Posts by Onager

25

Jehovah God Is Not Real

by Onager in

there are many of us on this site that do not believe that jehovah truly exists.. i think this is a great and wonderful thing to be celebrated!

i'd like people to list the reasons why they do not believe that jehovah exists.

this is open to all, not just atheists or agnostics, but anyone that believes that the god as put forward by jw.org does not and can not be real.. i'll start: .

Onager

AnonVet

“I can't say beyond a doubt that Jehovah or God does not exist,”

I agree that it can’t be stated beyond a doubt that God does not exist. However I think that the god called Jehovah as defined by the JW’s is internally inconsistent and therefore cannot exist. A loving god doesn’t commit hateful acts, a moral god doesn’t act immorally etc.

Stan livedeath

“jehovah exists .

but then so does baal..thor..the bogeyman etc.”

For the purposes of my OP I mean exist in the sense that my living room table exists. You’ll just have to have faith in my word that it does… J

Urvince

“Lots of words.”

Interesting, but we’re discussing the god called Jehovah, not Jesus. You seem to be saying that he does exist but is irrelevant to us today? The problem is that for millions of JW’s the Jehovah concept is horribly relevant.

25

Jehovah God Is Not Real

by Onager in

there are many of us on this site that do not believe that jehovah truly exists.. i think this is a great and wonderful thing to be celebrated!

i'd like people to list the reasons why they do not believe that jehovah exists.

this is open to all, not just atheists or agnostics, but anyone that believes that the god as put forward by jw.org does not and can not be real.. i'll start: .

Onager

Not only that LoveUniHateExams, but if children give a balding man a bit of cheek, they get torn apart by bears acting under gods orders.

Torn apart by bears.

There's a documentary called Grizzly Man. In it a couple of people get killed and eaten by a bear. You only hear fragments but it is absolutely harrowing.

Imagine that happening to children. Not only is it completely wrong, it's still wrong even if it's just a warning tale to make children respect their elders and not a literal account.

25

Jehovah God Is Not Real

by Onager in

there are many of us on this site that do not believe that jehovah truly exists.. i think this is a great and wonderful thing to be celebrated!

i'd like people to list the reasons why they do not believe that jehovah exists.

this is open to all, not just atheists or agnostics, but anyone that believes that the god as put forward by jw.org does not and can not be real.. i'll start: .

Onager

There are many of us on this site that do not believe that Jehovah truly exists.

I think this is a great and wonderful thing to be celebrated!

I'd like people to list the reasons why they do not believe that Jehovah exists. This is open to all, not just atheists or agnostics, but anyone that believes that the god as put forward by JW.org does not and can not be real.

I'll start:

A god that imparted his perfect moral code to humanity via a holy book would have mentioned the fact that slavery is immoral.

11

Jehovah - I don't like you.

by berrygerry in

Onager

Voldemort. - I don't like you.

138

Jehovah God is Real

by TakeOffTheCrown in

there are many on this site that do not believe that jehovah truly exists; that he is not a real being.

but, he is as real as next breath you draw into your nostrils.. some of you say that there is no evidence that he exists.

yet, none of you can prove that he does not exits.. cofty, (you come to mind), i appreciate that you have stated, without reservation, that you do not believe that god exists.. yet, you cannot prove it.. hope in jehovah..

Onager

I'd like to share an experience about the subject of prayer. This is all true, although it was over 20 years ago so the memories are a bit blurry.

When I was in my early 20's and a JW in good standing, but with questions that I couldn't reason away, I went on a Meander travel tour to the holy land. It was the full works, Egypt and Israel. When we stopped in Sinai part of the group climbed Mount Sinai at night, so that we would reach the top at dawn, just as the sun rose.

I left the group and climbed on my own. I was considerably perturbed in spirit. Tormented by my doubts and desperate to... believe I guess. I clearly remember one elders advice around that time: "Buy a TV, get married and settle down." He was saying to be normal, be a part of the group and I sincerely wanted to do that.

So there I was, on the top of Mount Sinai. I'd fallen at some point on the way up and cut my hand and as my blood dripped onto the rocks I prayed for direction, for a sign, for anything to say that this was how I should live my life. Then the sun rose, the darkness was stripped away and the whole land was revealed in a moment. It was glorious and I felt... nothing. There was only silence, both inside my head and out.

