For those not sick to death of talking about this...607 BCE

by Swamboozled 601 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • thirdwitness

    Ezekiel 26;7 “For this is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah has said, ‘Here I am bringing against Tyre Neb·u·chad·rez´zar the king of Babylon from the north, a king of kings, with horses and war chariots and cavalrymen and a congregation, even a multitudinous people. 8 Your dependent towns in the field he will kill even with the sword, and he must make against you a siege wall and throw up against you a siege rampart and raise up against you a large shield; 9 and the strike of his attack engine he will direct against your walls, and your towers he will pull down, with his swords. 10 Owing to the heaving mass of his horses their dust will cover you. Owing to the sound of cavalryman and wheel and war chariot your walls will rock, when he comes in through your gates, as in the cases of entering into a city opened by breaches. 11 With the hoofs of his horses he will trample down all your streets. Your people he will kill even with the sword, and to the earth your own pillars of strength will go down. 12 And they will certainly spoil your resources and plunder your sales goods, and tear down your walls, and your desirable houses they will pull down. And your stones and your woodwork and your dust they will place in the very midst of the water.’ End of Neb's doings. Now begins further prophecying against Tyre. How do we know? Did we just pull it out of our hats? No. We know because Jehovah told us so by means of Isaiah and Zechariah. Unless you believe the Bible is in error? 13 “‘And I will cause the turmoil of your singing to cease, and the very sound of your harps will be heard no more. 14 And I will make you a shining, bare surface of a crag. A drying yard for dragnets is what you will become. Never will you be rebuilt; for I myself, Jehovah, have spoken,’ is the utterance of the Sovereign Lord Jehovah. Here is what it does not say: A drying yard for dragnets is what you will become and by the hand of Nebuchadnezzar never will you be rebuilt; for I myself, Jehovah, have spoken,’ is the utterance of the Sovereign Lord Jehovah.

  • toreador

    Hey Thirdwitness, :Jehovah of course had Ezekiel write exactly what he wanted him to write. It sure dont sound like it to me. : And by seeking the scriptures we know exactly what Ezekiel meant. You have to twist things to make it say something it does not. :He did not say nor mean that Neb would destroy Tyre to the point of never being rebuilt. I believe that is exactly what he said> : If Jehovah wanted to say that I suspect he would have said it exactly the way he did about Egypt. He would have said, 'By the hand of Neb Tyre will never be rebuilt' Just as he said 'By the hand of Neb Egypt will cease' etc etc. Are you saying Egypt is no more? I beg to differ.I believe Egypt is alive and well. :There is no comparison. But hey if you have a scripture from Isaiah or Zech or another prophet contradicting Ezekiel about Egypt by all means bring it forth. The one we already have is enough. Why dont you answer the questions AlanF had about Jerusalem? Toreador

  • scholar



    To the contrary for I have stated on this board many times my academic and Witness status. I am a current regular publisher and have just this weekend attended as a delegate to the Deliverance At Hand District Convention. You have not been up-front with your status being rather mealy-mouthed about the matter. True Aussies are up-front and do not beat around the bush, Are you disfellowshipped or not? Yes or No? Simple is it not?

    scholar JW

  • stevenyc

    Thirdwitness, I think you will find that Jehovah talks to Tyre from verse 15. steve

  • ozziepost
  • stevenyc

    Not only does Jehovah talk to Tyre after Ezekiels propecy of Tyre "Never being rebuilt", in verse 21 He says "but you will no more be found to time indefinite". Which also, by FACT, is not true.

    13 “‘And I will cause the turmoil of your singing to cease, and the very sound of your harps will be heard no more. 14 And I will make you a shining, bare surface of a crag. A drying yard for dragnets is what you will become. Never will you be rebuilt; for I myself, Jehovah, have spoken,’ is the utterance of the Sovereign Lord Jehovah.

