Yes take home flowers and give her a kiss and a big hug. You sound like a very caring and loving husband.
Keep us posted.
ITHINKISEE: The SH*T hit the fan last night. (Update!)
by ithinkisee 89 Replies latest members private
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Mecurious?
Man, this stupid firewall prevents me doing some things here, I always have to turn it off before I am able to format things correctly!
M'
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rebel8
She said several things that indicate she's tired of the religion issue (as the issue stood before your discussion). She said it in the politically correct manner of, "I'm worn out from taking the spiritual lead," but that's just doubletalk for, "I'm tired of keeping up this busy religious schedule when I know your heart isn't in it too..." and I wonder if she felt her heart wasn't in it either.
I agree, give her a nice card and maybe flowers, and let her be the one to bring it up next. What you said was great, just keep reiterating you are not leaving the family and are committed to improving communication. She is trying to see this as a you vs. her issue, which she has been conditioned to do, and you reiterating your support and emotional involvement will help break through that.
Good luck. PS- I've heard a lot of now ex-jws say they were just "taking a break" when they first left. It's true she can always return (and so can you) if you take a break to clear your mind. You could tell her you feel you both need a break to sort through these issues without the influence of the org, and if it's the truth, that will be obvious and you'll be back. It could even be a partial break such as decreasing meeting attendance, stopping FS, etc.
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Nathan Natas
Look, I don't want to fan the flames of discontent, but one thing just sticks out so blatantly -Your wife says she wants to to show some "spirituakl leadership."
You might ask her what that means to her, because it seems to me that she thinks that to be a spiritual leader of your family you have to be a Watchtower puppet, or "lead" by following her.
Her role as a "christian" wife is to submit to your headship - not to snipe at you for not "leading": her where she wanted to go. Where is her demonstration of "whither thou goest, I go, and the god you serve I serve"?
You have been doing the leading, even if you don't realize it yourself.
You have been scouting out the spiritual "lay of the land" in the Watchtower's "spiritual paradise," and you have found it wanting.
Rather than being a good little watchtower puppet, you have wrestled with angels in your attempt to find the real truth. And how can there be a greater value than TRUTH? (Not "trooth™") Who would dare to say that loyalty to a proven lie is more important than TRUTH?
You know what? You're not perfect - you're a "poor communicator" (whatever that means). WELCOME TO THE HUMAN RACE! You can get help and improve your communication skills, and I trust that you will, but you have been doing the leadership, and she's the one who wants to remain in Egypt, so to speak.
Do you think that this is going to end with the dissolution of your marriage?
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Check_Your_Premises
Yeah, I think Nathan is on to something... he usually is.
You and her have been conditioned to assume that the jw hold the moral high ground on all matters. By leaving you are exercising your CONSCIENCE. You are leaving not out of a desire to do wrong, but rather to do right. To seek truth.
Don't let her lay this on you that you are some kind of bad guy in all this. Don't ever give the moral high ground to a dub. Always put it back on them.
Be understanding, communicative, and sensitive....
...But don't put up with any wt crap either.
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Cygnus
I don't mean to hijack your thread but I have just about all the old Houglass2 Outpost archives on CD-ROM, thanks to my old friend Joe Malik, and I'm still very limited as to the # of posts I am alloted every "day" (that is, whatever the board's software considers a day t be). Here's a post I made a long time ago:
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Posted by Cygnus [Cygnus] on May 27, 2000 at 11:49:56 {FWFBGNMqK2QJT5uADyEML4bdfUTIaI}:
For those who have an interest, last night was my appeal hearing. I went. I did not bring a recording device -- I had not lied to the elders at any of their visits or meetings with me, and I wasn't about to do it just to tape this meeting.
The chairman of the appeal committee was an old friend of my father's, a well respected elder in this area. I knew him pretty well, of course. The second in the committee was a fellow I had seen around and heard speak. Nice enough guy, but not too bright. The third was the jerk. Every committee has the one jerk. This guy added nothing to the hearing except comments designed to humiliate me, or attempts to trap me into admitting further wrongdoing. He even questioned my fidelity towards my wife on a number of occasions.
The highlights of the evening basically consisted of me questioning why the official PR web site says one thing, and in practice JWs do another. I was informed that the "so-called web site" is not the elders' authority on matter. I was also informed that over two years is not long enough for me to have been considered "inactive" enough to not pose a threat to the congregation. 2 John 9-11 was read occasionally, to which I responded that the text could be used against almost any person we meet on the street. I also gave my opinion that that particular scriptural passage was one of the angriest in the Bible. The chairman replied that perhaps God is angry at me, and that in ancient times he expressed that anger by killing lots of people. I was reminded often of how I made a "vow" to be a Jehovah's Witness, and that I was breaking that vow, and must suffer the consequences of being a "hypocrite." I was told in no uncertain terms that a person cannot simply walk away from being a baptized member of Jehovah's Witnesses. The evening ended with me comparing their actions with that of Hitler (he felt justified in rooting out the undesirables). They didn't 'appreciate the implication,' to which I said, "Well, fascism is fascism." :-)
Anyway, needless to say the decision was upheld. Big deal. I mostly wanted the experience to see what would happen and how the elders deal with such matters, first hand. One thing they neglected to inform me of was that I have the opportunity to voice my allegations of a mistrial to the appeal committee, which they would forward to the branch office. Tomorrow morning (early tomorrow morning) I'll be planning on calling the chairman of the appeal committee to get an address for the letter to be sent.
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Here's YK's.e-watchman's response:
Posted by / You Know [youknow] on May 27, 2000 at 12:48:02 {FWFBGNMqK2AYR8x5bCrcTdF7cq9GRI}:
In Reply to: Appeal hearing posted by Cygnus on May 27, 2000 at 11:49:56:
***Every committee has the one jerk***
No doubt the unforunate elders who have had to suffer through your judicial proceedings would all agree that there was always one jerk present at the hearings. / You Know.
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He's sure changed his tune since he himself got DF'd 2 months ago I'll be willing to bet.
Sorry again for hijacking your thread, Ithink.
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Check_Your_Premises
Or think of it another way. She has lamented your lack of leadership. Keep expressing how this is a manifestation of your leadership. You are leading. Don't stop telling her that.
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cruzanheart
cook her a good dinner
ONLY IF YOU KNOW HOW TO COOK!!! And clean up afterwards.
Nina
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daystar
ithinkisee
For what it's worth, you are in my thoughts for the tough time ahead of you. I hope you can both make it out more or less intact, I really do.
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GetBusyLiving
Your wife sounds like a nice reasonable woman. I wish you the best man. Getting out of the witnesses can be tough.
GBL