When you pray, the only answers come from within yourself. In a way you could say that my prayers were answered because I saw that the direction of my life must lead away from the JW's and from belief. I bought a TV, I got married, but the life I settled into was a life free from religion.

9

My plans for Christmas this year

by UnshackleTheChains in

1. attend a charity christmas party which my wife (active jw) helps to organise each year 😀.

2. buy a very small christmas tree with lights for the living room (which can easily be hidden away if jw friends are coming up).

3. buy some nice presents for my family.

Onager

My plan for Christmas is for the dog not to throw up after Christmas dinner. I mean, seriously, with 5 people sneaking her bits of turkey and god knows what, plus whatever she can hoover up that the baby drops, I fear my Christmas might be a bit… vommy.

I have the presents that I’m going to get planned, but not bought, and this weekend I’m going to test out my roast potato and parsnip making skills as I’m on roasty duty. I’ve been told I need King Edward potatoes and Goose fat, but there’s also dark rumours of dusting them in flour as well, which needs investigating.

Ahh, Christmas! What a lovely time of year!

17

Why I DON'T Fear The Future - A Conversation With My JW Mum

by Divergent in

jw
friends

3 questions i hit my jw mum with:.

first question: do you believe that god is love?

third question: do you think a god of love would choose to destroy me for not doing something i cannot do (be a jw) because i am not convinced rather than convince me beyond doubt?

Onager

Good line of argument Divergent!

You don't have to refer to any outside (therefore apostate) material at all. The "Truth" as taught by JW.org is not convincing. End of. Divergent's argument follows and therefore you have nothing to fear from Armageddon.

Boom! Sorted! :)

30

Is Satan really the bad guy in story of creation?

by evilApostate in

i wanted to take an objective look at satan in the story of creation.

this is not meant to offend those of you who are still christians.

i'm agnostic btw.

Onager

Two things strike me reading through this thread.

1) Who *was* supposed to eat the fruit from the tree of life and from the tree of the knowledge of good and bad? Did god create two distinct species of trees purely to test his human creation who had no concept of the consequences of failing the test? Isn't that a waste of good fruit? doesn't it go against the whole ethos of the creation tale of things being created male and female according to their kind?

2) Where are the trees now? They must have been self-fertilising as they produced fruit even though there was only a single specimen of each. So that fruit would have fallen to the ground, been eaten by animals (who then get to know good and bad and live forever??) and more trees of life and knowledge would then grow from the seeds. In this day and age there should be forests of trees of life and of knowledge.

29

How about prayers being used as a talk?

by NikL in

jw
friends

another thread on here made me think of it.. its a personal peeve of mine.. you bow your head in prayer and the brother says thinks like thank you for the lessons we learned today like bla bla bla and for that wonderful point about yadda yadda yadda.

jehovah we know that etc etc etc therefore we must...well you get the gist.and on and on it goes.

absolutely drives me mad..

Onager

It's a shitty thing to do.

20

Taking the Step

by beardfreedom in

jw
friends

first time posting after years of reading, the things i have learned here have gradually helped to open my eyes to the reality of this religion.

though i have been mentally out for some time, lately i have stopped going to meetings and service.

the elders are calling and i have been ignoring them, i am trying to get up the courage to finally break free and never go back.

Onager

"I feel like I am cutting anchor and drifting on an unknown current,"

It's important to understand that you have been conditioned to feel this way. Your model of reality has been twisted. An impression has been planted into your mind that inside the JW organisation is safe and outside is bad.

It is a lie.

You have accepted the lie, just as so many other intelligent people have, not because of a failing on your part. It's not because you're dumb! Smarter people than you and I are Scientologists, for example, believing things that are even more at odds with reality.

If a person is isolated, as JW's are, then a filter can be introduced between that person and reality. Everything they perceive is processed through the filter. I was out walking with a friend once and I pointed at a hillside and said "look at all those beautiful bluebells" to which he replied "What are you talking about? There's nothing there." He was wearing glasses with blue tinted lenses and he actually couldn't see the flowers! (True story).

It has become my personal mission since leaving the JW's to remove all the filters and get as accurate a model of reality as I can. One thing that I can say is that it's not easy but, in my opinion, it makes life worth living.