a severe and solemn form of discipline was instituted, which, while it served to expiate his crime, might powerfully deter the spectators from the imitation of his example. Humbled by a public confession, emaciated by fasting and clothed in sackcloth, the penitent lay prostrate at the door of the assembly, imploring with tears the pardon of his offences, and soliciting the prayers of the faithful. 147 If the fault was of a very heinous nature, whole years of penance were esteemed an inadequate satisfaction to the divine justice; and it was always by slow and painful gradations that the sinner, the heretic, or the apostate, was readmitted into the bosom of the church. A sentence of perpetual excommunication was, however, reserved for some crimes of an extraordinary magnitude, and particularly for the inexcusable relapses of those penitents who had already experienced and abused the clemency of their ecclesiastical superiors. According to the circumstances or the number of the guilty, the exercise of the Christian discipline was varied by the discretion of the bishops. The councils of Ancyra and Illiberis were held about the same time, the one in Galatia, the other in Spain; but their respective canons, which are still extant, seem to breathe a very different spirit. The Galatian, who after his baptism had repeatedly sacrificed to idols, might obtain his pardon by a penance of seven years; and if he had seduced others to imitate his example, only three years more were added to the term of his exile. But the unhappy Spaniard, who had committed the same offence, was deprived of the hope of reconciliation, even in the article of death; and his idolatry was placed at the head of a list of seventeen other crimes, against which a sentence no less terrible was pronounced. Among these we may distinguish the inexpiable guilt of calumniating a bishop, a presbyter, or even a deacon. 148

  Footnote 145: The Montanists and the Novatians , who adhered to this opinion with the greatest rigor and obstinacy, found themselves at last in the number of excommunicated heretics. See the learned and copious Mosheim, Secul. ii. and iii.

  Footnote 146: Dionysius ap. Euseb. iv. 23. Cyprian, de Lapsis.

  Footnote 147: Cave's Primitive Christianity, part iii. c. 5. The admirers of antiquity regret the loss of this public penance .

  Footnote 148: See in Dupin, Bibliotheque Ecclesiastique, tom. ii. p. 304 - 313, a short but rational exposition of the canons of those councils, which were assembled in the first moments of tranquillity, after the persecution of Diocletian . This persecution had been much less severely felt in Spain than in Galatia ; a difference which may, in some measure account for the contrast of their regulations.

  The well-tempered mixture of liberality and rigor, the judicious dispensation of rewards and punishments, according to the maxims of policy as well as justice, constituted the human strength of the church. The Bishops, whose paternal care extended itself to the government of both worlds, were sensible of the importance of these prerogatives; and covering their ambition with the fair pretence of the love of order, they were jealous of any rival in the exercise of a discipline so necessary to prevent the desertion of those troops which had enlisted themselves under the banner of the cross, and whose numbers every day became more considerable. From the imperious declamations of Cyprian, we should naturally conclude that the doctrines of excommunication and penance formed the most essential part of religion; and that it was much less dangerous for the disciples of Christ to neglect the observance of the moral duties, than to despise the censures and authority of their bishops. Sometimes we might imagine that we were listening to the voice of Moses, when he commanded the earth to open, and to swallow up, in consuming flames, the rebellious race which refused obedience to the priesthood of Aaron; and we should sometimes suppose that we hear a Roman consul asserting the majesty of the republic, and declaring his inflexible resolution to enforce the rigor of the laws. * "If such irregularities are suffered with impunity," (it is thus that the bishop of Carthage chides the lenity of his colleague,) "if such irregularities are suffered, there is an end of Episcopal Vigor; 149 an end of the sublime and divine power of governing the Church, an end of Christianity itself." Cyprian had renounced those temporal honors, which it is probable he would never have obtained; * but the acquisition of such absolute command over the consciences and understanding of a congregation, however obscure or despised by the world, is more truly grateful to the pride of the human heart, than the possession of the most despotic power, imposed by arms and conquest on a reluctant people.

  Footnote *: Gibbon has been accused of injustice to the character of Cyprian, as exalting the "censures and authority of the church above the observance of the moral duties." Felicissimus had been condemned by a synod of bishops, (non tantum mea, sed plurimorum coepiscorum, sententia condemnatum,) on the charge not only of schism, but of embezzlement of public money, the debauch ing of virgins, and frequent acts of adultery . His violent menaces had extorted his readmission into the church, against which Cyprian protests with much vehemence.

  Footnote 149: Cyprian Epist. 69.

  Footnote *: This supposition appears unfounded: the birth and the talents of Cyprian might make us presume the contrary.

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  To cite original text:
  
  Gibbon, Edward, 1737-1794. The history of the decline and fall of the Roman Empire. 1st ed. (London : Printed for W. Strahan ; and T. Cadell, 1776-1788.), pp. 495-502.
• 

  sspo

  The only thing of note no one is to talk to inactive ones exept to invite them to the hall

  This I like to see!

  There are many that attend the meetings and are inactive in service.

  What do you do with them ? Do you stop talking to them at the meetings?

  Another man made rule that the dubs will take to the extreme and cause

  even more pain among family members. When will it end?