my wife went to a meeting today.
1st one in 3 months.
i never fight it and she never invites me.
It not a study of the bible it is an indoctrination of Watchtower procedures, Strengthening means your going to follow the rules better. Once the understanding of the rules are reinforced then your a sure candiate for disfellowshipping because you have no excuse for not obeying.
It too cruel even for the society to disfellowship you until you full understand why?
this is my take on the whole inherited sin thing:.
let's say your parents committed a crime and were sentenced to life in prison, let's say 140 years.
now, they died 90 years short of their sentence.
How would we know? One can come up with their own ideas which is find. One can listen to those that seem to know more. Or we can believe what God says. But it still not about fairness its about belief.
back in the old days, i remember when the elders actually cared about the flock.
i was involved with helping older sisters, (octegenarians, widows) to take them to the grocery store and help them each week.. i remember helping when an older one would fall, and helping clean up the blood, and get there home in order from their return from the hospital.
just a lot of good works.. that stuff is out the window now.
Love is spiritual you are dealing with a legal corporation that exist through enforcement of rules that can withstand court actions.
Love for the flock cannot be dictated by rules it based on action of compassion putting the needs of others ahead of your own. Those men are long gone they meet their fate when they disobeyed rules to help someone.
Or the burned out when rules became so heavy they could not breathe. JW's removed spiritual people from the flock years ago the idea of being spiritual is beyond them.
this is my take on the whole inherited sin thing:.
let's say your parents committed a crime and were sentenced to life in prison, let's say 140 years.
now, they died 90 years short of their sentence.
I don't think the word "fair" is a biblical term. Ultimately, God could repeat the test in the garden for each human being born since the orginial sin perhaps that seems to be fairer.
On the other hand, the track record of the human race indicates few if any would have done any better then Adam and Eve did. First people don't believe what God says sin is or the importance of its effects upon the human race.
Basing judgment on fair is super subjective, in that, people that molest child don't often think their actions are unfair. The point is God is not concern with what humans believe or think fair to be.
If God said sins bring death and all that have sin die then God appears to have been correct. On the other hand, if God says that He alone is the source of life and all those that are allowed to associate with Him have life eternal... then the choice is one believing not fairness.
The point is what is a God and what is a human being?
salvation by "works" comes from pagan doctrines--by request!
request from researcher: can you tell me where the information is at about salvation by works coming from pagan teachings?
the pastor at our church mentioned that when jehovah's witnesses go out in their preaching work because they are under watchtower "obligation," and don't preach out of a sincere desire or heart condition, then they are being deceived to "work" out their salvation which comes from pagan doctrines.
When men set standards and by their own will perform to those standards they are justifying themselves by their own works.
God states that no one on this earth can be justified accept through the blood of His son who He alone deemed worthy.
Christ would not accept that he was good teacher he stated there is only one who is good and He is in heaven. Christain do not accept that they are good either they humbly acknowlege that their good works come from Christ working through them by His Holy Spirit.
They understand that they are the body of Chirst, Christ has not become a slave to their personal body. They understand that their faith is a gift and so are all fruitages of Gods Spirit working in them and through them.
They further understand when God completes the work in them that they cannot boast in and of themselves (in the flesh) because the have been recreated for God's will.
So any "work" outside Christ is condemned to death by God. Thus, any work in Christ is - do to Christ giving his life for us. Because people do good work in the name of Christ or religion does not mean that it is the work of Christ body under God's well.
What is in heaven is Holy uncorruptable what is of earth is corruptable. The seed sown in God's children is an uncorruptable seed from God. This seed conquers the world, this seed grows into a tree producing the fruits God supplies to it.
If the tree is from God it produce good works because those good works come from God not man. If the tree is of man's good works it only produce death because men are dying and their ways are death. The gifts God give is His fruitage of love for man. Salvation is just one of those gifts.
God gives salvation when we accept Christ Jesus there is nothing to earn it has already been given. If it is the real deal it must produce good for others the person recieving that gift is reborn, recreated for God's will, not their will of their flesh.
Most Christain have no idea of the works being agrued in this forum they see it as doing something good for some one because the bible tells them to. They further believe by doing something good that they've earned a gold star from God.
When a person accept Jesus Christ they are dead and God makes them new a new creation. That creation was not brought about by any of mans efforts or does God share His glory of such with any human effort.
Once that is understood the works in the bible become very understandable. Moreover, when that is understood then all of men's works are like bloody rages to God this then goes well beyond the works of the "Law" that Jehovah's Witnesses used to obligate people to go to the door.
JW's witnesses do not go to the door because God Spirit in them motivates them to share God's love with neighbor rather they are movated by requirments and to stay in good standing with the org. And for that reason when they leave the org. they "stop" going door to door!
cant the elders make it so that any deviation or any thought could be considered "loose conduct" and therefore a disfellowshipping offense?
Absolute control requires no rules it only requires welling souls. People that want absolute control are not fair or godly - so be sure to flatter them and agree!
where did early christians worship during nt times?.
was it only in homes?
or did they have dedicated buildings?
Christ did not come to build and earthly temple or meetings places, on like groups today that boast of God's favor by the numbers of buildings and meetings.
God was making people His temple he was restoring what had been lost a spiritual relationship with Him the Father. The rightful place of worship had never been corrupted because it was in heaven the earthly temple was a small preview of the greather Spiritual temple of which Christain had become a part of.
Meetings were not emphasized for early Christain as the churches do today, To fund large groups require people being made to feel guility. Early Christain did not need to go some where to have God Spirit or be told what God Spirit was, they were the temple of God.
The Law and all the rules condemned them to death they had been set free, but the nature of people that don't walk in the Spirit is to make physical meetings and temples more important then the Spiritual temple. Seeing and being approved of men is more important then God's approval.
where did early christians worship during nt times?.
was it only in homes?
or did they have dedicated buildings?
It was not an issue for the early Christian it is only an issue for the religiously correct! They were the temple of God it required going nowhere.
Meeting with others was a part of their faith in order to encourage one another this could be two or more or one if they where in jail. They did not live in fear of not being at meetings or if they weren't at a meeting they were no longer the temple of God on earth.
God had stated He would never leave them da! They were the temple of God.
We worship not in this mountain or that mountain. The hour is coming and it is now that the true worshipers will worship with Spirit and Truth.
In fact they did not need a teacher because they were the temple of God.
cant the elders make it so that any deviation or any thought could be considered "loose conduct" and therefore a disfellowshipping offense?
Your missing the point! The elders are merciful if you were under the old law they put you to death! The modern day Jew's are alive and well in the org. they have restored the truth and the only pure people on earth for God.
They have personally cleaned up God's people through disfellowshipping anyone that does not have pure thoughts.
So you have two choices if your longing to be a part of this holy group, that is, (1) learn to not think and live a lie, or (2) live a lie and think ,but don't "confess" your sins!
was wondering since this an election year in the us, if the wts has been reinforcing its position on the voting ban...i thought it recently had become a matter of conscience, but tonight my wife was talking about how she realizes there is a need for governments, but there will be only one government which will bring peace.
.
i asked her about selecting the government and she said that there will always be people who vote and they can select the governements since overall government really does not matter.. i am guessing that she has spent more time with the pesky sister in her free time than i had previously thought.
Always follow the money trial...
"Conscious in the world of JW's is a political statement that can be taken to mean one thing to the "faithful" and some thing much different to those that are not a part of the "faithful".
First of all their are no "conscious matter" to the devoted. Secondly, if your dealing with the government I am certain people being forced into not voting does not set well with them for a tax free exemption!