    15 “This is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah has said to Tyre, ‘At the sound of your downfall, when the fatally wounded one groans, when there is a killing with slaughter in the midst of you, will not the islands rock? 16 And down from their thrones all the chieftains of the sea will certainly come and remove their sleeveless coats, and they will strip off their own embroidered garments. They will put on trembling spells. Upon the earth they will sit down, and they will certainly tremble every moment and stare in amazement at you. 17 And they must raise up over you a dirge and say to you:
    “‘“How you have perished, that used to be inhabited from the seas, O praised city, who became a strong one in the sea, she and those inhabiting her, those who gave their terror to all the inhabitants [of the earth]! 18 Now the islands will tremble in the day of your downfall. And the islands that are in the sea must be disturbed owing to your going out.”’
    19 “For this is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah has said, ‘When I make you a devastated city, like the cities that are actually not inhabited, when [I] bring up over you the watery deep, and the vast waters will have covered you, 20 I will also bring you down with those going down into the pit to the people of long ago, and I will cause you to dwell in the lowest land, like places devastated for a long time, with those going down into the pit, in order that you may not be inhabited; and I will put decoration in the land of those alive.
    21 “‘Sudden terrors are what I shall make you, and you will not be; and you will be sought for, but you will no more be found to time indefinite,’ is the utterance of the Sovereign Lord Jehovah.”

  • fullofdoubtnow

    scholar jw,

    I will answer this, though I'm not certain you are worth it:

    Now you admit to being duped. How foolish of you. Now you are no longer duped you therefore must be now wise. Pray tell what is this new found wisdom teaching you? Are you now no longer full of doubt? But wait, something is wrong because your choice of a user name does not reflect an enlightened one, Does it?

    Yes, I admit I was duped. 25 years ago, I allowed myself to be indoctrinated into a destructive, high - control cult that tried, and for a number of years almost succeeded, to rob me of the power of independent thought. They did it by knocking on my door and telling me this wonderful fairy tale about a cleansed earth, where humans and animals lived in peaceful co - existence. Trouble was, I didn't realise it was a fairy tale at the time (oh for the benefit of hindsight), so I joined this cult, and wasted over half my life chasing a dream that I finally realised has no chance whatsoever of coming true. Once I knew the truth about this cult, I wisely disassociated myself from it.

    You might have heard of this cult yourself. They are known as jehovahs witnesses, does the name ring a bell? I don't pretend to be full of wisdom, but I am wise enough nowadays to stear well clear of destructive cults like that one, and as for joining another religion - no thankyou. 25 years as a jw was more than enough religion for me. Before my indoctrination into the cult, I was very skeptical about the bible. I was of the opinion that it was a book of half - baked theories that some defined as prophecies that would one day be fulfilled and fairy tales on a par with those written by the brothers Grimm. I wish I'd stuck to that opinion instead of allowing myself to be misled by the jws who knocked on my door that day. They were misled themselves, of course, so I don't blame them for what happened to me. They were only following the orders of a bunch of old men in Brooklyn who have some crazy idea that they have established a direct line of communication to God, talk about delusions of grandeur. people like Hitler, Napoleon and the other would - be world rulers had nothing on these boys.

    Well, I finally got wise to the mess I'd got myself into around a year or so ago, and decided to cut my losses and quit. I know I can't get the 25 years I spent chasing the wts dream back, but I intend to make damn sure I enjoy the rest of my life, and no bunch of loser in Brooklyn are going to stop me.

    As for me name, that indicates my state of mind wts - wise when I first joined this board. I can assure you I'm in no doubt anymore about whether the wts teaches the truth or not, but I think I'll keep the name anyway.

  • toreador

    Excellent SteveNYC!

    By 3rdwitness definition, Tyre could become desolated today or 1000 years from now and say that is still the fulfillment of the prophecy.


  • kgav8r

    I am going to have to agree (at least i think i'm agreeing, not really sure at this point) with 3rdW. The prophecy of Tyre was fullfilled but not until 322 B.C. (or is that 302 B.C.E.) by Alexander the Great. However this gets us no closer to proving or disproving 607 BCE, if that is indeed the point of this thread. I believe the Bible is useful for chronology, but i think it was stated earlier that prophecy is not necessarily equal to chronology. I also do not agree with taking verses out of the context of their books. If i could always do that, i could prove who assasinated JFK!!!

  • stevenyc

    kgav8r, Even though Alexander raized Tyre, Tyre was rebuilt. The Ezekiel prophecy says that it will be destroyed and never rebuilt. That is the issue. And there is no skirting around it. If you believe that the prophecy is inerrent then the only reasoning is that your still waiting for it. scholar suggests that it has not been rebuilt. I know that when he mentions Hebrew linguistics it can be difficult for the casual poster to verify, but this one is easy. Do a google lookup on the history of Tyre, and you will find a plethora of documents through the ages explaining how it was rebuilt. Concidering the Lebanon has a population of a little over 3 million, a city of over quarter million is substancial, and much larger than the time king Neb or Alexader seiged it. Happy searching steve

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