A bit reluctant

by saki2fifty 148 Replies latest jw friends

  • JamesThomas

    Welcome, Saki.

    Who are you trying to sell the validity of the Witness Organization to? The people here, or yourself?

    If you feel it is the right thing to worship an ancient tribal deity and those who profess to be his ambassador here on earth, go for it. Stop vacillating. Be the best Jehovah's Witness you can be. Certainly you must believe the end is near; and if you are found not honoring and serving your all-knowing deity, he will certainly without hesitation kill you and your children. This brings up an important question however.

    Can you honestly, sincerely, and genuinely love and honor that which will kill you and your family if you do not? Dwell on that, until you are absolutely certain as to your hearts answer. Then follow your heart. Either be a Witness 100%, or let go completely of the insanity once and for all.

    The silent wisdom exists within you which knows without doubt what to do.


  • Double Edge
    Double Edge

    Hi and a BIG Welcome!!

    but to me, there is no greater feeling. My kids love going, enjoy it tremendously and show pure love... a pure and true love of Jehovah himself that each of you criticize and will continue to criticize.

    First of all, that's using a broad brush... I rearly see a pure and true love of Jehovah himself criticized... I believe a lot of people here criticize the manipulating organization, not The Almighty Creator Himself.... there's a huge difference.

    but to me, there is no greater feeling. My kids love going, enjoy it tremendously and show pure love... a pure and true love of Jehovah himself ..... is good spiritually, good for bonding families, good molding morals, and good at doing what is most important... strengthening your relationship with God.
    There are hundreds of thousands of people that can say the EXACT same thing about their Church and their love of God and the importance it plays in their children's and family's lives. Have you really had the freedom to examine others experiences, or do you believe all the NEGATIVITY that the Watchtower teaches about other believers in Christ.
  • Double Edge
    Double Edge
    I'm sorry if I appear to be ignorant on some of the matters that each of you take seriously. I guess most of my life and been centered around JW's,

    Do you think?

    that love that I had as a kid has not faded.

    that "love" sounds like a love for spiritual things, i.e. God/Jehovah ... so why should that fade.... maybe He's opening a door for you...

    Cant pinpoint it, but my heart aches now that I've started reading posts that are against what I hold close ... even saddened. The day that I turn away, which im sure will surely happen now that I've started process by visiting this site... will be the day I've given up life itself.

    Now why would you do that...... the Creator gives you this wonderful journey to explore LIFE and you give up....scheesch, I think you're listening to the wrong source.... that's not even scriptural:

    2 Timothy 1:7For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

    Let the real 'LIGHT and Truth' in ..... come out of your 'sleep'.... you should be positive and upbeat and look forward to the rest of your journey, whereever it takes you. Remember, the Creator is on YOUR side... he's for you, not against you ... relinquish the false notions and move on..

  • AuldSoul



    ...and good at doing what is most important... strengthening your relationship with God.

    I am curious about this statement. How does being one of Jehovah's Witnesses strengthen a relationship with God?

    That is, since the Bible teaches that building a relationship with God is an individual thing and never indicates that this relationship with God is strengthened by meeting with fellow believers, exactly how is a relationship with God strengthened by virtue of being one of Jehovah's Witnesses, or conversely weakened by not being one of Jehovah's Witnesses?


  • saki2fifty

    Thank you all for responding. It's very emotional for me to hear each of you respond in the way you have. Were you all not brothers and sisters at one time or what the society calls them? At one time im sure each of you enjoyed socializing and even enjoyed making the meetings and possibly enjoyed the fact that you were pleasing Jehovah so its hard for me to fathom how someone can leave something like that behind. Now of course I researched a bit, so I know some of the reasons, but coming from a simple minded witness, me, its hard to see. I'm afraid of losing Jehovah, such as everyone on this board did. I love God. I want to please him. I have sincerely prayed and prayed and prayed to help guide me to what is right. I cannot leave him for I will have felt as though I have betrayed him. I hate this place called earth and just about have a hatred for people. I hate to have worked so hard to be told that what I've learned is wrong and fulls of lies.

    I'm still with them, and I will always defend them and Jehovah God as I know it.

    But maybe this is the wrong place to do it... please let me know if thats the case.

    Anyways, enough of that ... to respond to some of your comments:

    (Because I'm at work, the below has been typed off an on in my spare time, so if it appears to be insensitive or rude, that was not the intention. Just typing here and there as I find the time. So my apologies if taken otherwise)

    As for your story, you may have had a great upbringing that involved the jdubs. But let me ask you the question? If you were never a witness would it have been so horrible?

    Of course not. As a matter of fact, I would assume that life itself would be a bit more enjoyable. But the difference in being a witness and one who is not, is that most people who know nothing about jehovah and his organization live their life day by day, possibly going to church every now and then, then turning 70 or 80 years old, dying and thats it... whereas a witness feels as though (as I have) their life has purpose and that they have found God. If you look at the basic beliefs and doctines (not all), but they are pretty solid. Those who just go to church (again, one who has not known "the truth") just to go, which is practially the majority, dont have that feeling of purpose.

    One word of advice, People that are born in the "truth" never have to seek truth for themselves. You have think outside the box until you can determine if you have found truth.

    You're right, but have you found the truth? Not the truth about the truths of JW's, but after leaving, have you found the truth about God and his requirements itself?

    All I ask is that when the time comes, you allow your children that same choice.

    As I begin to learn more about the truth as the days pass, I have learnt that this is very important. I would much rather them know for sure instead of finding out when they are 30, wasting their life away. But hopefully, the truth as they know it will be their foundation.

    Not everything the JW's teach is bad. We have even had several threads on the good side of the JW lifestyle. I was glad to have morals growing up. I never did drugs, smoked, and was a virgin when I got married. I appreciate those things. What I didn't appreciate was not being able to hang with my friends at school, not being given the OPTION of college, not being allowed to play sports (practice was sometimes on meeting nights) and so on.

    Same thing with me. I never associated with the other kids, no sports, college (but later on I did), etc. I hated it. I hated making friends, then having to explain why I couldn't. Day after day. But wasn't that for the benefit of our good? You cant hold the society at fault for recommendations to help protect. But the society has learned from this and has changed accordingly. Even the WTS has to live and learn.

    ARE the JW's really that bad? Well lets see if you joined before 1965 (somewhere in there), it would have been against your religion to get vaccinations. When they changed that in the SMALLEST paragraph ever in 65 would you have left if your child had small pox or polio due to the non vaccination rule that was obviously not God inspired? That is up to you. Transplants were considered cannibalism for years until that changed about 20 years ago. If your child needed a transplant and being a good witness, you didn't allow it and they died, how would you feel when the Organization said it was a conscience matter the next year? Was that one of Gods laws? No. If you had allowed a transplant you would have been disfellowshipped. Do you think they would have called you later when it was suddenly a conscience matter and said our bad, you are reinstated? I personally cannot follow an organization blindly that has been wrong so many times. Whether or not you think that is "BAD" enough to leave is up to you.

    I disagree. I wasn't aware of that the vaccinations thing, but noone knows why the organization made those "rules". Agreed? With Jehovah's Witnesses being a fairly young organization, maybe they made those rules/guidlines for they were sure if this violated God's laws. I dont see how that could have benefited them at all by making those rules, so then you would have to conclude that they did it to ensure Gods laws weren't violated... just precautions. Then I would assume that they reevaluted those "rules", changed it because they saw no issues with it. Again, its relatively young. And no, I dont think a religeon can be classified as "bad" just because of this.

    Many people who belong to other religions have exactly the same experiences as you. They feel surrounded by love, they had ideal childhoods, they are taught to lead clean, moral lives. Does that mean they have the truth? Or would you feel compelled in your ministry to help them leave all of that because it is actually false religion (according to the Society)? Don't you think that it is important for people to know the whole story about where their belief system originated and what its leaders have said and done in the past? Maybe it wouldn't matter to you, but it matters to some of us.

    If this is the case, then wouldn't we not use some of God's faithful servants of old as examples? Most of them had very dishonerable pasts. Or would this only be applied to religeous organizations?

    Forgot: YES I AM HAPPY!!! I feel as if a huge rock has been lifted from my chest since nullifying my baptism.

    Yes, I have doubts. I admit that. But, I still believe there is a God. A true God. One God. A God with requirements. If JW's are not the true religeon, then, since nullifying your baptism, how have you found happiness... how are you living up to Gods standards and requirements? And is it that, where you have found happiness? Or happiness not having to deal with JW's?

    What really matters is what you think. When I read your post it seems you have held back from baptism for some reason. Perhaps it is because you do not believe all of the aspects of the Truth? Most that I know who attend but do not commit, want to be a part of the social structure that you find comfortable for yourself and your family. I can see that, we need structure in our lives. Certainly a family does.

    The fact that you posted here and have been reading this site shows you wonder what's going on out here in the non JW world. Why would anyone leave so safe a place with so safe a feeling? I'm sure your father's words about Silentlambs has made you aware of the sharks that troll the Kingdom Hall waters. It may not be as safe for your family as you think.

    You sound like a caring and attentive parent so its a hurdle you can surmount. If you are truly happy there, why set a half-assed example for your kids? I never understood that. If this is the "Truth" and thier everlasting life is involved, why wouldn't you become more than a bystander?

    I have held back baptism for the simple reason that the organization has a strict and tough requirements to follow, and being the person that I am, not very outgoing, it is extremely hard for me. I couldn't have done like everyone else and got baptized early on, which would have been easy, but I guess one of the other reasons is that I wanted to make sure I was ready. And because my attendance was off and on, never felt like I was.

    And yes, I do wonder about whats going on out there. I am looking and searching, and even learning about some of the "apparent" falsehoods, but will never take it as it is unless there is hard evidence. And yes, he was the one who has introduced me to many of the false doctrines, but again, I cant take it unless I have hard eveidence. Up to this point, its all heresay (from what my Dad has showed me), which includes some of the things i've read here. But, im sure I'll be bombarded with those facts soon.

    I dont understand it myself. Its tough being a witness, really tough. But a bystander by no means. The only thing lacking is the official public dedication.

  • saki2fifty

    Hmm... looks like a recieved more responses than I knew about since I wrote the above.

    Very interesting comments.

  • AuldSoul


    Here is something easy to wrap your head around: JW Requirements for "Christian" Baptism

    Of all the requirements Jehovah's Witnesses impose prior to baptism ONLY repentance and conversion are required of believers in the 1st Century. There is no hint of the others being pre-baptismal requirements.


  • lowden

    Welcome Saki

    Go back to the top of page 2 and read James Thomas's post again!

    He encapsulates my feelings very well. I've been where you are, not knowing or believing that there could possibly be a life outside of the org'. WRONG!

    A god that says 'Worship me or i will kill you' is a psycopathic MONSTER!!

    Jehovah is a 'figment' my dear, used to petrify and subjugate the people. He doesn't exsist.

    That is an extremely hard concept to realise and take in, i know but remember it and think on it.

    Come back here, you will be welcome.

    Peace to ya.


  • Hecklerboy

    I guess one of the biggest things for me was when I learned that the Society teaches that they are the mediator between you and God, Not Jesus. They say that Jesus is just the mediator for the 144,000.

    Nowhere in the bible did I ever read that.

    *** Watchtower 1979 April 1 p.31 Questions from Readers ***

    Questions from Readers

    • Is Jesus the "mediator" only for anointed Christians?

    The term "mediator" occurs just six times in the Christian Greek Scriptures and Scripturally is always used regarding a formal covenant.

    Moses was the "mediator" of the Law covenant made between God and the nation of Israel. (Gal. 3:19, 20) Christ, though, is the "mediator of a new covenant" between Jehovah and spiritual Israel, the "Israel of God" that will serve as kings and priests in heaven with Jesus. (Heb. 8:6; 9:15; 12:24; Gal. 6:16) At a time when God was selecting those to be taken into that new covenant, the apostle Paul wrote that Christ was the "one mediator between God and men." (1 Tim. 2:5) Reasonably Paul was here using the word "mediator" in the same way he did the other five times, which occurred before the writing of 1 Timothy 2:5, referring to those then being taken into the new covenant for which Christ is "mediator." So in this strict Biblical sense Jesus is the "mediator" only for anointed Christians.

    The new covenant will terminate with the glorification of the remnant who are today in that covenant mediated by Christ. The "great crowd" of "other sheep" that is forming today is not in that new covenant. However, by their associating with the "little flock" of those yet in that covenant they come under benefits that flow from that new covenant. During the millennium Jesus Christ will be their king, high priest and judge. For more detailed information, see Aid to Bible Understanding, pages 1129 and 1130 under "Mediator"; also God's "Eternal Purpose" Now Triumphing for Man's Good, page 160, paragraph 10; also The Watchtower issues of February 15, 1966, pages 105 through 123; November 15, 1972, pages 685 and 686, under the subheading "Leading the Way to a New Covenant"; and April 1, 1973, pages 198 and 199, under the subheading "The New Covenant."

  • JWdaughter

    Wow, I am surprised that you came on here feeling the way that you do, but welcome to the forum. You said, "The day that I turn away, which im sure will surely happen now that I've started process by visiting this site... will be the day I've given up life itself." I think that if you truly believe you have truth that there is no reason why you would assume that you will turn away. The fact that you are convinced you will turn away now and that it will also mean you have given up on life itself really concerns me.

    Your deeply held beliefs may be deeply held hopes. After dedicating your entire life to an organization, to see it riduculed would be harsh, but you have been in long enough that you know it is not without cause that there are so many that are hostile to the WT org. You have even held back from water baptism. Did the Ethiopian Eunuch have to have regular field service to be worthy of baptism???? NO. Being shy is not a reason for holding back from baptism, so either you don't feel so convicted that you wish to be baptised in the name of the organization, or they are unreasonable in saying that you are unworthy for not selling magazines enough.

    I know that my life is happier than all of my JW relatives. I am not an alcoholic, and the two 'strongest' JWs in my family both are. It is hard keeping track of who will speak to who, who CAN speak, who is out, who is in. . .I can talk to anyone, but never know WHO will talk to me(I was never baptised, but that is just a technicality)Weddings are fun, some will go to weddings in churches, some won't. Most will make it to the receptions, but may or may not speak to the former JW sibling/relative. Most of the next generation are just part of the world, but not apostates, and JWs miss SO freaking much with the shunning policy, that I think that they go to these events as an excuse just to see their loved ones that they are no longer allowed to speak to. I DON'T think that the WT promotes family in any meaningful kind of way. Hasn't done much for yours or mine.

    I wish you well and happy, and hope that if you ever do decide to leave the organization that you will realise that it doesn't mean you are rejecting God or Jesus. You are leaving an organization that doesn't think you are worthy to even truly be a PART of it. I hope that life means more to you than reading the WT and sitting in those chairs at the KH. Worshipping God is not the same as revering an organization. God bless you friend. Shelly

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